Best Practices for live?

Very interesting.
My last gig with IEMs we did a sound check where everything was consistent with all previous gigs.
Two or three songs in my guitar goes waaaaaay up in my IEMs as the soundman was increasing the trim at the board.
I assume he didn't have enough headroom for my solos.
This led me to believe that full up is not unusually high level.

BTW off topic, how can I get my guitar going into input 2 to go out of output 1?
 
The Axe-FX's output is very powerful/super hot. I usually start at 10:00 and crank up to 12:00 maximum. With my presets that supplies a very strong line level signal. YMMV depending on your other settings in the Axe-FX, your presets, and the gear you are connecting to.
 
slinky005 said:
Two or three songs in my guitar goes waaaaaay up in my IEMs as the soundman was increasing the trim at the board.
I assume he didn't have enough headroom for my solos.
Click to expand...

increasing trim during a gig just means that the level he set you at originally is no longer loud enough in the mix. just because you send a ton of volume, it doesn't mean he doesn't have to adjust anything.

the following are all made up numbers:

let's say there are 2 axe-fx units on stage, the first that has the Out knob full up, and the 2nd at 9:00 on the Out knob. All other things are equal and exactly the same - presets, guitars, etc. the only difference is the Out knob setting.

let's say Axe1 sends the sound guy 20dB of signal, and he has to adjust the channel trim to "2 out of 10" on his mixer to get you to Unity gain on HIS console.

let's say Axe2 sends the sound guy 3dB of signal, and he has to adjust the channel trim to "6 out of 10" on his mixer to get you to Unity gain on HIS console.

at that point, regardless of the Out knobs on each Axe, or how much signal that each Axe is sending, they are now the SAME volume/level on his mixer. just because you send a ton of signal, it doesn't mean he has that much more to work with. that's why mixers have a Trim knob. it adjusts the incoming signal to a nominal level, balancing all the different inputs coming into it.

even in this situation, the sound guy might have to adjust the channel Trim on his mixer of any instrument - axe1, axe2, bass, whatever - if there's not enough signal at any point. maybe everyone else turned up, and he's just matching your level.

more input to a mixer does not mean "louder." ever. the mixer balances everything and adjustments will be needed as the gig goes on. if you send a ton of signal, the trim knob will be low. if you send a small amount of signal, the trim knob will be higher.

some mixer purists would argue that if you are forcing the sound guy to engage a Pad switch, you are not getting the best signal to noise ratio anyway, so turn down your Axe :) you can look at this in many ways, but again the main point is that the Axe doesn't require the Out knob to be full up to send a low-noise signal.
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
increasing trim during a gig just means that the level he set you at originally is no longer loud enough in the mix. just because you send a ton of volume, it doesn't mean he doesn't have to adjust anything.

the following are all made up numbers:

let's say there are 2 axe-fx units on stage, the first that has the Out knob full up, and the 2nd at 9:00 on the Out knob. All other things are equal and exactly the same - presets, guitars, etc. the only difference is the Out knob setting.

let's say Axe1 sends the sound guy 20dB of signal, and he has to adjust the channel trim to "2 out of 10" on his mixer to get you to Unity gain on HIS console.

let's say Axe2 sends the sound guy 3dB of signal, and he has to adjust the channel trim to "6 out of 10" on his mixer to get you to Unity gain on HIS console.

at that point, regardless of the Out knobs on each Axe, or how much signal that each Axe is sending, they are now the SAME volume/level on his mixer. just because you send a ton of signal, it doesn't mean he has that much more to work with.

even in this situation, the sound guy might have to adjust the channel Trim on his mixer of any instrument - axe1, axe2, bass, whatever - if there's not enough signal at any point. maybe everyone else turned up, and he's just matching your level.

more input to a mixer does not mean "louder." ever. the mixer balances everything and adjustments will be needed as the gig goes on.
Click to expand...

Makes sense.
Thx for your help.
 
I personally think that most gain should be achieved on devices with lowest noise. And unless you're gigging at some miracle places, the mixer won't be that device. If you send mic level signal there the FOH engineer will run it through the mixer's mic preamps, which tend to be on the cheap side.

So I would say the hotter the signal from AFX the better.
 
slinky005 said:
BTW off topic, how can I get my guitar going into input 2 to go out of output 1?
Click to expand...

you need to place an FX Loop block into each preset. i'd guess you're already using it though to get your sound to the Amp setup? FX Loop block overrides (cancels) the Echo function as well.

vangrieg said:
I personally think that most gain should be achieved on devices with lowest noise. And unless you're gigging at some miracle places, the mixer won't be that device. If you send mic level signal there the FOH engineer will run it through the mixer's mic preamps, which tend to be on the cheap side.
Click to expand...

sure. but many of these cheap mixers honestly can't handle that much signal coming in. many cheap mixers don't have a pad switch, and some don't even have a trim knob.

if you run into that situation, and can barely turn the Axe knob up, use the Gain slider in the Global EQs to reduce the output as much as possible.

9:00 to 12:00 on the Axe Out knob is typically already a ton of signal, forcing the mixer trim down all the way. of course every situation is different, so just be aware.
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
you need to place an FX Loop block into each preset. i'd guess you're already using it though to get your sound to the Amp setup? FX Loop block overrides (cancels) the Echo function as well.



sure. but many of these cheap mixers honestly can't handle that much signal coming in. many cheap mixers don't have a pad switch, and some don't even have a trim knob.

if you run into that situation, and can barely turn the Axe knob up, use the Gain slider in the Global EQs to reduce the output as much as possible.

9:00 to 12:00 on the Axe Out knob is typically already a ton of signal, forcing the mixer trim down all the way. of course every situation is different, so just be aware.
Click to expand...

Yeah I realized that I'm using the Fxloop already.
I'm just going to manually change the input in the I/O setup for those tunes.
 
What Chris said. I usually turn up to 12:00 and then let the sound engineer know that I can turn up or down as he needs to give him the best levels. Usually they are fine with my levels, but sometimes they ask me to adjust to give them a more ideal input signal. It is rare that I am asked for a hotter level.
 
I setup so the monitor or on stage cab feed does not affect the FOH feed.

I don't use a wedge and on stage cab at the same time but you could:

Out 1 XLR -> FOH
Out 1 1/4" -> On stage mini mixer -> wedge
Out 2 -> Stage cab rig
 
To OP - You definitely do NOT need to run OUT1 up full... that's line level to FOH and most will need to pad it to stop from being overdriven. I run mine around 9 to 10 o'clock (like Chris + others mentioned) and have never had FOH ask me to turn up.. it's usually the opposite. Never had FOH complain about the S/N level either.

Try turning OUT1 down to 9 and see what that does for your monitor levels...

In my case, I run OUT1 to FOH, OUT2 to stage monitor (which is amp/cab) so I can control my stage level and leave FOH alone (once set).
If I want guitar in my FOH provided stage wedge, I ask FOH to put some in there.
I try to keep my rig as simple to set up as possible.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom