GR-55 Guitar Modeling + Axe FX Amp Modeling & Effects = Perfect Combination?

I have a VG-99 but I only got my Ultra last week so haven't had much chance to experiment with it.

I use my VG-99 with a Godin LGXT synth access guitar using the 13pin cable, I have tried running a normal cable to the Ultra at the same time and them just blending the outputs in my mixing desk - still early days yet but the results seem promising.


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Big Vern. . . that looks pretty interesting, and I'm curious to hear how your experimentation goes.

What kind of shelf do you have your VG-99 sitting on, and how is it attached?

Terry.
 
steadystate said:
The VG-99 also has USB audio in/out, which allows me to reamp with the Ultra much as I would if I had the Axe II. Too bad Roland's product support and maintenance are so pathetic.
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Just wondering how you hook it all up which inputs outputs etc?, sounds like a great way to do things and get relatively easy re-amping capabilities from the Ultra.
 
rickgk said:
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Just wondering how you hook it all up which inputs outputs etc?, sounds like a great way to do things and get relatively easy re-amping capabilities from the Ultra.
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Obviously, the guitar will connect to the VG input via the 13-pin cable. I connect the VG's analog main outs (left and right) to the Ultra's rear Input 1 jacks. I then connect the Ultra's Output 1 jacks to my computer/DAW audio interface. I connect the VG to the computer via USB.

Recording:
The VG allows you to set the point at which the signal is sent to the computer via USB. It can be sent straight from your raw normal pickups, one or both of the COSM guitar outs, the final output (same as what is sent to the Ultra via the VG analog main outs), among other choices. So as you record, you can monitor the Ultra's outputs (or record them if you wish) while your DAW can get a signal from the VG USB out and record any of the forementioned signals to a track.

Playback for reamping:
During playback of the track recorded via the VG USB, the VG USB can inject the recorded track into the VG at various points as mentioned above. The limitation is that you can only insert it after the guitar/pickup modeling section (since this needs the 13-pin signal). So if you want to reamp a modeled guitar, you must set the VG USB to send the modeled guitar to the computer via USB in the step above.

Example: I set the VG to send the raw normal pickup to the computer via USB, and record that signal on a track while I monitor the output of the Ultra (and record it on other tracks if desired). I can then play the raw pickup track back and have it sent via USB to the VG's main out, which sends it to the Ultra. The Ultra's output can then be recorded (reamping the raw pickup signal) to tracks on the computer.

I don't know if this is possible using the digital ins and outs of both units. It's quiet enough for me using the above method.
 
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Wow i think iv'e got my head around that, it really does allow quite some options then.

At the moment i am axe-less (waiting for a 2) so i'm thinking of getting something to tide me over, at the moment i am using scuffham amps software which is great but limited as far as options, I was going to get a podhd300 so i could get some pedal fx options into the front end of the scuffham software but the VG or GR would give me that plus guitar modelling, seems like the way to go.
 
The main issue with the modeling for me is that each string can sometimes differ in timbre from the other strings, so that each string sounds like it is from a different instrument. This is more true for wound strings than plain strings. Careful adjustment of the GK parameters (not necessarily following Roland's instructions) can minimize this. I have a Les Paul with two good humbuckers and a GK. I can match the models of all three pickup switch positions to the real ones close enough such that very few if any audience members would notice.

The models do not sound as good as the real deal, but, they are close enough to allow a wide variety of tones with a single guitar. For example, I gig with two guitars (one for backup). I *really* don't want to carry any more than that to gigs. Both are dual humbucker. I swapped the neck pickup in both of them for a Sustaniac. The Sustainiac basically sacrifices your neck pickup (and middle switch position as well). So, for a bridge humbucker tone, I use the real pickup. For middle and neck switch positions, I use the model. They are very usable when adjusted properly. I wouldn't use them to record, but for live, they are just fine.

Then consider that I can get close to the tone of a Strat (especially the 2nd and 4th switch positions), a Danelectro, a Rick, a Tele, an ES-335, an L-4, etc. Again, they don't sound exactly like the real thing, but they sound much closer than if I used a standard humbucker on a solid body guitar.

The acoustic sims are OK, but at best sound like a pickup on an acoustic. They do not sound like a miced guitar. But again, they sound way better than using my gig guitars.

Finally, the open tunings and 12-string sims are great. You can even create a 12-string with an altered tuning (Traveling Riverside Blues style).

Modeling pickups is a difficult, if not impossible task to do correctly. Jay Mitchell had a great post a long time ago discussing the difficulties from a physics point of view. IIRC, the characteristics of the model would have to change depending on where the string is fretted. I can't recall the details, but would love to read the explaination again.
 
Tone Seeker said:
Big Vern. . . that looks pretty interesting, and I'm curious to hear how your experimentation goes.

What kind of shelf do you have your VG-99 sitting on, and how is it attached?

Terry.
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I've got it fixed to one of these:

Racktray 1U Sliding at Studiospares

Its mounted using the dedicated mounting screws in the underside of the VG-99, the shelf above the VG-99 is the same just mounted upside down (ideal for laptop when using the editors for the axe or the VG)
 
rickgk said:
Wow i think iv'e got my head around that, it really does allow quite some options then.

At the moment i am axe-less (waiting for a 2) so i'm thinking of getting something to tide me over, at the moment i am using scuffham amps software which is great but limited as far as options, I was going to get a podhd300 so i could get some pedal fx options into the front end of the scuffham software but the VG or GR would give me that plus guitar modelling, seems like the way to go.
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Are you aware of anyone that has stock of the GR in AU (preferably Melbourne ;)) ?
 
or8ital said:
On the GR-55 you can setup multiple guitars at the global level. At the patch level you can only set per string volume, not sensitivity.
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According to the GR-55 manual, it works just like the VG-99 in this respect. You can store 10 different GK settings ("sets", which include sensitivity), and tell the unit to use them on a global or per-patch basis. With per-patch, each patch will specify which of the ten GK sets to use. You can then override the per-patch assignments by setting the GK sets from per-patch to global.
 
Well, I've been reading and reading and reading posts all over the place regarding the VG-99 and the Gr-55. I could care less about effects, I just want 1. Alt tuning on the fly. 2. Synth sounds and 3. guitar models. I hate carrying lots of gear to a gig.... I want something that will fit in my studio flyer along w/ my Axe-Fx and ONE guitar.

I tried out the VG-99 at Guitar Center yesterday. Well, between the cruddy customer service, wanna-be metal shredder blasting through some cheap amp, and the cruddy amp (6" speaker??) and headphones they gave me I didn't get a very good representation. I went through about every patch, though, and I thought 95% of them sounded like crap. ....very cheap, artificial, and unresponsive.... sigh.... I was hoping I would like it. I'm now leaning toward a Line 6 JTV Variax, but nowhere to try it in the Portland, OR area yet. Not sure I will like the feel.... probably have to have it professionally set up either way, and maybe swap in some higher quality magnetic pickups.

Anyone have the new Variax?
Does the newer Gr-55 sound better than the antiquated VG-99?
Is there another solution besides these 3 devices that makes any sense?
 
sivadyert said:
Well, I've been reading and reading and reading posts all over the place regarding the VG-99 and the Gr-55. I could care less about effects, I just want 1. Alt tuning on the fly. 2. Synth sounds and 3. guitar models. I hate carrying lots of gear to a gig.... I want something that will fit in my studio flyer along w/ my Axe-Fx and ONE guitar.

I tried out the VG-99 at Guitar Center yesterday. Well, between the cruddy customer service, wanna-be metal shredder blasting through some cheap amp, and the cruddy amp (6" speaker??) and headphones they gave me I didn't get a very good representation. I went through about every patch, though, and I thought 95% of them sounded like crap. ....very cheap, artificial, and unresponsive.... sigh.... I was hoping I would like it. I'm now leaning toward a Line 6 JTV Variax, but nowhere to try it in the Portland, OR area yet. Not sure I will like the feel.... probably have to have it professionally set up either way, and maybe swap in some higher quality magnetic pickups.

Anyone have the new Variax?
Does the newer Gr-55 sound better than the antiquated VG-99?
Is there another solution besides these 3 devices that makes any sense?
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I actually own all 3; an Axe Fx Ultra, an FC-300, & a GR-55-
The presets with very few exceptions are a terrible representation of what the VG-99 is capable of- it's actually incredibly powerful & versatile with or without a hex-pickup installed. I've used it since it's debut and am still finding new combinations and possibilities-I'm constantly struck how changeable & refineable it is.. It's a milestone in guitar technology that has a small dedicated cult I'm proud to be a member of. The Axe-Fx Ultra is an astonishing milestone in itself with it's next Gen approach to Amp & Cabinet modeling. I've found them to be remarkable companion devices. The challenge I'm confronting now is how to use my FC-300 as a simultaneous footswitch for both.
My experience with the GR-55 is still too early to be definitive. I just downloaded a user-made Mac editor that I'm excited about. Both the VG-99 and Axe-FX have excellent Mac editors that have sped up my programming workflow considerably. I found a lot of the GR-55 guitar presets unconvincing the way you found the '99's, but having had ongoing positive results with my 99, I'm convinced I can get it to go to places the 99 & Axe-FX don't go
 
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sivadyert said:
Anyone have the new Variax?
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I have a JTV-69, and I was a Roland Synth user from way back. I still use a GR-33 as a tone module for sequencing, because I am too cheap to get a keyboard. The Variax is interesting. I really like it through the clean patches. I am not quite as sold on it for med to hi gain. There is something a little bizarre about the overtones of some of the patches the gets augmented by the distortion, and it loses more definition than traditional mag pick ups under the same gain. But to be honest, I've only had it for a week and a half so haven't given it a fair shake yet.
 
I just sold my GR-33 after getting the 55 back from repair, the tracking is far better on this unit I have two Roland-strats and find them better than the Godin I had.My main use for it is as a keyboard substitute for live work and in this role it is fine, the sax patches are very expressive,piano better than the 33,although the banjo is not there yet,nice flute sound that does forever autumn
a treat, as always with Roland,they go steps forward but drop something useful from the frame,no pedal-steel preset on 55,
 
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