Front panel poll

[unix-guy]

The answer to that seems to a pretty clear no.

By who's definition? I don't personally agree...

 

[Bruce Sokolovic]

1) Agreed

2) No, it isn’t. Your castle/your rules, but in a unbiased survey it would be inappropriate to assume the preferences of non-responders.

But they responded. They aren’t using the front panel enough to warrant an opinion either way.

My car is entirely touch screen. Yes there’s a way to bang around the options with controls, but I dont use it enough to care about any updates to it, ever. Therefore, I’d prefer they’d focus RnD elsewhere.

Same with these folks. They aren’t using the front panel enough to care. It’s safe to assume they use axe edit. It’s also safe to assume they’d prefer Axe Edit get the attention, or the hardware itself in way of feature sets and organizational attributes.

 

[Bruce Sokolovic]

Note that polls might not account for FM3/FM9 users as not everyone reads all the forums.

Entirely different users, feature sets, expectations and needs. May as well poll how to grow the best tomatoes and reference that as well.

 

[Casimir]

I think the front panel is generally pretty good. The first 5 minutes using it were a little rough, but once you get the feel for it, it's a breeze. I love the performance views, those are pretty clutch. My one critique, I wish cab selection was a little easier from the front panel.

 

[Infuseguitar]

I don’t use the front panel because edit is much faster. I wish I could run edit on my iPad via bluetooth.

 

[yeky83]

I bring up the Edit button because it's an easy to understand example: "I need to remember to press this button A to do the same thing button B does everywhere else" as a form of inconsistency in the way the UI works. It's not rocket science and does not mean people can't work with it. Condescending comments are not helpful.

Fractal could add a menu option that reverses the Edit/Enter functions in Layout grid. Let the users choose which they feel works better for them.

That would render customer support and interaction between users impossible lol. “Press the Enter button for that, but first go deep inside the menu and check that the Enter is Enter. Yeah, you do need to press Enter to go into the menu and it might be the Edit button, uh… good luck.”

And your complaint is that there’s too many small “need to remember” items, and your solution is to add a small “need to remember” menu option? And it’s not your first time to suggest such things lol, I just don’t get it.

 

[MJS68]

I always use the front panel, so it's fine as is. The only time my laptop is hooked up to it is for updates.

 

[Justincase]

I bet this chick can use the UI

 

[yyz67]

I'm also honestly surprised how many people use the front panel as a primary interface.

Why? Practically all guitar gear (since forever) hasn't needed a computer. A lot of us like physical interfaces.

If we all agree that the II is a "pro" piece of gear, I feel like a pro use case would be working out patches ahead of time (using Axe-Edit) and then using a foot controller live for most control. That would make the front panel basically a backup interface, which gets back to the question of how good does it need to be?

Agreed that performing users would need it configured ahead of time, but plenty of "pro" gear has a primary physical interface (screen, buttons, knobs...).

 

[yoitsmegabe]

Front panel user here. When I first started, my instinct was to push the value wheel as an enter button to select things and to push it in to edit a block. Once I learned the actual sequence of button presses it's been smooth sailing. I only use axe edit if I'm recording ideas because my unit is away from the PC.

I just wish the presets weren't 3 pages to the right. Maybe have the presets one page to the left so you can get to them more quickly.

 

[yyz67]

When I first started, my instinct was to push the value wheel as an enter button to select things and to push it in to edit a block.

Agreed!

I suspect it would be relatively simple to support a global option to do that, as well as double-press for editing previous block in grid. This would be awesome.

 

[Stratoblaster]

Lots of banter about the front panel in recent weeks....I have to wonder...what, specifically, would be the exact issues/features users would like fixed/added to the front panel UI? I personally find it very efficient and intuitive, but that's just me....am curious as to, precisely, what users percieve to be 'is wrong' with it.

 

[yyz67]

Lots of banter about the front panel in recent weeks....I have to wonder...what, specifically, would be the exact issues/features users would like fixed/added to the front panel UI? I personally find it very efficient and intuitive, but that's just me....am curious as to, precisely, what users percieve to be 'is wrong' with it.

A number of them in this thread. There's probably also a UI wish thread, but if not, someone should pull them together! (I'm too lazy).

 

[laxu]

That would render customer support and interaction between users impossible lol. “Press the Enter button for that, but first go deep inside the menu and check that the Enter is Enter. Yeah, you do need to press Enter to go into the menu and it might be the Edit button, uh… good luck.”

And your complaint is that there’s too many small “need to remember” items, and your solution is to add a small “need to remember” menu option? And it’s not your first time to suggest such things lol, I just don’t get it.

Solution is to add a menu option that reverses the function of two buttons in one particular view. It's a set and forget and users who would need help with that would most likely not have changed the default.

I'd rather just have the functionality in Layout view reversed with no option added but if someone prefers the current solution for some reason then providing an option serves both users' needs.

 

[laxu]

Entirely different users, feature sets, expectations and needs. May as well poll how to grow the best tomatoes and reference that as well.

I disagree. The only real difference is form factor, DSP capabilities and the intended placement of the unit. For the user experience using the onboard UI the only relevant difference is that the FM units are difficult to read when on the floor because of the small home screen text. A longrunning wishlist item in itself that I hope Fractal solves after they get FW 5/2 out for the FM series.

Lots of banter about the front panel in recent weeks....I have to wonder...what, specifically, would be the exact issues/features users would like fixed/added to the front panel UI? I personally find it very efficient and intuitive, but that's just me....am curious as to, precisely, what users percieve to be 'is wrong' with it.

My main issues with the onboard UI are all software and I've done plenty of wishlist threads for them already.

For next gen Axe-Fx, the closer they can get the front panel to operate like Axe-Edit the better. At this point I would probably prefer Fractal abandoned their front panel UI (excluding volume controls) and went all in on computer, tablet and phone versions of Axe-Edit. The current gen is largely designed to not be any larger than the Axe-Fx 3's 3U rack form factor - and for good reason, I don't think anyone wants massive rack units and increasing the display size would mean a 4U rack most likely.

Or maybe a separate controller unit with a touchscreen and a set of knobs because physical controls are nice. I would take just better MIDI knob controller integration too.

 

[Watt McCo]

At this point I would probably prefer Fractal abandoned their front panel UI (excluding volume controls) and went all in on computer,

If only individual users that don't like the front panel UI could choose to do that with this generation of units...

 

[laxu]

If only individual users that don't like the front panel UI could choose to do that with this generation of units...

If you want to haul a laptop around sure you can. Anything else will give a subpar experience because Axe-Edit won't work nicely with touchscreens, there is no official tablet/phone app (and Fracpad has its own share of issues), MIDI knob controller integration does not work well etc.

I feel like a lot of small improvements would make the front panel UI more intuitive and faster to work with but Fractal's focus is 99.9% on other stuff. I get that they can't do everything but if they could bring in just a bit more onboard UI improvements for each major firmware update, that would do a lot for the overall onboard UI user experience, which to me is the weakest link of the Fractal system at the moment.

The major UI improvements the onboard UI needs to me are setlists for presets and larger Home view layout for the FM3/9 so it's easier to read on the floor. The minor stuff is things that take relatively little time to develop and test and there's plenty to choose from in wishlist forums. They add convenience more thank anything.

As an example, a minor thing would be something like cab list filters letting you rotate the C button back/forward to toggle filters back/forward. Now the only option is pushing C to cycle them, which works but is inconvenient if you want to go between 1x12s and 4x12s for example as you need to loop all around the list to do so.

Another minor thing would be only showing cab list filters that can return results. If a cab bank doesn't have 1x10 cabs, why show the 1x10 filter at all? This is an easy to do memoized filter list that can be built once for factory cabs at least.

 

[skolacki]

Yes the onboard UI's block/row/column system is rather overcomplicated. In general the feature most commonly used is "move block to another spot". This should be a process that looks like this:

1. Go to "Arrange blocks" page.
2. Select the block you want to move with nav keys or big knob.
3. Click Enter to pick it up.
4. Use nav keys/big knob to move it where you want.
5. Click Enter to drop it in place.
6. If there is something else already in that spot either replace it or swap their positions. The current functionality of swap is perhaps better because you don't lose that block's settings.

Rows vs columns could work like that too and having separate functions for moving back/forward/up/down is just bad design, no questions about it. It's a "this is how it's easiest to do in terms of programming" feature rather than "this is how it is easiest for the user to operate".

Axe-Edit is massively better for these tasks so it's not a big issue since I expect majority of users build their grid layout in Axe-Edit and then just do tweaks to the block settings from onboard UI when needed.

For next gen Axe-Fx it might be better for Fractal to just abandon the front panel UI in favor of having robust computer, phone and tablet editors. Just have some knobs for input/output levels on the front panel and plenty of I/O in the back like it has right now. Axe-Edit is a great software.

I’m on the FM3. I have only 1 problem with the front panel. Occasionally I miss key and get stuck on the move blocks page. Doesn’t seem to be a direct way to cancel pending actions and go directly back to the main screen. I always manage to get out of it but afterwards I never seem to remember how I did it. I use the panel quite a bit for tweaking but rarely for building an entire preset. The performance page is good for that. Overall I’m satisfied with the local UI.

 

[Jesse]

By who's definition? I don't personally agree...

I realize this is anecdotal, but a significant percentage of users don't find moving between the front panel and Axe-Edit to be intuitive, based on comments made in this thread and elsewhere.

Why? Practically all guitar gear (since forever) hasn't needed a computer. A lot of us like physical interfaces.


Agreed that performing users would need it configured ahead of time, but plenty of "pro" gear has a primary physical interface (screen, buttons, knobs...).

It also used to be completely normal to operate your TV by walking across the room and pressing buttons and twisting knobs on it. There are still buttons on my current TV but the people designing the UI are going to assume that isn't meant to be the primary interface. Interfacing with old rack gear through the front panel seems like more of a consequence of there being no ubiquitous, cheap laptops at the time rather than a purposeful choice.

But you hit on something that I hadn't considered, which is that there are lots of people who are used to that old gear and simply like that workflow.

 

[H3O2]

Option to stay on Utilities screen when changing or modifying a preset in Axe Edit. I like to sit on the "ACD Levels" page.