Can The Standard Make This Patch?

D

DJD100

Power User
Hi, I'm wonder whether a standard can hack this patch (which roughly recreates my current tube rig)?

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev


(FX used in IA Mode etc)

b) Perhaps with both amps sharing a Cab?

Not sure if I need a Ultra or not, and would prefer to spend the minimum needed etc?

Thanks...

Doug
 
This really explains nothing.

Do you have a sound sample? Something quantifiable? This can do what you ask, but there may be a different way of getting it done in the Axe.

I've moved it to requests.
 
This is meant to be a technical question regarding CPU resources, and not a request for patch data.

What I need to know is whether a standard has enough CPU power to run that patch, or if the Ultra is needed?

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev

Two amps/cabs in parallel with the above fx being used in IA mode?

electronpirate said:
This really explains nothing.

Do you have a sound sample? Something quantifiable? This can do what you ask, but there may be a different way of getting it done in the Axe.

I've moved it to requests.
Click to expand...
 
Still doesn't help that much, since you can run alot of this in parallel, and avoid the REV-DEL-REV-DEL redundancy.

Also you have 2 amps there, which you want different tonal benefits from each...depending upon what you want from each amp, you can run them in parallel, or use an expression pedal to fade in between each, or you can choose a power amp section from whichever one sounds best to you. You can't think linearly about this...it's not apples to apples.

Get the Ultra is my suggestion. I'm not knocking, but you're sort of asking whether the Axe-FX can do 1 + 2 = 3, when we're talking:

math2.gif
 
Give the guy a break .. Seems to me that all he is really asking if anybody with a standard unit can dial up the patch and check out if it has enough resources as described.

To the OP - sorry I have an Ultra .. If you want I can try and dial it up for you the way you described and report back with the CPU percentage used might be useful for a rough estimate. Just pm me if you need to.

Mik.
 
DJD100 said:
Hi, I'm wonder whether a standard can hack this patch (which roughly recreates my current tube rig)?

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev


(FX used in IA Mode etc)

b) Perhaps with both amps sharing a Cab?

Not sure if I need a Ultra or not, and would prefer to spend the minimum needed etc?

Thanks...

Doug
Click to expand...

If you want to run both amps in series, I guess that either the Standard or the Ultra could do it, but why would you want to?

If you want to be able to A/B between the two amps and just have them both with the same pre and post effects, then I think you'd need to use 2 separate presets and switch between them.
But there's probably a way to use both amp sims within a single preset and use a CC to bypass one amp while activating the other, and visa versa. But I've never actually done anything like that myself.

As far as processing power in the Standard is concerned I don't think you have an issue. I.e. It should be fine. At most, you're only using 11 serial blocks and both the Stnd and the Ultra have 12 available. And you'd probably end up putting the 2 amps and cabs in parallel with each other anyway.
 
mik said:
Give the guy a break .. Seems to me that all he is really asking if anybody with a standard unit can dial up the patch and check out if it has enough resources as described.

To the OP - sorry I have an Ultra .. If you want I can try and dial it up for you the way you described and report back with the CPU percentage used might be useful for a rough estimate. Just pm me if you need to.

Mik.
Click to expand...

I'm really trying to help, but it just doesn't work the way that a normal rack/2 amp rig does, you have to figure out how that works. He has a chain that doesn't make a huge amount of sense in the Axe-FX world. It might in the regular amp chain, but it seems to me that he has alot of redundancy there that wouldn't be needed. What is the modifier for there? He could use the new Input CC to have trails if that's it.

I was really asking for clarification here, but you CAN'T put this off as a regular rig signal chain. He can do what he needs to do with both less AND more.
 
joegold said:
DJD100 said:
Hi, I'm wonder whether a standard can hack this patch (which roughly recreates my current tube rig)?

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev


(FX used in IA Mode etc)

b) Perhaps with both amps sharing a Cab?

Not sure if I need a Ultra or not, and would prefer to spend the minimum needed etc?

Thanks...

Doug
Click to expand...

If you want to run both amps in series, I guess that either the Standard or the Ultra could do it, but why would you want to?

If you want to be able to A/B between the two amps and just have them both with the same pre and post effects, then I think you'd need to use 2 separate presets and switch between them.
But there's probably a way to use both amp sims within a single preset and use a CC to bypass one amp while activating the other, and visa versa. But I've never actually done anything like that myself.

As far as processing power in the Standard is concerned I don't think you have an issue. I.e. It should be fine. At most, you're only using 11 serial blocks and both the Stnd and the Ultra have 12 available. And you'd probably end up putting the 2 amps and cabs in parallel with each other anyway.
Click to expand...

Actually you can have 20 or so in series w/ the send and return blocks. However, it will be tight w/ 2 amps block, a cab, 2 delays, 2 reverbs on the standard. I'm not sure if it would or not, it would be on the edge. Like it has been stated, there are ways to optimize that signal chain.

To Electronpirate - that is not a modifier he is talking about, it is Modulation (chorus, phaser, flanger, that sort of thing).
 
I think what he really wants is this, but I could be wrong:

Wah -> Boost/OD -> Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod

Wah -> Boost/OD -> AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic -> Delay - Rev

And he wants to be able to switch back and forth between them.
I'm guessing he runs two amps, with a switcher and separate effects in his present rig.

If I'm right, then he'll probably need 2 presets and there will be no processor problems at all.
The only problem with doing it using 2 presets is that seamless stombox on/off control of the individual effects becomes tricky, but doable.
Jay showed me that when using an External Controller assigned to the Bypass Mode parameter, rather than using a Global CC on/off assignment, that pedal positions/states are updated when you switch presets.
So, he could have the OD blocks saved in bypass mode in both preset #1 and #2.
After he activates the OD via a CC # assigned as an External Controller while in preset #1, when he changes to preset #2 the OD will still be on (even though preset #2 had the OD saved in bypass.)
It's a cool trick and it works with any effect block that has a Bypass Mode parameter.

Trouble for me is that I want to be able to do this with the Compressor Block and *it* doesn't have a Bypass Mode parameter (for some reason). But most other blocks do.

Or is there a way to set this up within a single preset using a parallel signal chain post Boost/OD and some sort of CC command to mute one amp while activating the other, and visa versa?

I tried to do a text diagram of the In/Out path but the way this forum is set up doesn't allow for it.

I hadn't originally noticed that he had 2 reverbs in his chain. I'm guessing that that will be the biggest load on the processor if he tries to do this all within a single preset. He might need an Ultra to do that and that might be pushing the Ultra's processor.
But like you guys are saying he can probably get what he wants to hear (including any convenience features he needs) with a simpler signal path. So more info from the guy would be nice.

Personally, I never use delay (as echo) and reverb at the same time. Gets too muddy. One or the other please.
 
To clarify, the two "amp - cab - mic" blocks are in parallel, everything else in series (I used a forward slash to try to denote that).

Thanks...

DJD100 said:
This is meant to be a technical question regarding CPU resources, and not a request for patch data.

What I need to know is whether a standard has enough CPU power to run that patch, or if the Ultra is needed?

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev

Two amps/cabs in parallel with the above fx being used in IA mode?

electronpirate said:
This really explains nothing.

Do you have a sound sample? Something quantifiable? This can do what you ask, but there may be a different way of getting it done in the Axe.

I've moved it to requests.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Sorry, I wasn't clear...

a) Wah -> Boost/OD -> (Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic/AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic) -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay - Rev

NOTE: The two "amp - cab - mic" blocks are in parallel and mixed/panned, the rest are all in series, so 1 wah, 1 od, 1 mod, 2 delay, 2 rev, 2 amp - cab - mic blocks, and what ever is needed to connect and mix the above in theory?

I'm just trying to see if a AFX Standard will replicate my rig which is a custom powered RM 2 that I built with 2 Randall MTS modules, a couple of rack TC Multi-FX, and a few pedals/wah etc.

If I can get it all into a 10lb 2U rack, I'm interested LOL.

Thanks all...


joegold said:
I think what he really wants is this, but I could be wrong:

Wah -> Boost/OD -> Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod

Wah -> Boost/OD -> AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic -> Delay - Rev

And he wants to be able to switch back and forth between them.
I'm guessing he runs two amps, with a switcher and separate effects in his present rig.

If I'm right, then he'll probably need 2 presets and there will be no processor problems at all.
The only problem with doing it using 2 presets is that seamless stombox on/off control of the individual effects becomes tricky, but doable.
Jay showed me that when using an External Controller assigned to the Bypass Mode parameter, rather than using a Global CC on/off assignment, that pedal positions/states are updated when you switch presets.
So, he could have the OD blocks saved in bypass mode in both preset #1 and #2.
After he activates the OD via a CC # assigned as an External Controller while in preset #1, when he changes to preset #2 the OD will still be on (even though preset #2 had the OD saved in bypass.)
It's a cool trick and it works with any effect block that has a Bypass Mode parameter.

Trouble for me is that I want to be able to do this with the Compressor Block and *it* doesn't have a Bypass Mode parameter (for some reason). But most other blocks do.

Or is there a way to set this up within a single preset using a parallel signal chain post Boost/OD and some sort of CC command to mute one amp while activating the other, and visa versa?

I tried to do a text diagram of the In/Out path but the way this forum is set up doesn't allow for it.

I hadn't originally noticed that he had 2 reverbs in his chain. I'm guessing that that will be the biggest load on the processor if he tries to do this all within a single preset. He might need an Ultra to do that and that might be pushing the Ultra's processor.
But like you guys are saying he can probably get what he wants to hear (including any convenience features he needs) with a simpler signal path. So more info from the guy would be nice.

Personally, I never use delay (as echo) and reverb at the same time. Gets too muddy. One or the other please.
Click to expand...
 
The Standard is having problems with two drives+two amps. My regular patches in a standard, with a vol/pan-drive-amp-cab-geq/peq are resulting in a 52% CPU load on a Standard.

The Ultra should be fine though.
 
I just tried your chain as you described ... and on the ultra with dual amp I was able to replicate your chain but with one exception ... I had to downsize the cab block to mono lower resolution one otherwise it is not enough cpu power. But other than that it worked, totaling in 91-92% of CPU usage. So ultra might fit the bill

It depends how you want to use it .. if you want everything at once then it is almost there with a tiny exception if you absolutely have to have the different cab blocks per amp model then you have to sacrifice may be a reverb2 or smth like that and perhaps build 2 different patches and switch between them.

hope this helps,

Mik.
 
To the OP.

If I 'get' you now, then it's the following that you want, right?

Wah -> Boost/OD -> Tweed - Closed Cab - Mic -> Delay -> Rev -> Mod -> Delay -. Rev

Wah -> Boost/OD -> AC30TB - Open Cab - Mic -> Delay - Rev -> Mod -> Delay -. Rev

And you want to be able to AB between the two amps, right?

Looks like you'd be beyond the limits of the Standard then, even using 2 presets, but an Ultra should be fine, I would think.

Why do you want 2 delays and 2 reverbs in series like that all the time?
 
if you mean this:

djd100.jpg


can't even be done with an ultra.

do you really need 2 reverbs and 2 delays?
 
Thanks to all!

I could live with one cab no problem if need be, though it sounds as if I'd definitely need an Ultra, yes?

To those asking about the double reverbs, it's because I use them in IA mode (they're not always on together etc).

I suppose I could use separate presets too, but this exercise was to see whether it could be done (thanks again everyone!).

What's the sonic hit with lo-rez cabs vs hi-rez cabs?

I could likely live with a mono output as well if that helps minimize the resources needed.

BTW, this is my worst case in theory LOL!

Thanks...

Doug

godprobe said:
It'll work on the Ultra with both cabs set to LoRes.
Click to expand...
 
godprobe said:
It'll work on the Ultra with both cabs set to LoRes.
Click to expand...

That's right, but I would prefer the HI-Res and delete the second reverb. I'm curious why the OP needs a second reverb (and delay)
 
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