Could use a little help from the guru's.

G

gibvictory

Inspired
I'm using a Roland Gr-55 synth. I have an Axe preset with scenes. One one scene I have the volume of a synth preset attached to an expression pedal via External 3 controlling the balance parameter in the FX loop which I'm using to send FOH out 1. I can then bring in the synth volume to FOH and my stage rig at the same time. I have guitar to front input (left) and the synth going into input 2 left. That seems to be the only way I can control only the synth separate from the guitar. Input 1 right is for piezo. That works fine as I need to bring in the synth via the expression pedal for that scene. On another scene I use a different synth preset but I want it to just come on without an external controller. Right now both synth presets are controlled by External 3. Can't figure out how to separate them. I fooled around with the min and max within the modifier but any adjustment on one affects the other. I can live with it but when I switch to the second synth preset it requires two actions. One step on my midi controller (LF +12) for the scene change and then step on the expression pedal to bring in the synth. The timing needs to be quicker than that. Unless I'm overlooking something scene controllers won't work in this situation. Before I used scenes it was just Axe preset changes. I set up one preset with the External controller engaged and another without. The gap with preset changes was not good either. With scenes the gaps are obviously less noticeable. Gain something lose something. Any ideas?
 
This brings up another question for me. Using the VU meter in the Utility menu, which is an awesome feature, I've set all my levels. The issue is the synth going to input 2 left. After setting the input level of the synth into the Axe I can't boost it's volume level near 0db on the VU meter. I can make up for it after the VU meter via the FX Loop level going to my rig and the output level on the grid to FOH. But now I'm doing it by ear. It seems to go straight to the FX Loop. Guitar is input 1 which is left also. I can adjust the amp level for that. I'm stumped.
 
a workaround is to ditch external 3 as synth level control and just have two scenes set up the same, but one without synth and one with. use the scene controller or bypass the fxl block to control turning it on or off for each scene.
 
Thanks Simeon. Not sure how that accomplishes what I'm trying to do. If I'm misunderstanding you please let me know. Scene 1 has an amp block for rhythm guitar and at some point in the song I have to fade in a synth patch. That feature has to stay. In scene 2 I have to come in with a solo, with very little time, that has a different amp block and different synth patch. The amp blocks are there, by the way, to help disguise some latency with the synth. I've been living with it as it has been the best I can come up with. Any other ideas welcome.
 
why are you running the synth through the axe? you can control the axe and a synth via midi with out both going threw the axe. I don't know much about the g-55 but it probably can send a command to the axe to volume down when you volume up the on board pedal. I tried this for kicks with my line 6 pod 500hd just set up the midii # for my volume control(pod mounted) to the axe in that preset and reversed the value commands axe got quiet in a fade as pod got louder in a fade.
 
Thanks paranoid. I am controlling synth patch changes with midi and synth audio out into the Axe. The issue is I'm using two synth patches inside one Axe preset with scenes. I do this for several songs with no problems. The exception with this one preset is I fade in the synth on one scene and in the next scene I need the synth to just be there. In order to fade in on the one scene I use External 3 to bring in the synth with an expression pedal. I switch to another synth patch in the next scene and I can't avoid the synth being controlled by External 3. So far, I either have both not controlled or both controlled. It's because I'm in the same preset in the Axe. I basically need a scene controller to do what I want to do. The GR55 is not the most user friendly piece of gear. I'll see if I can send a command from my pedalboard to the GR to get there.
 
gibvictory said:
Thanks paranoid. I am controlling synth patch changes with midi and synth audio out into the Axe. The issue is I'm using two synth patches inside one Axe preset with scenes. I do this for several songs with no problems. The exception with this one preset is I fade in the synth on one scene and in the next scene I need the synth to just be there. In order to fade in on the one scene I use External 3 to bring in the synth with an expression pedal. I switch to another synth patch in the next scene and I can't avoid the synth being controlled by External 3. So far, I either have both not controlled or both controlled. It's because I'm in the same preset in the Axe. I basically need a scene controller to do what I want to do. The GR55 is not the most user friendly piece of gear. I'll see if I can send a command from my pedalboard to the GR to get there.
Click to expand...
you are using the axe fx synth's and a gr-55? I guess I misunderstood I thought you had the guitar rhythm in axe and gr-55 passing through. can you use multiple similar patches instead of scenes so you can change the modifiers from one to the next? I guess not you loose the fade. or can you change the patch after the fade has been completed like during a drum fill or something?
 
do you have room in your preset for some mixer or volume blocks set up the fade with mixer blocks ext # 3(you can control more then 1 modifier at a time with ext #3) and then scene bypass them for full on synth! you may could use scene modifiers also(change the max min for the scene may over ride the ext value)? not sure if that would work or not.
 
Paranoid, I do use volume blocks in my presets. Although I may have been clumsy in the way I described it in the original post. Input 1 is guitar, input 1 right is piezo and input 2 left is the synth. I use the Vol blocks to direct them left or right. I've never used the mixer block. I fooled around with it once but it didn' t seem to do anything. I didn't stick with it long enough to figure out why. Not sure I understand you clearly. Can you elaborate?
 
in order to have the full on in scene 3 or what ever but have the volume fade in and out on scenes 1 and 2 or what ever put 2 volume or mixer blocks in parallel for each in put. use ext 3 on lets say the top ones for each channel to control volume for scene 1 and 2, then for scene 3 have them bypass and use a scene controller to set the lower ones for each channel which was bypassed while you were in scene 1 or 2. gonna be a little tight with 3 inputs to make it fit room wise and cpu wise but I am sure this will do what you are trying to accomplish. I am still trying to figure out why you run the synth through the axe though, I would think you would be able to control it separately with the midi controller.
 
top tip - if you want things to fade in and out while using scene controllers, just apply some damping where you have the scene controller attached to volume. if you want things to mute/unmute, don't worry about the scene controller, just bypass the volume block and make sure it's bypass mode is set to "mute"
 
He's using the FXL volume for ext 3 to do fade. You need to change that and use a volume block or mixer block after FXL to do same thing. If you assign ext 3 to the Volume block for your fade, then bypass the Volume block with bypass set to through it will fade on one scene and pass through full signal when bypassed.
Good luck


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Is the gr55 on the floor? Doesn't that have an expression pedal on it? Why not do the fade in with that?

If it is racked, I think Bill has you covered :)
 
The gr55 is racked. I don't think I'll have time over the weekend to to play with this. I do want to point out that I'm controlling the balance in the FX Loop, not the volume. I'm fading in the synth along with the existing guitar amp block.

A curious thing. With Vol blocks in front on the grid the volume parameter does nothing. Neither does the level. That is the case with any of the three inputs used. With the synth (input 2 left) any blocks in the grid have no effect until the FX Loop level controls. In all my other presets with synth this is not an issue. I use effects in the GR like reverb for example.

I'm at work and trying to respond quick and dirty. I'll take a closer look at all your responses after the weekend. If anything else comes to mind please post. Thanks
 
Scene 1 and 2 are the issue. I take back what I said about the volume and level control not working in the Vol block.

In scene 1 I have the balance control in FX Loop connected to External 3. Guitar is using input 1 left and synth input 2 left. Don't know how you would test this. The guitar signal is coming through the blocks on row three. I have guitar signal while I fade in the synth (organ). The balance control is only affecting the synth volume. Again, this works fine. In scene 2 I want to somehow just have the synth be there. Scene 3 and 4 are for another song. Scene 4 is also a synth patch which is also controlled by External 3 but it is not an issue in that song.
 

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Bill, I think I'm starting to understand after reading your post (#14) a few times. I'll give it a shot. Feel free to modify my preset if you wish.

Simeon, I'm not sure I understand you. The only level control that controls the synth is the one in the FX Loop and it's not controllable.. The synth is going straight from input 2 left to FX Loop. It's not passing through any of the blocks in the grid otherwise. I do much better with pictures. Perhaps the file above is helpful.
 
I'll take a look tonight. You need to find a way to control volume in a different way that allows the block controlling volume to be bypassed allowing both signals to pass full strength. You won't be able to solve it within the FX loop alone. If you can split the synth and guitar signal after the loop return into 2 volume blocks in parallel, you could control the volume of synth with Volume Blk 1 and ext 3, and have guitar split to different row into another Volume Blk. When you leave Volume Blk 1 active, you could control synth with expression pedal and blend with guitar signal. When you want synth on full, bypass Volume 1 Blk with bypass set to thru. Now, synth will be on full volume.
If you want Guitar on in same scene with synth on full volume leave Volume Blk 2 active and at full volume. If you don't want guitar in this scene, bypass Volume Blk 2 with bypass on mute.



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Okay, update.

Bill I put a Vol block after the FX Loop and followed your instructions and finally it works. Thanks to all that responded. It's remarkable what the Axe can do, the number of pieces of gear it replaces and the helpful community that has grown up around it. Thanks again.
 
Awesome! Glad I could help! This forum and guys like Chris, Yek and others have always me, happy to pitch in


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