John Petrucci AX FX II

maxdown said:
His recorded material tone is post produced and mastered - and, from comments made above, his live sound is using unknown routing and 'secret' elements as well as his own playing style mojo.

Go for your own tone is the best way or you'll be chasing your own tail methinks :)
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True, but you might have missed the main part of my post:

"Even more so, I would love to just know how Fractal did what they did. I have a Mark V with my own sounds. I would love to know who to model my Mark V in the Axe."

That is really what I'm interested in.

Thanks,
Brandon
 
But I assume they are using the same equipment I am. So I'm not changing the hardware or firmware. I'm just using the built in architecture that FAS set up for me. I assume they did the same. So, knowing how they did that I don't think would put me in competition. It is more so becoming a "power user" of the equipment. The only way that would make me competition is if people came to me to program their gear instead of FAS, which I highly doubt. :) Besides, even if that were to happen, that would only mean more sales for FAS. So, it is a win-win situation.

I'm just looking for hints to point me in that direction.

Thanks,
Brandon
 
bvaughn0402 said:
But I assume they are using the same equipment I am. So I'm not changing the hardware or firmware. I'm just using the built in architecture that FAS set up for me. I assume they did the same. So, knowing how they did that I don't think would put me in competition. It is more so becoming a "power user" of the equipment. The only way that would make me competition is if people came to me to program their gear instead of FAS, which I highly doubt. :) Besides, even if that were to happen, that would only mean more sales for FAS. So, it is a win-win situation.

I'm just looking for hints to point me in that direction.

Thanks,
Brandon
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why don't you just start with copping the dry amp tone from jp's website? you can use a mark iv or mark iic+ on the axe for most all tones. from there, add peq and/or geq as necessary. then you can start thinking about adding effects. keep it simple and you won't get overwhelmed right away. tweak deliberately and methodically and remember what you just did.

things i noted when i owned the mark v was that ch 1 was a more fender-oriented channel (fat ~ blackface, tweed ~ tweed) except for the regular clean mode: that is closer to the mark series clean. ch 2 is more like a british amp than any other mark series model ever got: edge ~ vox/marshall grit, crunch ~ plexi. i think that gets you in the ballpark. what you should probably try to do is actually use the amp models that the mark channels are trying to emulate (but can't cause it's too many things all at once with the same power train) rather than trying to use the mark models to try to get close to a mark v tone that is trying to emulate a real amp. i say skip the middle man, imho.

but, if you are strongly tied to getting the exact tone of the mark v itself--cause it's true it's not 100% identical tone or feel to the mark iic+ or iv--then you can use those models in the axe and use peq/geq + od as much as you can to try to home in on those tones. the nice thing about jp is that his settings are plain to see and he's very open about them on the amps themselves. you should be able to get very close with the ii due to the improved accuracy of the models. but remember that there's always component tolerances, so "8" on the drive knob of his exact amp may not be exactly "8" on the axe fx. fortunately you have better resolution & consistency using the axe fx. the ii should get you even better than the ultra, from what i read. i was already thoroughly happy with the ultra tones with mark settings, so you should have no problem on the ii.

gl!
 
bvaughn0402 said:
But I assume they are using the same equipment I am. So I'm not changing the hardware or firmware. I'm just using the built in architecture that FAS set up for me. I assume they did the same. So, knowing how they did that I don't think would put me in competition. It is more so becoming a "power user" of the equipment. The only way that would make me competition is if people came to me to program their gear instead of FAS, which I highly doubt. :) Besides, even if that were to happen, that would only mean more sales for FAS. So, it is a win-win situation.

I'm just looking for hints to point me in that direction.

Thanks,
Brandon
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Aha ... just worked something out Brandon .... I wasn't actually addressing your issue my first post - I was referring to the OP and those trying to get JP's custom presets. :) I've read your original post now :)

However, I still however think that there's no way you'd be allowed to model your own amp - there would probably be a need to be access to the main code to hook it in which would probably not be a cool idea. All the modelling amps out there seem to be reliant on firmware upgrading for new amps.

If FAS have developed presets with JP then they possibly have modelled a stock Mk V, so it could be imminent?

Your only other option is the 'profiling' amp which (someday if it gets released) can capture any amp. I'll be waiting for real world usage tests and reviews on that though!
 
He is not asking to model the MKV in the way that Cliff would model an amp in a firmware release but rather replicate the tone in the Axe-Fx. Which existing amp model eq etc. etc.

That's what I read anyway.
 
If Cliff has already modelled a Mark V, he will surely include the sim in a future update. However, I think that he just used a Mark IV or 2C+ and tweaked them till he replicated the V sound. Not that hard to do it yourself either, if you like tweaking and know a few things about the AFII advanced parameters that is...
 
would love a preset in the axe II that sounds like JP's tone on the new CD - track 3 'lost not forgotten' starting at 7:09. that is some sweet tone going on right there!!!
 
Cliff, any insights on this? Was the actual amp modeled? Or were existing amp models used to "model" the V? If the later, I would be curious the general direction took to model various things.

By the way, thanks everyone for your great suggestions above. Greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Brandon
 
bvaughn0402 said:
In the latest edition of Guitar World, there is an interview with Petrucci. He doesn't mention the Axe II, but does say that during the recording of the album that he used the Axe to do all the demos. He mentions that the Axe guys came and modeled his Boogie Mark V so that he would have an easy way to record the demos. For the actual album, he switched back to the actual Mark V, although there is one part that ended up on the album that came straight from the demos (and thus Axe).
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...And the hunt is on! Can the haters and unbelievers agree upon the correct Axe track amongst all of the mic'd Mark V tracks, thereby demonstrating that, like in The Princess and the Pea, pristine ears cannot ignore the telltale digital hiss? Or will they come up empty in their search, thereby demonstrating that the Axe has rendered all analog amps obsolete for all time, The End? Or will everyone forget about it and just enjoy the music? Stay tuned! Many exciting online forum-based flame wars to come!
 
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This topic is turning out great guy I'm really enjoying this but cliff has yet to answer how the axe II is used in his a rig? And if it's jus something he's using to try out?
 
bvaughn0402 said:
Cliff, any insights on this? Was the actual amp modeled? Or were existing amp models used to "model" the V? If the later, I would be curious the general direction took to model various things.

By the way, thanks everyone for your great suggestions above. Greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Brandon
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I seriously doubt they made a model just for JP then didn't include it in the II publicly. They probably tweaked existing models to get the desired result.
 
aaronv84 said:
This topic is turning out great guy I'm really enjoying this but cliff has yet to answer how the axe II is used in his a rig? And if it's jus something he's using to try out?
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since Matt does most of the Artist rigs for Fractal and Matt said this:
"All the above aside, I find it to be a good habit to not talk pro details, simply out of respect. "

you are probably not going to get a lot of info.


They have said that the Ultra was integrated into his A and B rig. The II is probably replacing those.
 
Clark Kent's EQ matching technique can give pretty decent results to nail a specific tone. All you need is a sample of the guitar tone you want (Mark V sound in this case, from a Dream Theater CD for example) and follow the instructions Clark gave in a thread recently.
I'd use a M IIC+ on the Axe and the resulting IR from the EQ matching operation.
 
Admin M@ said:
That is quite true about rig applicability.

You might also be surprised at the number of pro artists we work with, across all levels of prestige and ability, insist that their patches, setup details, etc. not be divulged. In some cases, artists have even prepared legal paperwork to this extent! This goes for those whose presets are 2 blocks in a Standard and also those who run the Axe-Fx II at 95% CPU. There are some who use the Axe-Fx in secret, and some who use it in a different way than their published comments suggest.

All the above aside, I find it to be a good habit to not talk pro details, simply out of respect.
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Well with this said I think it has to be respected and im going to leave it alone.
 
I can certainly respect the privacy of an artist who has patches that he does not want to share with the general public. I respect that setup details be kept private.

My question, though, for Matt/Cliff was more generic ... what exactly did they do with the Mark V? And asking for any type of advice for how to take the sounds of my Mark V and bring them over into the Axe. I'm not asking for Petrucci's exact patches, schematics, etc. I have a Mark V sitting in my room. I would like the ability to record MY sounds using the Axe. The only similarity with Petrucci is that we are dealing with the same amp and same problem.

I was just hoping that the Axe guys might shed some light, while respecting Petrucci's privacy.

Thanks again to everyone who has chimed in with suggestions on where to start. Without FAS chiming in, it helps greatly. Just wish FAS would say something. :(

Thanks,
Brandon
 
John has stated in a couple of interviews that he only uses the axe fx for effects(specifically delays) and gets all of his tones from the Mesa Boogie Mark 5.
 
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mrbearme said:
Clark Kent's EQ matching technique can give pretty decent results to nail a specific tone. All you need is a sample of the guitar tone you want (Mark V sound in this case, from a Dream Theater CD for example) and follow the instructions Clark gave in a thread recently.
I'd use a M IIC+ on the Axe and the resulting IR from the EQ matching operation.
Click to expand...

It was super easy to replicate the count of tuscany / best of times solo tone this way (on my standard), using the disc set that comes with isolated tracks as a reference. Actually, listening to the isolated tracks showed how much delay petrucci uses - its crazy - reminds me of what I did when i first bought an fx unit.. geeeez!! I captured the IR using the ridiculously wet signal then minused at least 7dB from the delay block level.

Cant you copy your own amp tone by "re-amping"? There are heaps of threads on that topic here. Also, there are guys here that analyse equipment to replicate on their axe, like DonPeterson.. I think he analyses the actual waveform to replicate different fuzz distortions.
 
mrbearme said:
Clark Kent's EQ matching technique can give pretty decent results to nail a specific tone. All you need is a sample of the guitar tone you want (Mark V sound in this case, from a Dream Theater CD for example) and follow the instructions Clark gave in a thread recently.
I'd use a M IIC+ on the Axe and the resulting IR from the EQ matching operation.
Click to expand...

It was super easy to replicate the count of tuscany / best of times solo tone this way (on my standard), using the disc set that comes with isolated tracks as a reference. Actually, listening to the isolated tracks showed how much delay petrucci uses - its crazy - reminds me of what I did when i first bought an fx unit.. geeeez!! I captured the IR using the ridiculously wet signal then minused at least 7dB from the delay block level.

Cant you copy your own amp tone by "re-amping"? There are heaps of threads on that topic here. Also, there are guys here that analyse equipment to replicate on their axe, like DonPeterson.. I think he analyses the actual waveform to replicate different fuzz distortions.
 
iamdunker said:
John has stated in a couple of interviews that he only uses the axe fx for effects(specifically delays) and gets all of his tones from the Mesa Boogie Mark 5.
Click to expand...

For live playing, yes. What I was referring to is what he mentioned in the last Guitar World:

"Actually, that's a scratch track that was from my original demos. I'm using a Fractal Audio Axe-FX, which is what I used for all of the writing and demoing. The guys at Fractal came down and modeled my Mark V, so that when I was writing I could tap into a bank in the Axe-Fx and just go direct. It was really easy to write and record with. When we did the album, that's when I miked up the amp."

Thanks,
Brandon
 
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