Blend two amps using expression pedal?

[ScaredSilent]

I'm a newb to this midi stuff, but it seems really powerfull.

I was wondering if there is a way to blend two amps using an expression pedal, such that when the pedal is completely up, it's one amp, and when it's down, it's another amp. Half-way would be a blend of both amps. This would be cool if you wanted to slowly fade into a really high gain tone from a clean tone (or vice versa).

I'm thinking it could be accomplished using two different rows of a patch going into a mixer, then somehow assigning the pedal to a mixer parameter.

Thanks in advanced.

 

[javajunkie]

I'm a newb to this midi stuff, but it seems really powerfull.

I was wondering if there is a way to blend two amps using an expression pedal, such that when the pedal is completely up, it's one amp, and when it's down, it's another amp. Half-way would be a blend of both amps. This would be cool if you wanted to slowly fade into a really high gain tone from a clean tone (or vice versa).

I'm thinking it could be accomplished using two different rows of a patch going into a mixer, then somehow assigning the pedal to a mixer parameter.

Thanks in advanced.

Yes, you can also just use a mixer block after the amps (only one block to deal with that way). You would use the level on the pamps and the gain in the mixer and set their starting and stopping points opposite.

The only issue you run in to is when you have both volumes blended you can get a volume boost.

 

[Dpoirier]

I do this routinely with the vast majority of my patches. I assign the controller to the level parameters of the two amps. Like Java explained, this can result in volume increases if you don't carefully design your curves. I spend a lot of time defining those curves to get what I want. As a result, my patches do not have more volume in the middle of the pedal range... they rather smoothly blend and morph between the two signal chains. However, it's a lot of work because the curve "algorithm" in the Axe is very rigid. Some curve types are impossible to achieve. I have added some items in the wish list on that very topic, but I doubt we'll ever see any improvement there. So you sort of have to live with it.

I haven't spent much time yet exploring other ways to achieve smooth morphing (without this exhaustive work on two different curves). Perhaps a mixer block would simplify the effort.

But the point is: yes, you can do it, and in a few different ways. Expect to spend a bit of time learning how to make the curves work to achieve smooth transitions and even levels.

 

[ScaredSilent]

Thanks. It's good to hear I can do this.

 

[DNW]

I used to do this with my old GT-8, but instead of controlling the overall amp levels, I'd control the amps' gain/drive controls.

That way heel down would be the clean amp, and as I start to kick forward the high gain sound starts creeping in... only it doesn't actually come in as high gain at a low volume. It creeps in gradually from a low gain slightly broken up sound (mixed with the gradually decreasing clean amp sound), until it becomes the full high gain sound.

I prefered that to the sound of using the overall amp levels. Now that I think about it, I might have preferred controlling the drive on the high gain amp, but the overall level on the clean amp. If only I'd thought of that at the time. :lol:

Never actually felt the need to try it with the Axe though, and from what I understand, CC of the amp drive controls takes a fair bit of CPU power.

 

[javajunkie]

I used to do this with my old GT-8, but instead of controlling the overall amp levels, I'd control the amps' gain/drive controls.

That way heel down would be the clean amp, and as I start to kick forward the high gain sound starts creeping in... only it doesn't actually come in as high gain at a low volume. It creeps in gradually from a low gain slightly broken up sound (mixed with the gradually decreasing clean amp sound), until it becomes the full high gain sound.

I prefered that to the sound of using the overall amp levels. Now that I think about it, I might have preferred controlling the drive on the high gain amp, but the overall level on the clean amp. If only I'd thought of that at the time. :lol:

Never actually felt the need to try it with the Axe though, and from what I understand, CC of the amp drive controls takes a fair bit of CPU power.

Well, it takes a lot less than using 2 amps :lol:

 

[Secret80'sMan]

I do this routinely with the vast majority of my patches. I assign the controller to the level parameters of the two amps. Like Java explained, this can result in volume increases if you don't carefully design your curves. I spend a lot of time defining those curves to get what I want. As a result, my patches do not have more volume in the middle of the pedal range... they rather smoothly blend and morph between the two signal chains. However, it's a lot of work because the curve "algorithm" in the Axe is very rigid. Some curve types are impossible to achieve. I have added some items in the wish list on that very topic, but I doubt we'll ever see any improvement there. So you sort of have to live with it.

I haven't spent much time yet exploring other ways to achieve smooth morphing (without this exhaustive work on two different curves). Perhaps a mixer block would simplify the effort.

But the point is: yes, you can do it, and in a few different ways. Expect to spend a bit of time learning how to make the curves work to achieve smooth transitions and even levels.

Hey Dpoirier,
Sound like you've worked hard to get good results morphing between amps. Any chance you would post a patch on the exchange reflecting some of those curves as an example of how to do this (if you haven't done so already)? I think it would be helpful to the community as a whole. Perhaps name it morph between 2 amps or something easy enough to remember. Doesn't have to be a great patch so much as a good building block for people to get started on that.

Thanks!

 

[DNW]

I used to do this with my old GT-8, but instead of controlling the overall amp levels, I'd control the amps' gain/drive controls.

That way heel down would be the clean amp, and as I start to kick forward the high gain sound starts creeping in... only it doesn't actually come in as high gain at a low volume. It creeps in gradually from a low gain slightly broken up sound (mixed with the gradually decreasing clean amp sound), until it becomes the full high gain sound.

I prefered that to the sound of using the overall amp levels. Now that I think about it, I might have preferred controlling the drive on the high gain amp, but the overall level on the clean amp. If only I'd thought of that at the time. :lol:

Never actually felt the need to try it with the Axe though, and from what I understand, CC of the amp drive controls takes a fair bit of CPU power.

Well, it takes a lot less than using 2 amps :lol:

Well, except that we're talking about blending two amps with an exp pedal. So it would be two amps, and CC control of drive on both!

How much extra CPU power does the CCing the drive control take anyway? I never actually remember to try these things when I'm home with my Axe... I just fire it up, hear the sweet sounds coming from the monitors and spend all night playing. :lol:

 

[Dpoirier]

Hey Dpoirier,
Sound like you've worked hard to get good results morphing between amps. Any chance you would post a patch on the exchange reflecting some of those curves as an example of how to do this (if you haven't done so already)? I think it would be helpful to the community as a whole. Perhaps name it morph between 2 amps or something easy enough to remember. Doesn't have to be a great patch so much as a good building block for people to get started on that.

Thanks!

Ok, I've uploaded one. See http://www.axechange.net/preset.aspx?PRESET_ID=858... note however that the preset as it is may not be all that useful, unless you adapt your continuous controllers to it, or adapt the patch to match your continuous controllers. But if you take the time to look through all the pages of the blocks involved in the morphing, you'll see what I was referring to. The patch works for my setup, under certain conditions. May not be that easy for other users (but that's not the intent). So have a look, and if you have any questions, ask away.
Daniel

 

[R.D.]

Hey dosen't John Czajkowski do this in most ( if not all ) of his patches too ? He's got some GREAT sounding stuff !

Maybe he'll chime in with his perspective too ....

BTW - John ( when you read this ), have you hooked up your Axe to the internet yet ? I'd love to disect a couple of your amp blending patches too .... "hint - hint"

THANKS !

 

[John Czajkowski]

Hey dosen't John Czajkowski do this in most ( if not all ) of his patches too ? He's got some GREAT sounding stuff !

Maybe he'll chime in with his perspective too ....

BTW - John ( when you read this ), have you hooked up your Axe to the internet yet ? I'd love to disect a couple of your amp blending patches too .... "hint - hint"

THANKS !

A little bird told me about this post.

Here you go:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=5203