Cab sims on only one output?

[gdgross]

Haven't seen this come up yet, apologies if it has. (I did do a cursory search...)

I have mostly been running the axe-fx direct through output 1 through the house systems. Recently I've started using it with the rock band, so I use a power amp and guitar cabinet. I use output 2 routed to the poweramp inputs. Globally, cabinet sims are off and output 1 is copied to output 2.

It'd be nice to be able to use the same patches with either an FRFR setup, as I do at a few gigs, and with a poweramp & cab, as I do with the rock band. I know I can arrange my patches so that the cabinet sim goes to output 1 and the non-cabinet sim goes to output 2. Like this:

The question is, what do I do with the effects?? I'd like the same effects applied to both the cab and non cab paths, but ideally I'd prefer to place them after the cabinet in the DI/output1 path. I could duplicate them, but then I have to edit two effects every time I want to change something.

Is it possible to disable cab sims for only output2? That seems like it would be the best solution.

Thanks!

 

[NaturalScience]

I'd love to see this as well, but my gut feeling is that the Axe would have to compute each signal path separately, thus doubling the required CPU power. Here's hoping I'm wrong.

 

[monkjunior]

i run all my effects into the amp block then parallel the cab block on a different row.... then run back to a mixer block and pan cab row accordingly end up using left for for running to FOH and right for running into external cab...
not sure if this makes sense... but it works for me...

 

[javajunkie]

Haven't seen this come up yet, apologies if it has. (I did do a cursory search...)

I have mostly been running the axe-fx direct through output 1 through the house systems. Recently I've started using it with the rock band, so I use a power amp and guitar cabinet. I use output 2 routed to the poweramp inputs. Globally, cabinet sims are off and output 1 is copied to output 2.

It'd be nice to be able to use the same patches with either an FRFR setup, as I do at a few gigs, and with a poweramp & cab, as I do with the rock band. I know I can arrange my patches so that the cabinet sim goes to output 1 and the non-cabinet sim goes to output 2. Like this:

The question is, what do I do with the effects?? I'd like the same effects applied to both the cab and non cab paths, but ideally I'd prefer to place them after the cabinet in the DI/output1 path. I could duplicate them, but then I have to edit two effects every time I want to change something.

Is it possible to disable cab sims for only output2? That seems like it would be the best solution.

Thanks!

Unless you are using the drive on the cab it is not going to matter if you place effects like delay and reverb before or after the cab.

Here is what Cliff states:

Here is what Cliff says about it (he is talking about placement of effects before or after cabs or delay before/after reverb, etc):

From Cliff:

" It actually doesn't matter for most effects. It the effects are linear, time-invariant (LTI), then the order is irrelevant. If you don't use the cabinet drive then it's LTI. Reverb is LTI. Delay is LTI. Now if you use modulation technically it's not LTI but it is "wide-sense stationary" so you can treat it as LTI. The only blocks that aren't LTI are the stuff that does pitch shifting (time-variant) or distortion (nonlinear)."



As long as you dont have the drive parameter up on the cab block, the cab blocks are LTI; therefore, placement of effects before or after will not matter. Now, placement of LTI effects will matter before or after non-LTI effects (like the amp sims, pitch-shifter, drive block, trem effect).

I have measured this and listened and it appears to me Cliff is correct in this regard.

Generally when you are using a traditional stage setup the effects signal is run thru the effects loop. This would include your poweramp as well as the speakers. The poweramp is not LTI. Rotary, I believe (trem is not so I assume rotary is the same), is not LTI so it's placement matters.



Posts on the subject:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1663&p=16680&hilit=lti#p16680
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3735&p=37063&hilit=lti#p37063
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2097&p=36935&hilit=lti#p36935
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2361&p=34373&hilit=lti#p34373
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3060&p=30476&hilit=lti#p30476
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2860&p=28911&hilit=lti#p28911

 

[gdgross]

Thanks guys.

Java, I realize that in practice it doesn't make much difference. After all, I had been using amps with effects loops for years before i went axe-fx, and that's even worse since the effects were before the (tube) poweramp.

I think after having this thing for a week and doing a few shows and rehearsals, I'm just going to bypass the issue and manually turn the cab sims off when I use a cab, and back on when FRFR. Sound guys can just mic my setup when I'm cabbing it.