Drive Block "Level" Question...

WERNER1

WERNER1

Inspired
So a lot of times I'll take a preset that has just a slight amount of what I call clean break up and then in Scene 2 I'll maybe add a Drive pedal,.. and in my "Real World" set ups I would turn the drive down on the pedal and crank the level up (Like using a Tube Screamer or SD-1 or something..) This would push the front of the amp nicely...

So doing this with the AX8, I do get a similar effect, but the Volume level jumps up pretty drastically - So the question is this:

1 - Is the "Level" knob in the Drive block supposed to be like the Level knob on an actual pedal,..or is it more of a master volume for that Block ?

2 - If it's suppose to be just like on an actual pedal, the what's the best way to lower the volume so that there's not such a large increase in volume of the preset? ( Change the volume slider on the Output/Scenes #2 or something,.. or how does the "Mix" come into play on the drive block?)

Sorry,.. probably over thinking it here.. :D
 
I find you have to add or subtract the amout of drive from the pedal to get the desired effect, just like in "the real world".
 
I don't know how the parameters were intended to react or interact with each other. I have found I need to set the Level pretty low, @3.0 to 3.5 for most models, to get 'unity' level with the amps. I've never really given much thought to trying to set up the AX8 (or FX8) effects like their 'real world' counterparts, I just set the parameters where they need to be to get the desired effect.

To provide an answer to your second question, set the 'Drive' to the desired level of gain and adjust the block's 'Level' to the desired volume. This may not be how the actual pedal works or would be set up but if it gives the same or desired result does it really matter?

EDIT: Changing the level with Scene Volumes increases the overall volume. Part of the effect I am presuming you're trying to get comes from increasing the level of the Drive itself.
 
The Level knob in the drive model acts like the Level (or Volume) knob on the real pedal, if the real pedal has one.
 
chris said:
You lower the drive level and it gets louder?
Click to expand...
Yes, in this application on the AX8 - In the real world (Depending on the pedal), you would be more around a unity gain or just a slight increase in volume - Again this is in conjunction with the Level knob/control being 3/4's or all the way up.
 
yek said:
The Level knob in the drive model acts like the Level (or Volume) knob on the real pedal, if the real pedal has one.
Click to expand...

Ok thanks! - So what's the best way to attenuate the volume on a scene where doing this creates too much of a volume increase, but you don't want to actually lower the Level of the drive block/pedal as it would take away from the desired effect?
 
Let me try and Clarify,.. I'm talking about when I go to change from say Scene 1 where I'm just using a relatively clean tone over to Scene Two where I'll have the Drive Block come on,.. "Typically" when that drive block comes on, the increase in the overall Preset Volume is pretty substancial. Now how I like to set my Drive Block up is to have the actual "Drive Knob/control" pulled almost all the way down or no more than say 25% depending on the Pedal. And then Crank up the "Level Knob/Control" to push the front of the Amp (THIS is where the increase in volume comes from typically) - So I'm not talking about decreasing the "Drive BLOCK Level",.. but the Drive "KNOB/Control" with in the Drive Block..... if that makes any sense?
 
WERNER1 said:
Let me try and Clarify,.. I'm talking about when I go to change from say Scene 1 where I'm just using a relatively clean tone over to Scene Two where I'll have the Drive Block come on,.. "Typically" when that drive block comes on, the increase in the overall Preset Volume is pretty substancial. Now how I like to set my Drive Block up is to have the actual "Drive Knob/control" pulled almost all the way down or no more than say 25% depending on the Pedal. And then Crank up the "Level Knob/Control" to push the front of the Amp (THIS is where the increase in volume comes from typically) - So I'm not talking about decreasing the "Drive BLOCK Level",.. but the Drive "KNOB/Control" with in the Drive Block..... if that makes any sense?
Click to expand...
This is what I gathered from your original post, sorry you felt the need to clarify.
When I first started using the FX8 I attempted to recreate the way I used my 'real world' pedals and quickly became frustrated. After a month or so I decided to take a new approach and look at the FX8 as it's own thing, as a tool. I went through all of the parameters of the effects I used most to gain an understanding of how they worked and reacted with each other.

I started tweaking the effects without worrying if the Drive volume needed to be set lower than the actual pedal or the mix of the Delay needed to be higher than it 'should' be. Once I did this, my experience with the FX8 became much more enjoyable and I was able to get it to do what I needed without feeling like I was fighting with it or beating my head try to force it to work like the 'real' pedal.

My experience with the FX8 has helped me tremendously with the AX8. Sure, I go to some of the amp models I've owned and am familiar with to compare them just to see how they sound and work. But when it comes to creating a preset, all previous experience with an amp's controls and how I used to set them goes out the window. I set the parameters where they need to be to create the tones/effects I need regardless of whether it makes sense to me or not.

Fractal has done an incredible job of creating great sounding, high quality amp models, cabinets and effects. They have come as close as they are capable of, creating authentic models that attempt to mimic the nuances of the controls and interaction with other parameters. At the end of the day though, they are still digital representations and entirely their own thing. As such I believe the amps, cabs and effects should be looked at as tools and not worry if they are exact clones.
 
WERNER1 said:
Let me try and Clarify,.. I'm talking about when I go to change from say Scene 1 where I'm just using a relatively clean tone over to Scene Two where I'll have the Drive Block come on,.. "Typically" when that drive block comes on, the increase in the overall Preset Volume is pretty substancial. Now how I like to set my Drive Block up is to have the actual "Drive Knob/control" pulled almost all the way down or no more than say 25% depending on the Pedal. And then Crank up the "Level Knob/Control" to push the front of the Amp (THIS is where the increase in volume comes from typically) - So I'm not talking about decreasing the "Drive BLOCK Level",.. but the Drive "KNOB/Control" with in the Drive Block..... if that makes any sense?
Click to expand...
I get it. Which amp model are you using for your clean amp?

 
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Here's today's moment of zen for you:
I am helping an artist this morning who asked me the exact opposite question:
"How come on the [real] amp a drive pedal makes it so much louder, but on the Fractal the extra volume seems to be absorbed?"

My guess is that in both cases it is a matter of gain staging and the amount of drive.
 
Admin M@ said:
Here's today's moment of zen for you:
I am helping an artist this morning who asked me the exact opposite question:
"How come on the [real] amp a drive pedal makes it so much louder, but on the Fractal the extra volume seems to be absorbed?"

My guess is that in both cases it is a matter of gain staging and the amount of drive.
Click to expand...

I've wondered the same thing, and assumed it was because I can never run real amps hot enough that they have no more clean headroom, whereas that is trivial with the AX8.
 
You can fix it by using the output or feedback comp in the amp block Power Amp Dynamics page. Turning up sag should help with this as well.
 
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