Cab block preamps

greiswig

greiswig

Power User
I'm looking for some information about the cab block preamps, but can't seem to find it in the wiki or the release notes. For one thing, I'd like to understand more about the tape preamp variants (70, 50 and 35uS), but I'd love to learn more about the FET preamps, too. Are these modeled off known production units?

Thanks!
 
FAS purposefully did not document what each one modeled or was based off. They suggest trying them out and hearing the differences. I think they are trying to avoid "you didn't model the xxxxx exactly knob to knob ratio" etc, since that really wasn't the purpose of the preamps.
 
Scott Peterson said:
Chris is accurate in his answer.

I would suggest try using my default setting - use the high quality "Tape 50us"; Drive: 2.50, Sat: 2.50; Bass: +0.75db, Mid: +1db; High: +1db. It works on everything for me.
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LOL, that's nearly exactly what I do with mine. Good to know I'm on the right path.
 
Yeah, we're told what the amps are modeled after, so why not the preamps? I think knowing more about them would help my process. I like to run my Axe out to external preamps and it helps me to know about each of the preamps I am using in detail.
 
FractalAudio said:
I talk about this in an interview I did for an upcoming book. The way I sum it up is "stop trying to recreate and begin to create."
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Thats it for sure. I get it absolutly and understand your decision to bring this feature in the Axe-Fx without names. But one point I miss also, isn't the Axe-fx overall about modeling real amps etc, it's a little sad to not knowing what preamp image is used, would make it perhaps more exciting use the preamp emulations at all, or like(Oh yeah that's the sweet 50's tape sound of an ...!)you will maybe never own or listen a gear like this for real and can't ever relate the tones the model adds to a analog unit.
Just saying, I can live without the names ,sure.Already picked fast the one I liked a lot and use in my presets, names would motivate me to try out more time the others again .
 
What was the reason behind placing the preamp sims in the cab block? I would have thought that they'd be their own separate block. Traditionally the preamp is the last thing in the recording chain before it hits the desk.
 
Lionheart said:
What was the reason behind placing the preamp sims in the cab block? I would have thought that they'd be their own separate block. Traditionally the preamp is the last thing in the recording chain before it hits the desk.
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My guess is because you mic a cab and that mic then goes into a preamp.

As far as settings go, I like Modern D:3.5 S:~1 BMT to taste depending on amp. I do occasionally use Vintage and Tape pres, but I found I personally like the sound of modern the most.
 
Lionheart said:
What was the reason behind placing the preamp sims in the cab block? I would have thought that they'd be their own separate block. Traditionally the preamp is the last thing in the recording chain before it hits the desk.
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That's why my last block is the cab on my grid, sometimes another PEQ or Filter after it when need a few last cuts in processing, then I record over AES digital, that way rocks! Yes it's more a additional feature simulate the way to the Interface, desk. Cliff choosed the Cab block as the right place, most likely of CPU usage before another block for the Preamps. I had loved it seperate as well because we also have a lot effect blocks in the list which I by myself never or rarely use at all
 
Does anyone know where the preamp sim is located within the cab block signal chain?
 
Last place I assume..

I really appreciate that he brought the Preamp,Tape Feature in the Axe-FX II in the end!
 
Knowing FAS's penchant for modeling high end/boutique gear, one could do some googling around the interwebs and make some educated guesses as to what each preamp is modeled after. For example, the Transformer version might be based on the Neve 1073 series, or perhaps one of the famous API's. The various tape versions might be based on some legendary 2" tape machines from the days of Yor - Studer A827, or maybe one of the Sony decks. The FET based versions may be recreations of famous recording desk input channels - Harrison, SSL, Trident, etc. Or it may be none of these. Ultimately, it's irrelevant. The great sounding gear of the past (and present) wasn't considered 'great' because someone knew the name of the beast. It's considered great because of how it sounds, and the character it imparts to the signal going through it. The only sense we determine that with is our ears.

Yeah I get it, the Axe's are modelers and the amps/cabs have names. Yippee. Don't get hung up on the name. We have the most innovative, comprehensive and most ridiculously fun guitar tool on the planet at our fingertips. Create, tweak, play and smile.
 
Scott Peterson said:
Chris is accurate in his answer. I would suggest try using my default setting - use the high quality "Tape 50us"; Drive: 2.50, Sat: 2.50; Bass: +0.75db, Mid: +1db; High: +1db. It works on everything for me.
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Thanks. I get that this is a "shaddup and create" instrument, and I do try to do that. Even if it seems to run counter to the idea of having the Vintage tube type in there because it isn't as authentic. ;-)

But the tape part in part in particular has me puzzled. I gather it has something to do with different biases? But I struggle to hear any difference between the three settings.

Scott, I'm kind of curious, too, as to how you arrived at your settings? If the Q on those bands is wide enough, aren't you nearly bumping the whole signal up by about a db? Which, if volume sounds better would sound...better? I have tried these settings, and I end up with some different EQ, and it is a very cool thing to be able to do. Saturation helps tame some of the highs on amps that I've had trouble with before, or example. Transformer setting is really nice as well, and a bit more subtle.
 
WW Audio said:
Knowing FAS's penchant for modeling high end/boutique gear, one could do some googling around the interwebs and make some educated guesses as to what each preamp is modeled after. For example, the Transformer version might be based on the Neve 1073 series, or perhaps one of the famous API's. The various tape versions might be based on some legendary 2" tape machines from the days of Yor - Studer A827, or maybe one of the Sony decks. The FET based versions may be recreations of famous recording desk input channels - Harrison, SSL, Trident, etc. Or it may be none of these. Ultimately, it's irrelevant. The great sounding gear of the past (and present) wasn't considered 'great' because someone knew the name of the beast. It's considered great because of how it sounds, and the character it imparts to the signal going through it. The only sense we determine that with is our ears.

Yeah I get it, the Axe's are modelers and the amps/cabs have names. Yippee. Don't get hung up on the name. We have the most innovative, comprehensive and most ridiculously fun guitar tool on the planet at our fingertips. Create, tweak, play and smile.
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I absolutely know and understand what you mean mister, How about tell us by using your experienced ears instead of the guessing internet example? Would be a challange, To me Modern maybe sounds like 1073, Transformer - API 3124 Hahaha Some of them acting pretty similar to my ears,for example tape 70 and Modern.

At any event you can create a lot nice tones
 
Well, it's simple. Because I don't particularly care what preamps they were modeled after. All I care about is what they sound like when I plug my guitars in, and what kind of tones I can create using them. The older I get, the more I appreciate the elegance of simplicity. There are certainly times when more detail is called for. This is not one of those times....in my humble opinion. As always, your mileage may vary. :)
 
Lionheart said:
What was the reason behind placing the preamp sims in the cab block? I would have thought that they'd be their own separate block. Traditionally the preamp is the last thing in the recording chain before it hits the desk.
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Preamp is the last thing after the mic on the cab i'd say. Then all the post effects are added after that. Right?

I think the non-linearity of EQ and other blocks means putting the cab last (so the preamp is last) makes no difference in the sound.

The Axe-Fx was made to model and capture the essence of specific amps and Cab IRs are a majorly important part of the sound as well. So it makes sense to know what amp is what and what cab is what (though sometimes people pick a Recto solely because those are "metal" when the tone they seek actually comes from a Marshall, for example).

Sure, the preamps could be named and identified specifically. But this isn't a studio preamp modeler. I really think the only thing that would come of naming the preamps is honestly "it doesn't sound like the real one." I'd guess that the current selections are pretty dang close to whatever the actual types are, yet aren't completely exact and I think it'd be a waste of time for him to model them as precisely as he does the Amps. Not exact and names given = disappointment and complaining solely based on the name, not the sound.
 
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