dual amps no gap

[DaveO]

Here's a quick and dirty one that uses scene 1 for a clean Super Reverb and scene 2 for a 100W Jumped Plexi.

Edit: Added the FM9 version converted using FracTool.

So to chime in, I loaded both of these up in my FM9 the "Dual Amps No Gap(FM9).syx" for some unknown reason both amps defaulted to bassguy59 and the verb mix was set to zero so no sound was making its way to out1 initially, however the "Dual Amps No Gap.syx" worked as expected, I really like the fender "Super Verb Vibrato" amp that ones a keeper for me, thanks for the tip! coming off the AX8 and FM3 I never had the ability to use dual amps so my first patches I built were in series but I'm going to use the parallel for dual amps and speakers going forward. for anyone else wondering about this, scene switching is a must for gapless patch changes not only amp types but other block types as well, my only request to fas would to increase the channels to 8 letters i.e. a through h.

 

[BCy2k]

I've been searching through the forums on the topic of gapless scene switching and just wanted to make sure I'm understanding things correctly.

It's necessary to use two amp blocks, and the amps you want to switch gap free need to be placed on the same channel. From there you can make a scene with both amp blocks in series (thanks to the new firmware) and put a clean amp on amp block 1, channel A, and a dirtier amp sound on amp block 2, also on channel A. In one scene amp block 1 is on, with amp block 2 bypassed for the clean sound. For the dirty sound set scene 2 to have amp block 2 on (dirty sound) and amp block 1 (clean sound) bypassed. In other words, each amp block is essentially functioning as a single channel amp in order to have gapless switching because once you want to change channels within either amp block via scene switching, there will usually be a small gap. Correct?

I'm also learning about the multiplexer (and block mixer) and how they can be used in a similar way to select grid rows when the amp blocks are placed in parallel. Still, you're choosing between one of two sound between the two amp blocks with the desired amps on the same channel. I gather it's not possible to get 4 channels of gapless sound switching between two amp blocks, but it's possible as long as you don't switch channels and treat each amp block as a single channel.

I'm wondering if there are any tricks or strategies to get a 3rd, or 4th channel of gapless amp switching between two amp blocks? I'm somewhat familiar with using scene controllers on some of my presets, and I understand how I could assign a foot switch to toggle through all 4 amp block channels. When I tried this it's did seem to have a gap. Am I correct that when changing amp channels it's a given there's going to be a gap?

 

[GlennO]

I'm wondering if there are any tricks or strategies to get a 3rd, or 4th channel of gapless amp switching between two amp blocks? I'm somewhat familiar with using scene controllers on some of my presets, and I understand how I could assign a foot switch to toggle through all 4 amp block channels. When I tried this it's did seem to have a gap. Am I correct that when changing amp channels it's a given there's going to be a gap?

To completely avoid the gap, you need to completely avoid amp block channel switching. To get a 3rd or 4th tone without amp block channel switching, see the advice I mentioned above about using scene controllers to adjust amp block parameters or drive blocks to add boost/distortion. That way you can use scenes to get a a 3rd or 4th amp tone without amp block channel switching.

 

[unix-guy]

I've been searching through the forums on the topic of gapless scene switching and just wanted to make sure I'm understanding things correctly.

It's necessary to use two amp blocks, and the amps you want to switch gap free need to be placed on the same channel. From there you can make a scene with both amp blocks in series (thanks to the new firmware) and put a clean amp on amp block 1, channel A, and a dirtier amp sound on amp block 2, also on channel A. In one scene amp block 1 is on, with amp block 2 bypassed for the clean sound. For the dirty sound set scene 2 to have amp block 2 on (dirty sound) and amp block 1 (clean sound) bypassed. In other words, each amp block is essentially functioning as a single channel amp in order to have gapless switching because once you want to change channels within either amp block via scene switching, there will usually be a small gap. Correct?

I'm also learning about the multiplexer (and block mixer) and how they can be used in a similar way to select grid rows when the amp blocks are placed in parallel. Still, you're choosing between one of two sound between the two amp blocks with the desired amps on the same channel. I gather it's not possible to get 4 channels of gapless sound switching between two amp blocks, but it's possible as long as you don't switch channels and treat each amp block as a single channel.

I'm wondering if there are any tricks or strategies to get a 3rd, or 4th channel of gapless amp switching between two amp blocks? I'm somewhat familiar with using scene controllers on some of my presets, and I understand how I could assign a foot switch to toggle through all 4 amp block channels. When I tried this it's did seem to have a gap. Am I correct that when changing amp channels it's a given there's going to be a gap?

Both Amp blocks don't need to be on the same channel... But you want to avoid changing channels on either amp block during scene changes.

Amp 1 could be on A and Amp 2 could be on C... That doesn't matter...

 

[Joe Bfstplk]

I've been searching through the forums on the topic of gapless scene switching and just wanted to make sure I'm understanding things correctly.

It's necessary to use two amp blocks, and the amps you want to switch gap free need to be placed on the same channel. From there you can make a scene with both amp blocks in series (thanks to the new firmware) and put a clean amp on amp block 1, channel A, and a dirtier amp sound on amp block 2, also on channel A. In one scene amp block 1 is on, with amp block 2 bypassed for the clean sound. For the dirty sound set scene 2 to have amp block 2 on (dirty sound) and amp block 1 (clean sound) bypassed. In other words, each amp block is essentially functioning as a single channel amp in order to have gapless switching because once you want to change channels within either amp block via scene switching, there will usually be a small gap. Correct?

Sort-of. The idea is to switch amp blocks to switch sounds rather than to switch a single amp block's channel to get there. Which channel each is on is not important - just that the amp you are currently listening to does not have its channel switched.

I'm also learning about the multiplexer (and block mixer) and how they can be used in a similar way to select grid rows when the amp blocks are placed in parallel. Still, you're choosing between one of two sound between the two amp blocks with the desired amps on the same channel. I gather it's not possible to get 4 channels of gapless sound switching between two amp blocks, but it's possible as long as you don't switch channels and treat each amp block as a single channel.

You can switch the channel of an amp block that you are not listening to without causing a gap.

I'm wondering if there are any tricks or strategies to get a 3rd, or 4th channel of gapless amp switching between two amp blocks? I'm somewhat familiar with using scene controllers on some of my presets, and I understand how I could assign a foot switch to toggle through all 4 amp block channels. When I tried this it's did seem to have a gap. Am I correct that when changing amp channels it's a given there's going to be a gap?

Yes. Channel change on active amp means gap.

Lots of tricks there, tho....

If you use Scenes in a more or less sequential manner (i.e., S1, S2, S3, S4, S5, etc.) to change amp block sounds, keep the channel of the amp block you're listening to the same and switch the other's channel to be ready for the next scene, when you'll switch to that amp block and switch channels on the amp block you just stopped listening to. Takes planning, but works nicely for per-song presets.

You can use a filter or drive block, or the amp block's built-in input boost - on a switch or controlled by a Scene Controller.

You could use a Scene Controller or Control Switch to bump up the input drive or other amp block gain/dirt control to a higher setting.

If you want random access, set up bypass on both amp blocks to listen to the same CS, but flip one's status settings so only one is on at a time. Then set up a channel switch per amp to be able to switch channels on the bypassed amp before swapping it in circuit. Three switches to do it, byt as much flexibility as can be had.

Use a pair of volpans in front of two parallel amp blocks to select which gets signal. (My fave trick....) Set up the volume so o e goes 0->10 while the other goes 10->1. If one amp is clean and the other dirty, set the clean amp's volpan taper to Linear and the dirty one to 30%, 20%, or whichever gives closest to an equal volume output throughout the range of the crossfade. Fade smooooooovely between amp sounds. Channel switch the amp you aren't currently listening to so it is on the channel you want when you switch to it.

Use a Multiplexer block after the two parallel amp blocks to select which you hear. Channel switch the amp you aren't currently listening to so it is on the channel you want when you switch to it. Mixer works too, but is better when switched thanwhen faded, as both amps are going full bore in front of it, and the ZIZZIES are audible way before everything else when crossfading if fading from clean to dirty.

There are probably more tricks, but my finger is tired.

 

[BCy2k]

Lots of tricks there, tho....

If you use Scenes in a more or less sequential manner (i.e., S1, S2, S3, S4, S5, etc.) to change amp block sounds, keep the channel of the amp block you're listening to the same and switch the other's channel to be ready for the next scene, when you'll switch to that amp block and switch channels on the amp block you just stopped listening to. Takes planning, but works nicely for per-song presets.

You can use a filter or drive block, or the amp block's built-in input boost - on a switch or controlled by a Scene Controller.

You could use a Scene Controller or Control Switch to bump up the input drive or other amp block gain/dirt control to a higher setting.

If you want random access, set up bypass on both amp blocks to listen to the same CS, but flip one's status settings so only one is on at a time. Then set up a channel switch per amp to be able to switch channels on the bypassed amp before swapping it in circuit. Three switches to do it, byt as much flexibility as can be had.

Use a pair of volpans in front of two parallel amp blocks to select which gets signal. (My fave trick....) Set up the volume so o e goes 0->10 while the other goes 10->1. If one amp is clean and the other dirty, set the clean amp's volpan taper to Linear and the dirty one to 30%, 20%, or whichever gives closest to an equal volume output throughout the range of the crossfade. Fade smooooooovely between amp sounds. Channel switch the amp you aren't currently listening to so it is on the channel you want when you switch to it.

Use a Multiplexer block after the two parallel amp blocks to select which you hear. Channel switch the amp you aren't currently listening to so it is on the channel you want when you switch to it. Mixer works too, but is better when switched thanwhen faded, as both amps are going full bore in front of it, and the ZIZZIES are audible way before everything else when crossfading if fading from clean to dirty.

There are probably more tricks, but my finger is tired.

Thanks everyone for your replies. This clears up several things for me. Also, these are some great ideas! I'm going to need to rethink a few things, but this is has been really helpful. Thanks so much for sharing.

 

[humpfrey]

Use a pair of volpans in front of two parallel amp blocks to select which gets signal. (My fave trick....) Set up the volume so o e goes 0->10 while the other goes 10->1. If one amp is clean and the other dirty, set the clean amp's volpan taper to Linear and the dirty one to 30%, 20%, or whichever gives closest to an equal volume output throughout the range of the crossfade. Fade smooooooovely between amp sounds. Channel switch the amp you aren't currently listening to so it is on the channel you want when you switch to it.
best way in my eyes

 

[humpfrey]

that hasen't grown on my own cow dung. it's just a copy of what was explained her before by mr joe but anyway , best setup for playng crackless.
pedal up , rhythm , pedal down hot solo sound . usually i don't need more than 2 sounds per song , and if needed the sp1 has a switch , witch i can use also .

 

[Charlie Davidson]

Gapless switching

 

[humpfrey]

that's a very good way also but i prefer the solution with the volume blocks.

 

[metalgarth]

If you need switching between presets to be as fast as stomping a pedal, you have to get a Boss GT 100 or GT 1000 unit. The amp modeling is way behind Fractal's and possibly even Line 6's, but the switching speed is unreal. You have to look at it from their point of view. Boss is a pedal company so their floor processors are built to be like pedals. If there was a gap when stomping on your trusty Boss SUPER Over Drive would you even use it? So, their units are built from the ground up to be like multi switching pedal boards, with amp modeling realism losing out. If you are in a single guitar band playing songs with lots of changes to clean to high gain to boosted leads, the immediate switching is a godsend. If amp realism is more important than anything else, go Fractal.

 

[humpfrey]

i'm not stomping , i'm switching between the 2 amps and can fade (blend) in and out rhythm or solo sound . no need for a boss !
sp1 mission engineering , go and have a look

 

[BCy2k]

that's a very good way also but i prefer the solution with the volume blocks.

This cross fading between amp blocks approach is working out well for me and freeing up scenes for other things. It essentially adds a 2nd amp sound to each scene, which is huge actually. I can do a good bit more with fewer scenes, but I still have to anticipate gaps in some scene changes. I'm being fairly greedy trying to get as much as I can from a preset. Sometimes loading up all 4 channels on almost every block in the preset.

When experimenting with switches I hit a wall. I found myself wishing for a "toggle block" function, which of course does not exist outside the realm of scenes & control switches. I set up switches to scroll thru channels on each amp. Which I already do on some fx blocks, but I doubt I'm going to use this on the amp blocks for now as it over complicate things. Still experimenting.