Gigging Cover FRFR Guys???

What the heck volume does that control? I know its controller 35-36, does that bypass the output volume knobs on the front of the unit?
No, it changes the level of the Scene you're currently on by 1db... it doesn't affect any of the other controls or levels. So if your preset is at a good level but you need more lead boost on say Scene 2, you can boost it that way. If you don't use Scenes it'll just boost the preset in whatever state it's in - but note that it also saves, so it will save with whatever fx you have on/off at that moment.

Back to OT, I also have a smaller set of core tones that I use for the majority of songs - a mid-gain Vox, heavy Recto, and a pretty crunchy 800 cover about 2/3 of our songs. Then I have specific presets for songs that either have a unique sound or need special fx.

Remember that you can also take the same preset and copy it to different locations so you have the same core tone, but different fx or secondary tones for various parts - this way you still have that same consistent tone across more songs.
 
I guess it depends on quite a few things as to which process will work best. Our band has about 70 songs or so we kinda rotate in and out and are constantly adding and removing songs depending upon the response they get. Our singer also likes to call audible's to the set list based upon how the show is going which means less is more from a preset perspective.
 
No, it changes the level of the Scene you're currently on by 1db... it doesn't affect any of the other controls or levels. So if your preset is at a good level but you need more lead boost on say Scene 2, you can boost it that way. If you don't use Scenes it'll just boost the preset in whatever state it's in - but note that it also saves, so it will save with whatever fx you have on/off at that moment.

Back to OT, I also have a smaller set of core tones that I use for the majority of songs - a mid-gain Vox, heavy Recto, and a pretty crunchy 800 cover about 2/3 of our songs. Then I have specific presets for songs that either have a unique sound or need special fx.

Remember that you can also take the same preset and copy it to different locations so you have the same core tone, but different fx or secondary tones for various parts - this way you still have that same consistent tone across more songs.

Ok thank you. I do Presets and scenes. I never looked in output after changing a scene to see the actual change. I also copy presets and re tweak as needed. Thanks for the input.
 
core tones that can cover everything. I played 4 hour sets in Nashville with 2 amps, DC30 and Friedman Smallbox. I don't like trying to sound exactly like every album tone and don't like hearing bands that do...it's jarring to hear 60 different guitar tones. If you're a tribute band it's on thing, if you're a cover band cover the song but don't be afraid to sound like you.
 
Thanks Man. Any suggestions on that ray gun effect I was thinking maybe a synth into pitch shifter into a sequencer controlled by expression pedal? Ahhhh the hours I can waste. Then again I may just do some cut and paste for a sample.

I just use the synth into a delay controlled by a momentary switch. Works great. I've attached my Rebel Yell preset if you want to have a play. There's 3 scenes, Scene 1 is Rhythm, Scene 2 is for the breakdown and Scene 4 is for the lead.

Enjoy!
 

Attachments

  • Rebel Yell.syx
    12.6 KB · Views: 25
I guess it depends on quite a few things as to which process will work best. Our band has about 70 songs or so we kinda rotate in and out and are constantly adding and removing songs depending upon the response they get. Our singer also likes to call audible's to the set list based upon how the show is going which means less is more from a preset perspective.
I have the same issue. My method of dealing with it is to have a printed list of which preset(s) is associated with each song, in alphabetical song order (ignoring any "The" prefixes in the titles). Over time, I've committed most of it to memory. My MIDI controller (Gordius LG2) allows direct selection of any preset (no need to scroll through banks). Without that feature, I'd have a real problem.
 
I’m getting pretty proficient with dialing stuff in. Some stuff is just like “what in the holly hell did they do there” takes a bit longer. I have already dialed everything in for all the songs. pretty spot on I might add. Credit where credit is due……. I have used a “few” not many presets from the exchange. Now I get to go and re tweak everything! Whole reason for me buying an Axe FX was to have all the tools you could ever need in one box.

The "fun" will start when an update wrecks all of your patches you spent months creating. It's fun though, could be doing worse things with your time no?
 
My 2 cents would be that you should try to dail in your sounds to fit in with the guys that you're playing with, not trying to copy every single tone on the records. As others have said, it just sounds weird with to many changes to the core amp tone. One has to remember that every guitar tone on a record is mixed to fit in with that particular ensemble, player, song and era.
 
Last edited:
Based on that list, I'd go with 4 tones - super clean with chorus as needed, plexi crunch with OD as needed (this patch should clean up when you roll back your guitar volume, 80s Marshall tone (Friedman, JCM8000, Silver Jubilee) with OD as needed, and a modern high gain (I'm partial to Diezel and Bogner here but Fractal's got a lot of options).

I played in a couple bands like that in the last several years with the Axe-FX and that is precisely what I did. I actually had 5 patches - one had a crazy amount of effects for just one song. Right now I'm in two bands - one is a Stones tribute and I use one patch all night, the other is a rock cover band and I use a few patches but I'm adding synth stuff so most of my effort is spent there because the AX8 guitar tones are all set.
 
Another thought, I actually like hearing bands do covers with their own twist including the bands core tone. If you try to do it exact as far as every little detail it can sound like you're trying to hard and not being yourselves. I know many people will disagree but just a thought.
 
Been gigging covers for 20 years. No way I would ever try to recreate every record/tone.
I use maybe 3 presets every night.
- Clean (with X/Y Amp) that flips from FAS Clean to Vox for a little grit
- Dirty (with a Scene change for a boost with delay for solo)
- Dirty-er (with a Scene change for a boost with delay for solo).

All my patches have a row of stomp box style effects, ready when I need them (Wah/Chorus/Phase/Wammy/etc.)

Unless you are in a tribute act and trying to nail that guitarist's tone, you are crazy if you think anyone is going to notice if you went from a perfect 'Crossfade tone', to the perfect 'Drowning Pool tone'.
 
I have been gigging for a long time in a number of cover bands, and I do fill in work as well. I play anything from Green Day to Stevie Wonder. Queen to Garth Brooks. Run DMC to Journey. In other words, anything and everything with a thousand tones.

I used to try to recreate the album tone exactly. What I found was that approach makes life miserable for the sound guy. The drums and the bass stray pretty consistent all night, as do the vocal mics. My job is to find a few tones that work and fit in the MIX. The keys change around a lot, so I have to consider that too, but we play well enough together to each find our space.

I use 5 basic tones, with increasing levels of distortion from spanky clean, to breakup, to crunch, to heavy, to soaring lead. I use 3 amps, 2 cabs (stereo - same 2 all night) and some OD pedals. I recreate the sound of the song by using effects. A chorus, phaser, and the right delay do 90% of the work there, and in the mix I sound amazingly like the song even though the base tone is only an estimate of the original.

I do have some SPECIAL songs where I do something outside of that... but I try to avoid that if I can. (Example: I use a real talk box for Livin on a Prayer. I use the vocoder for 24K Magic and CA Love. Stuff like that)

In the end, the audience is really happy. My sound guy is happy. I am happy, and I save a TON of headache for the both of us.
 
I do have some SPECIAL songs where I do something outside of that... but I try to avoid that if I can. (Example: I use a real talk box for Livin on a Prayer. I use the vocoder for 24K Magic and CA Love. Stuff like that)

Talk to me about how you use the Vocoder for 24k and Cali Love?
Aux feed from your mixer (for your mic)? Or are you doing it all inside the box.

By the way, I agree with your points around making it easier for the sound guy, and likely your band mates as well because they likely all have you in their monitors.
 
I started with 3 or 4 "Swiss Army Knife" presets and used those as a starting point for creating individual presets for each song. Over time, I've made minor tweaks to them as appropriate for the song (different chorus model, increase/decrease gain, swap out the cab, etc.) Some songs have required pretty significant departures from those basic presets, but I'd say 90% of my presets are pretty similar to each other.

In addition to using the VU meter on the front panel, one thing that helped me with setting volume levels on each preset in a live situation is to add a dual external footswitch that's set up to increase/decrease the volume 1dB per step. I'm not at my AFX right now so I can't offer specifics, but there's a pair of parameters that will adjust the output volume (and save it) on the fly. Hopefully someone else can chime in with more specifics about it. After two or three gigs, I get everything balanced and no longer need the switches until the next time I do a major firmware update or add multiple new presets to the stack.
 
In addition to using the VU meter on the front panel, one thing that helped me with setting volume levels on each preset in a live situation is to add a dual external footswitch that's set up to increase/decrease the volume 1dB per step. I'm not at my AFX right now so I can't offer specifics, but there's a pair of parameters that will adjust the output volume (and save it) on the fly. Hopefully someone else can chime in with more specifics about it. After two or three gigs, I get everything balanced and no longer need the switches until the next time I do a major firmware update or add multiple new presets to the stack.

It's Midi CC 35 (Volume Increase) and 36 (Volume Decrease): https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=MIDI.
 
All valid points well taken. This group has its own PA all Line 6 powered front end with Line 6 StageScape M20d mixer, no monitors all in ear aside from a hotspot for the drummer for vocals. They use their PA for 90% of the gigs they have. I know I cant change the tone of all the other instruments to match the cd version of the song but if time permitted and lots of practices I could dial the PA in as well. Never gonna happen but it could. I'm that guy thats just not happy unless I can damn near nail everything, hence spending the bucks on an Axe FX II XL+, MFC-101, 3 expression pedals. on and on.

Sure wish that volume increase/decrease was assignable to other things not just the scene output. I would prefer to have it assigned to the amp block mixer level. I try to keep output flat 0.0 and do most the the adjusting between X/Y and two amps across scenes before I have to adjust output. But will give it a go at our next practice.

Today I have a chance to setup and play through my amp and cabs and try to get stuff leveled out across songs at stage volume. Wish me luck, or not.
 
I agree that duplicating tones exactly can cause potential issues. One album can have a drastically different spectral balance from another. My method is to first duplicate the tone as closely as possible to the record with special attention to the fine-grained equalization (IRs and Tonematching), then use broader coarse eq (PEQ) to bring the tones to a common center ground so they sit well with the rest of my band during the course of the show. The "character" of the original tone is preserved by IR/Tonematch, but each tone still fits in the mix.

I find using a preset/scene for each and every tone extremely satisfying. And not everyone will notice, but some will and do. That is also extremely satisfying. It's a matter of personal opinion and choice, meaning there is no wrong or right way. For me, using a small group of generic tones would be torture. I'd rather go back to my cubicle.
 
Last edited:
I agree that duplicating tones exactly can cause potential issues. One album can have a drastically different spectral balance from another. My method is to first duplicate the tone as closely as possible to the record with special attention to the fine-grained equalization (IRs and Tonematching), then use broader coarse eq (PEQ) to bring the tones to a common center ground so they sit well with the rest of my band during the course of the show. The "character" of the original tone is preserved by IR/Tonematch, but each tone still fits in the mix.

I find using a preset/scene for each and every tone extremely satisfying. And not everyone will notice, but some will and do. That is also extremely satisfying. It's a matter of personal opinion and choice, meaning there is no wrong or right way. For me, using a small group of generic tones would be torture. I'd rather go back to my cubicle.
You're like my brother from another mother...:cool:

There's always a few people that notice (mostly musicians from other bands). I love the "I thought it was the Jukebox" comments.
 
I agree that duplicating tones exactly can cause potential issues. One album can have a drastically different spectral balance from another. My method is to first duplicate the tone as closely as possible to the record with special attention to the fine-grained equalization (IRs and Tonematching), then use broader coarse eq (PEQ) to bring the tones to a common center ground so they sit well with the rest of my band during the course of the show. The "character" of the original tone is preserved by IR/Tonematch, but each tone still fits in the mix.

I find using a preset/scene for each and every tone extremely satisfying. And not everyone will notice, but some will and do.

In my experience no one will notice. Normal people are not paying attention to guitar tones., And as has been said, a constantly shifting guitar tone that shifts throughout the mix can actually be jarring.

In my experience what do audiences pay attention to:
- The singer. He or she will get most of the attention, unless you're covering Pink Floyd, or some other guitar heavy band.
- That you play things right. I'll be far more likely to notice if you playing things differently, or wrong, then your guitar tone.
- The feel of the performance. Does the band play like the original, has its own interesting dynamic, or just stands there like a bunch of statues.
- The choice in songs. The right combination of songs will matter a 100x more then nailing every detail correctly.

But in the end, what I've noticed above all is that music is like a text that has lots of spelling errors. As long as the words are still recognizable people will still be able to read them. Similarly, if you play a song that people will recognize, people will fill in the blank spots with their minds. That's why people can still enjoy a cover band that plays shitty, but puts on a great show, and a band that play the best original music will often play for tumbleweeds. The power of recognition matters.
 
I use 7 core amps, and use the correct effects to fit the songs. Truth is if you get the basics down, no one in the audience will give a hoot if you tone matched each song. Heck when I listen to a band I don't care if it's matched per song. It's more about the performance.
 
Back
Top Bottom