L6 Powercab 112+ is the real deal

[Sixstring]

I don't know that you see a wedge offering anytime soon. It has the kickstand legs which work really well for aiming like a wedge. For $200 dollar difference, the plus seems like a no-brainer to me. The ability to have presets and remove the cab block from the modeler to free up CPU is worth the price of admission for me.

I don't see it at all really I was merely saying that it would be a nice add!. The whole kickstand on a cab thing never looked right to me. But one of those for the back line and a wedge type up front to monitor would be cool!

If and when my local GC starts stocking these I will give one a try to make a real judgment call as some of the YT demos don't sound very good.

 

[yeky83]

I'm trying to wrap my head around this product, Line 6 states that this unit uses "speaker modeling" not cabinet modeling unless you are using a loaded IR. Is that correct? Can someone please explain how speaker modeling works?

"Speaker modeling" uses "tone matching IRs" to convert its own 12" woofer into other speakers. Powercab's 12" woofer will have one response, and a V30 will have another response, and the tonematch IR will "make up the difference" if you will. Different than your usual IR but using IRs nonetheless, just very specific IRs.

If you have a modeler that has the ability to load Ir’s though already I don’t see it adding that much over just having a powered FR speaker.

To their credit, it simulates guitar speakers rather than just load IRs through them. The speaker modeling is most likely done through IRs, but very specific "tone matching" IRs.
It's for that "amp in the room" thing. Not what I'm interested in either, I prefer an FRFR, but it is unique and not like a usual FRFR and an IR.

 

[yeky83]

My first thought and question on the speaker modeling is how authentic it is, specifically how accurate does the green model sound like an actual greenback in a 1X12 cab and so on with all of the models. Also, I would guess that they are limited to 1X12 renditions for their speaker modeling.

Another thing to consider. Even if they were completely successful in accurately modeling speakers, they're represented in one particular cab design. In order for you to enjoy the Powercab, you'd have to like the tone of the particular cab they used. E.g. I like open back cabs for "amp in the room," and the Powercab is never going to sound and feel like an open back cab.

 

[muudrock]

Another use that sounded good was using this with a loaded down amp. I used the Powercab with my BE 50 and the Xload. Tried it in IR mode and Speaker modeling mode and both sounded good although I only really liked 2 of the speaker models. It really is a cool product, and could be a fantastic solution if it was developed a little further on the speaker modeling part. Either way, I dig it. For the meantime still gigging with the Friedman ACM, but will give this a shot in that environment soon.

 

[InsideOut]

Another thing to consider. Even if they were completely successful in accurately modeling speakers, they're represented in one particular cab design. In order for you to enjoy the Powercab, you'd have to like the tone of the particular cab they used. E.g. I like open back cabs for "amp in the room," and the Powercab is never going to sound and feel like an open back cab.

That's only partially true. If the only thing you use is the modeled speakers, then yes. But you can use your own IR's to get the sound you want. I think the key difference people are missing is that the speaker is built like a guitar speaker (thin cone paper etc) vs. a PA speaker. They respond differently. A guitar speaker has an immediacy and thunk (for lack of a better term) that a PA speaker just doesn't have. I suck at explaining things (obviously). It's like trying to describe the taste of a banana.

I didn't post my OP to try to convince anyone to change to this if the are happy with what they have. There's just a lot of people who are struggling to find the right solution, and I think this is a homerun for me. It doesn't affect me either way if you like it or not.

 

[BBN]

This does sound like a nice way to get more out of an AX8 specifically.
If you can just load your IRs in to the Line6, you've freed up space for more effects in the AX8.
That's pretty cool.

 

[InsideOut]

This does sound like a nice way to get more out of an AX8 specifically.
If you can just load your IRs in to the Line6, you've freed up space for more effects in the AX8.
That's pretty cool.

Exactly! For the II and III it's really not an issue, but the AX8 it's significant.

 

[MikeD]

I'm curious as to how the FR mode sound of the Powercab+ (with both woofer and tweeter on) compares to a CLR. The CLR is a lot more expensive than the PC+ where I am. I'm wondering if this unit could bring any missing flavor to what I am using now.
I look forward to any opinions/views as I wait for one to come in to my local shop so I can try it for myself.

 

[yeky83]

That's only partially true. If the only thing you use is the modeled speakers, then yes. But you can use your own IR's to get the sound you want.

The only reason someone would use the Powercab vs. other FRFR types should be to use the modeled speakers. For using your own IRs, the Powercab is likely a compromise.

I think the key difference people are missing is that the speaker is built like a guitar speaker (thin cone paper etc) vs. a PA speaker. They respond differently. A guitar speaker has an immediacy and thunk (for lack of a better term) that a PA speaker just doesn't have.

A guitar speaker is not more immediate and thumpy than a PA speaker. A guitar speaker is slower and has less bass extension than your average PA speaker.

The thin cone results in "speaker breakup," which results in the characteristic peaks and valleys in frequency response usually around 2 kHz and above.

And again, because the Powercab is made with a thin cone, it's likely a compromise for strictly FRFR use. If you don't like the sound of the modeled speakers of the Powercab, you're likely better served by other FRFRs.

 

[InsideOut]

And again, because the Powercab is made with a thin cone, it's likely a compromise for strictly FRFR use. If you don't like the sound of the modeled speakers of the Powercab, you're likely better served by other FRFRs.

This is from your experience using the powercab? People are likely better served by trying different things and seeing what they like. I tried making a positive review of a new product that really impressed me, and the majority of the comments coming back seem to be people who what never used the product telling me I don't know what I'm hearing. Priceless. I guess I'll turn in my 35 years of playing because it hasn't done anything to help me know what a guitar sounds like.

 

[BBN]

. For using your own IRs, the Powercab is likely a compromise.

How so?

 

[yeky83]

This is from your experience using the powercab? People are likely better served by trying different things and seeing what they like. I tried making a positive review of a new product that really impressed me, and the majority of the comments coming back seem to be people who what never used the product telling me I don't know what I'm hearing. Priceless. I guess I'll turn in my 35 years of playing because it hasn't done anything to help me know what a guitar sounds like.

No, I haven't tried the Powercab nor am I trying to discount your positive experience with it. I'm not telling you that you don't know what you're hearing. I'm glad it works for you, and there's no need to get offended.

I'm merely saying that a thin-coned guitar speaker has a poor bass and treble response compared to PA speakers. And because of this, the FRFR function of the Powercab will necessarily be a compromise compared to purpose built FRFRs. Bass will not extend as far and as flat, and mid/treble will be more jagged.

Case in point, many have asked Line 6 if the Powercab in FRFR mode is OK to be used with a bass. Line 6 has answered basically "you can, it won't hurt, but it's not great" or something of the sort. Contrast this to many FRFR makers whose market happens to be bass players, like Barefaced, AudioKinesis, GreenBoy, Accugroove, etc.

 

[yeky83]

How so?

I thought I made it pretty clear in my post... but I guess not. Please read above.

 

[lqdsnddist]

I guess I'll turn in my 35 years of playing because it hasn't done anything to help me know what a guitar sounds like.

I’m not suggesting your wrong, or your perceptions aren’t accurate/valid, but I will say in my experience as an audiologist, the longer guys have been playing generally correlated to lessened hearing acuity.

If someone spent a few decades touring in the era of 100 watt stacks they’ve probably dialing in their rig with a lot more high end these days because things have otherwise gotten so muffled. People with normal hearing thresholds listen and think it’s ice pick city.

Again not saying anyone is “wrong” but simply that when we are dealing with sound and tones, we may all be hearing things differently, for better or worse, and as a result two people can have very different perceptions of the exact same tone.

 

[RDH]

This is from your experience using the powercab? People are likely better served by trying different things and seeing what they like. I tried making a positive review of a new product that really impressed me, and the majority of the comments coming back seem to be people who what never used the product telling me I don't know what I'm hearing. Priceless. I guess I'll turn in my 35 years of playing because it hasn't done anything to help me know what a guitar sounds like.

Musicians ( Especially Guitar players) tend to get pretty opinionated and stuck on inside the box opinions (ex: tube amps for one ) . Don't allow public or general opinion to discount what works for you. If it sounds good and works well, use it and don't worry about what others think. I've struggle with questioning myself because of what others think for years, till I realized I'm doing this to please the paying audience ,and if they're happy with it so am I.

 

[RDH]

Actually I'm not much of a Line 6 fan,. I've used several of their products in the past and never worked for me. However I've been waiting for an actual review from someone on these powercabs because they seem make a lot of sense. I currently am using CLR's after trying most of the other FR solutions. Haven't thrilled me as a backline only solution though. Love them for FR. These cabs caught my interest and I'll probably try one for myself.
Thanks a bunch for the review!!

 

[bke]

Been waiting to see what anyone using a fractal product thought of the powercab. Asked above but how accurate are them speaker models. Would playing this set to a v30 sound/feel like playing a 112wil a v30 etc?

Also, when playing a guitar speaker at lower volume you generally need to push it a little to make it sound decent, how does the powercab perform at low volume? Love playing amps through regular cabs but don’t get to as often as I’d like due to volume constraints and less satisfactory results at lower volume. (Using fractal load through irs works really well though!!)

 

[yeky83]

Also, when playing a guitar speaker at lower volume you generally need to push it a little to make it sound decent, how does the powercab perform at low volume? Love playing amps through regular cabs but don’t get to as often as I’d like due to volume constraints and less satisfactory results at lower volume.

According to Line 6's answer to this question on another forum, it'll behave the same as any regular cab in low volume situations. They haven't done any trickery to make it sound better at low volumes, for authenti. If you feel that you need to push a guitar cab a little to make it sound decent, you'll likely need to push the Powercab too.

 

[Musicroom]

Thank You for the review Insideout! I’m very interested to learn everything I can about the powercab! Shopping FRFR’s right now and hope to make the right buying decision with all the offerings available to choose from. The powercab may be the right choice for me as well.

 

[InsideOut]

Thank You for the review Insideout! I’m very interested to learn everything I can about the powercab! Shopping FRFR’s right now and hope to make the right buying decision with all the offerings available to choose from. The powercab may be the right choice for me as well.

Glad to help. I've used quite a few low to mid level powered PA monitors with the Axefx std, II and now AX8. Everything from Mackie, JBL (several models) QSC, Carvin, original Atomic powered cab. Most have sounded good, but none have made me giddy like the powercab. I've never been able to try the high end powered speakers like XiTone, new Atomic or others, so I can't speak about them. I can say that using the powercab, for clean, high gain and everything in between, it sounds and feels like a guitar cab behind me, and then when I switch to piezo, it's full range makes it sounds like a sweet acoustic. It's the perfect solution for me. Moving the IR's from the AX8 to the speaker is the icing on the cake. The tone and feel has been so inspiring, I'm having a hard time setting my guitar down to do other things... like talk to my family