Wish DigiTech Mosaic Polyphonic 12-String Effect Pedal

[flash6]

I've had 12 string guitars. And I've had this pedal. I almost can't tell the difference in sound.

Somehow, this pedal produces the octave on the E, A, D, and G strings, and doubles the B and E strings, all the way up the neck. It's very convincing and fun.

My wish is to not need this pedal any more. Thanks!

 

[Jack Napalm]

I bet you could create a patch that would do this. Probably need both Pitch blocks, Vol/Pan block with a pitch follower, maybe two. There is probably some overlap in the notes that are played that would be both doubled and an octave higher. Probably higher up on the neck. Someone with more experience may know of a better way to do it without the Vol/Pan block.

 

[GlennO]

“Unique” is an overused word these days, but between the Drop, Freqout, and Mosaic, Digitech put out some unique pedals before they folded. I’ve tried reproducing all 3 on the AxrFX III, but haven’t quite been able to match the Digitech version of the latter two. The difficult part of emulating the Mosaic is detecting the string, not the pitch.

 

[simeon]

i managed to get a fairly convincing 12 string sound by using two pitch shifters. one set to +12 with the low cut all the way up and one set to doubling with the high cut all the way down. it wasn't great, but was vaguely usable buried in a mix. that was on the II, so it would probably sound terrific on the III with the new pitch detection. using the crossover is another way to split the frequencies, but there's always an overlap somewhere

 

[Jack Napalm]

i managed to get a fairly convincing 12 string sound by using two pitch shifters. one set to +12 with the low cut all the way up and one set to doubling with the high cut all the way down. it wasn't great, but was vaguely usable buried in a mix. that was on the II, so it would probably sound terrific on the III with the new pitch detection. using the crossover is another way to split the frequencies, but there's always an overlap somewhere

I hadn't thought about using the crossover. My main live patch uses a VOL block with a pitch follower that sends higher pitched sounds to a delay. That way when I'm playing the high notes get a little extra and chords don't. For the most part. Works great for some songs so I don't have to be near the footswitch to turn on the delay. There is a few ways to skin this I think. Certainly will be some crossover.

 

[jefferski]

I created one years ago on my II that was good enough that I ditched my Morpheus Capo pedal, but like everyone said there are tradeoffs because it can't tell whether you're on open strings or higher up the neck at the same pitch. I'm interested to see how the new pitch tracking works for this too.

+1 for having a dedicated effect or algorithm if there's a way to do it.

 

[flash6]

I bet you could create a patch that would do this. Probably need both Pitch blocks, Vol/Pan block with a pitch follower, maybe two. There is probably some overlap in the notes that are played that would be both doubled and an octave higher. Probably higher up on the neck. Someone with more experience may know of a better way to do it without the Vol/Pan block.

I've tried presets on Axe Exchange. No offense to those posters, but they're not as convincing as the Mosaic. The mosaic gets the 12 string jangle. And I've fooled around with it myself. My efforts fall waaaay short.

“Unique” is an overused word these days, but between the Drop, Freqout, and Mosaic, Digitech put out some unique pedals before they folded. I’ve tried reproducing all 3 on the AxrFX III, but haven’t quite been able to match the Digitech version of the latter two. The difficult part of emulating the Mosaic is detecting the string, not the pitch.

Boom

i managed to get a fairly convincing 12 string sound by using two pitch shifters. one set to +12 with the low cut all the way up and one set to doubling with the high cut all the way down. it wasn't great, but was vaguely usable buried in a mix. that was on the II, so it would probably sound terrific on the III with the new pitch detection. using the crossover is another way to split the frequencies, but there's always an overlap somewhere

The new pitch shifter is what inspired me to post today. If DigiTech can do it, FAS can do it better.

 

[simeon]

one set to +12 with the low cut all the way up and one set to doubling with the high cut all the way down.

typo - it's actually the reverse: +12 with high cut all the way down and doubling with low cut all the way up

 

[simeon]

i just tried with the crossover and it wasn't as good

 

[Admin M@]

The difficult part of emulating the Mosaic is detecting the string, not the pitch.

The mosaic doesn't detect the string. For proof of this, try it with a capo at the 7th fret. I think it's all about the creative use of filters. I am confident you can do this, @simeon

 

[CodePoet]

I was thinking of trying that out myself with crossovers/filters now that the new pitch shifting algorithms are out. If you don't worry too much about which strings pitch up and which double then I bet we can get something interesting in place.

On a similar pitch scenario...to mimic a bass playing along with his guitar, Johnny A splits his signal and runs one feed into a pitch block down an octave and sets it up with a bass amp and FX. Sounds pretty good - and probably even better now.

 

[flash6]

I experimented with crossovers, filters, and pitch blocks today, trying to get close to the Mosaic. I realized one thing: I suck with crossovers, filters and pitch blocks.

The attached preset is my best effort and it falls way short. I know the technology exists in the III, but like I said, I suck. Anyone else care to take a stab at it? @Admin M@

 

[Dave Merrill]

I tried a Flintstone-simple version, dual pitch with one voice +12, the other +9-ish. It's not a 12-string, not even a Mosaic, but it wasn't completely awful, surprisingly so.

 

[GlennO]

I had better luck not using crossovers and instead using parallel paths with filters that overlap quite a bit.

By far, the most effective thing I've found is to use a guitar with a 5 position switch where position two is a pair of single coil pickups out of phase. It's easy to get a good 12 string acoustic sound from that .

 

[flash6]

I had better luck not using crossovers and instead using parallel paths with filters that overlap quite a bit.

Yeah, crossovers didn't work well for me at all either. And I kinda thought they would.

 

[GlennO]

Try swapping your filter and pitch blocks. And maybe put a pitch block on your lower path with a slight detune. And put a mixer after all 3 paths so you can blend them.

 

[Moke]

I experimented with crossovers, filters, and pitch blocks today, trying to get close to the Mosaic. I realized one thing: I suck with crossovers, filters and pitch blocks.

The attached preset is my best effort and it falls way short. I know the technology exists in the III, but like I said, I suck. Anyone else care to take a stab at it? @Admin M@

Try this one out. Uses the Pitch Controller to cross-fade from an octave up to unison somewhere just below the 'B' string. Has some mild detuning via LFO 1 'A' and 'B'.

 

[flash6]

Try swapping your filter and pitch blocks. And maybe put a pitch block on your lower path with a slight detune. And put a mixer after all 3 paths so you can blend them.

I like the second pitch block idea. I've seen other presets do something similar and didn't get it until just now, but those paired strings need to be slightly off. Good thinking. I don't hear any difference when swapping the filter and pitch blocks. And the mixer is to offset the balance on the rows, creating space, right? I like it.

Try this one out. Uses the Pitch Controller to cross-fade from an octave up to unison somewhere just below the 'B' string. Has some mild detuning via LFO 1 'A' and 'B'.

That's freaking clever and sounds great. How'd you do that? (get those values to fluctuate)

 

[Moke]

That's freaking clever and sounds great. How'd you do that? (get those values to fluctuate)

Right-click on any parameter with a solid yellow dot (means that a modifier/controller is attached) at the bottom of the virtual knob. And look at the settings and what is happening when you play single notes around the open 'B' string.

LFO 1 is attached to the 'Detune' parameters with specific Min and Max values for some vibrato/detuning so that the harmonies aren't unnaturally stagnant.

I never played with the Mosaic pedal before. It this close to what is going on?

 

[GlennO]

Here's my attempt. This audio example was played on an Ibanez S2170, a shredding guitar if there ever was one.