Axe FX Ultra vs. Avid Eleven Rack

R

RebelRocker20

Member
I'm currently in the process of upgrading my rig and I'm looking for the "all in one" recording/gigging unit and obviously, Fractal Audio set the bar pretty high with the Axe FX units. Ideally, I'd love to just get the FX 2 or the Ultra, but like most of us, I have to live within my means lol. Unless I can find a reasonable deal for an Ultra (1000-1300) on the forums or ebay, the Axe FX units are unfortunately out of my range.

With that said, I've heard pretty favorable reviews regarding the 11 rack unit by Avid/Digidesign. It's not even half the price of the Axe FX units and has still gotten rave reviews for it's dynamic and responsive feel of a tube amp like the Axe FX.

As someone who currently is looking for a high quality, but reasonably priced unit as an alternative to the Axe FX(unless I can find one for the range that I listed above) can anyone give me their own personal feedback regarding the 11 Rack unit or any other units in that range that could compete with the Axe FX?

I've also looked at the POD HD series from Line 6 and even though that appears to be just as "tweakable" as the Axe FX units, I still doesn't seem like it could compete with other stuff of that caliber.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!!!
 
Hey, I want to start by saying that this is the Axe-Fx forum so everyone will automatically tell you to save up for the Axe-II. I'm trying to think what's best for you. I'm one of those guys who gave POD HD three chances and live with it but there really is a reason why the Axe-Fx is so superior. The amp modeling on the Axe-Fx is simply far more realistic than on the POD HD and 11R. That being said I'm sure there are people that are also happy with 11R. I don't understand how anyone can be happy with a POD HD though. My opinion simply put: stock cabinets usually suck. The Axe-Fx has best stock cabinets though but if you want to go around them you can your user cab slots. You can't do that on the 11R or POD HD. So... I only suggest you use 11R or POD HD if you intend to use a real cab and a power amp with them. If line in is what you intend to use... save up for the Axe-Fx Standard.
 
Thanks, Kent. Yeah, I think I made the wise assumption that 99.9% of the people on these boards would be biased towards the AXE fx units, but I wanted feedback from people to help me answer this question.

The Axe FX units are nice, but are they a $1000 or $2000(for the FX 2) nicer than an eleven rack?
 
Yes, they are. To me and many others. To you? Only you can know. Is an Aston Martin worth 8x a Toyota? Axe Ii is the best ever device at what it does. Buy a used 11r. If you're happy, great. If you like Fender, try the Mustang series. They're amazing for the $. But if you can tell there's still something missing, the Axe II will likely get you there.
 
Yeah they really are that much better. I'm confident you'd agree with me if you could test them side by side. Ofcourse it all depends on your standards. IMO Axe-Fx is the only modeler out of the bunch that can replace a real tube amp.
 
RebelRocker20 said:
a reasonable deal for an Ultra (1000-1300) on the forums or ebay
Click to expand...
That would be your answer. They do turn up, either from people upgrading, or from someone who has bought an Ultra and now realises they want something that's more plug-and-play.
 
Roland said:
That would be your answer. They do turn up, either from people upgrading, or from someone who has bought an Ultra and now realises they want something that's more plug-and-play.
Click to expand...


I agree. Can anybody help me find one in that range? LOL I REALLY don't want to settle for a cheaper unit and less tone because of price.
 
i worked at a music store and an employee won a free 11rack from avid for some selling competition. he played it a few weeks, then he bought my axe ultra haha. really no comparison.

you can always do studio magic to anything to make it sound good, but really don't need to with the axe. just my (and his) opinion.
 
I owned an Eleven Rack for a while when I bought my Ultra. While it is true that you get what you pay for, that doesn't mean the Eleven Rack sounds bad... it doesn't. Search a bit on YouTube and you'll see folks getting respectable tones with it and some really respected players like Dann Huff raving about the tone. One guy that goes under Vaisatchatrucci (or something like that) has some really nice videos on the unit. You can pick up a used one for $400-500 bucks. I'd suggest you start there to see if 1) you like the sound, and 2) you have the interest to be willing to tweak presets to your taste. It's kind of a prerequisite with any of these units. The Eleven Rack is what convinced me I could step away from more than 30 years of tube amps.

All that said, I did buy an Ultra, I did end up selling the Eleven Rack once I compared it side by side to the Ultra, I did love the Ultra right up until I upgraded to the II, and I am completely certain I did the right thing on each step.

The Eleven Rack is a great unit and a lot of bang for the few bucks it costs. If you like the 11R, I truly believe you will eventually come to Fractal. I think I appreciate the Axe II because I got here in steps and understand, first hand, that the Axe II is the best guitar processing option available for me! You'll have to see if it's the best for you. Nothing suits everyone. :)
 
Rick said:
I owned an Eleven Rack for a while when I bought my Ultra. While it is true that you get what you pay for, that doesn't mean the Eleven Rack sounds bad... it doesn't. Search a bit on YouTube and you'll see folks getting respectable tones with it and some really respected players like Dann Huff raving about the tone. One guy that goes under Vaisatchatrucci (or something like that) has some really nice videos on the unit. You can pick up a used one for $400-500 bucks. I'd suggest you start there to see if 1) you like the sound, and 2) you have the interest to be willing to tweak presets to your taste. It's kind of a prerequisite with any of these units. The Eleven Rack is what convinced me I could step away from more than 30 years of tube amps.

All that said, I did buy an Ultra, I did end up selling the Eleven Rack once I compared it side by side to the Ultra, I did love the Ultra right up until I upgraded to the II, and I am completely certain I did the right thing on each step.

The Eleven Rack is a great unit and a lot of bang for the few bucks it costs. If you like the 11R, I truly believe you will eventually come to Fractal. I think I appreciate the Axe II because I got here in steps and understand, first hand, that the Axe II is the best guitar processing option available for me! You'll have to see if it's the best for you. Nothing suits everyone. :)
Click to expand...


Great advice, Rick. The best feedback I've gotten, so far.
 
I still have my 11R.

In my opinion, the 11R is MUCH easier to tweak. I think Fractal took a page out of Avid's book and put the ABCD knobs on the Axe II. But part of that is that the 11R is simpler, and more limited than the Axe Fx. I think the 11R has a few very similar sounds as the Axe Fx, but the Axe is capable of more.

Live, no question about it, the Axe Fx wins in this department. If you want to have separate, controllable outputs (one for the board, one to an amp/monitor) the 11R, sets the volume of the different output points on a per patch basis, and only what you are controlling with the main volume knob is consistent. Midi CC's are fixed on the 11R, and if you have one expression pedal, it is stuck at one function, unlike being able to be sent to an External controller that you can change per patch.

11R CANNOT send cab sims to the board, and no cab sims to the monitor.

11R also give you one of each effect, which can work for a lot of people, but a lot of people like the flexible Axe Fx effects matrix.

I do think that the 11R is more touch sensitive than the Standard and the Ultra, and that's saying alot, because the Axe is very responsive.

I think we've established how important the cab sims are to modelers, and if you're going to rely on cab sims, rather than using it as a preamp, the 11R does not have user IR's, or stereo IR's either.

Lastly, you have to deal with Avid. Ugh. Transferring product registration is easy, but that's about it. They are slowly alienating their 11R fan base. You can only use the editor in protools. Actually, with the 11R it's so easy to tweak from the front panel, unlike the Axe Fx, so I never missed the editor, except that you can't load presets without it.

The sounds are great in both boxes, but the Axe is a much more flexible product. If you buy a used 11R, it's usually very cheap! BUT! you will probably not get PT10 that is being bundled with it right now. A used Axe Standard is not that far away from a new 11R with PT10.

Although... I use my 11R to reamp my standard, hehe...
 
Well... Sounds like my mind is made up...

Now would somebody step up and sell me an Ultra in the 900-1300 price range that I'm looking for.:mrgreen
 
Hi, you didn't mention your guitar style OR the amps you want to emulate? Are you going for a Fender style / Mesa type clean/rock sound only? The 11 R can do the job (much easier to program out of the box, BUT the reverb is difficult to dial in that Fender shine) I also echo what Rick said. I wanted the 11R to work on multiple levels like the axe for studio/ writing work ( I came from a Digitech 2120 which was inferior to everything mentioned here ) The 11 R is good if you are only doing limited styles. Its like when you move out of your parents home, you are happy to get your 1st apt/share, but you quickly realize that you can do so much more (creativity + better living) with more room (Ultra/AXE II).
 
klaushouz said:
Hi, you didn't mention your guitar style OR the amps you want to emulate? Are you going for a Fender style / Mesa type clean/rock sound only? The 11 R can do the job (much easier to program out of the box, BUT the reverb is difficult to dial in that Fender shine) I also echo what Rick said. I wanted the 11R to work on multiple levels like the axe for studio/ writing work ( I came from a Digitech 2120 which was inferior to everything mentioned here ) The 11 R is good if you are only doing limited styles. Its like when you move out of your parents home, you are happy to get your 1st apt/share, but you quickly realize that you can do so much more (creativity + better living) with more room (Ultra/AXE II).
Click to expand...

lol, good comparison. I'm basically looking for a unit that can give me a pallet of amps and FX for me to experiment and ultimately use to get my own tone. Having flexibility with a unit is key for me, so from everything I've heard to this point, I would say that steers me in the direction of the Axe FX.
 
One other thing that bears mentioning about the 11R is its dependence on ProTools. While its front panel controls are good, you need to use PT to edit presets using your computer. Also, buying used can get costly if the seller doesn't have the PT CD sine then you have to buy a new copy.
 
I've used both and agree with much of the above, so let me sumarise:

Ultra: Great tones, better FX, better flexibility and options

11 Rack: Good tones and FX, *really* easy to use (IMHO you don't need the editor except for backup purposes), somewhat inflexible
 
I know this is beating farts out of a dead horse, but I'll chime in...

People have different 'tolerances' for most 'classical' modelers like the POD. I for one could not stand it, still can't stand it. And that translates to the Eleven rack and other modelled things (Roland's COSM or whatever it's called). I remember going into a music store and people were going nuts over the Pod HD. I plugged it in, it was like a fuzz boz - it didn't even remotely respond to my playing dynamics. it was like a thin 'fabric' of amp-ness poured over my sound, almost like a filter, not an organic, living, breathing, changing thing.

The Eleven rack is an improvement (I admit, I've only played one for about 10 minutes - after owning an Ultra since 2007, it's just too annoying to play longer), but it is still both much more 'static' than the Axe, and much more 'digital'.

I do not really agree that the Eleven is 'good' in tones because I still know, every second I'm playing it, that it's a fake. It ain't an amp/cab. It tells me that over and over. This is not the case with the Ultra, and, though I thought it impossible, even less so with the II. The Eleven doesn't inspire me to sit and play and play and play. The Ultra and II do, for hours.

Of course, the II is even more organic and capable than the standard or ultra, and the X/Y stuff is incredibly, incredibly useful, as are tone-matching, etc. But my Ultra's still an amazing, amazing piece of gear. I am going to sell mine soon, and for top dollar (I need to with all the upgrades I've done), but their prices will come down.
 
The 11R is a good unit. Did you try it yourself? I'd never base buying desicions on what total strangers on the internet says about quality of sound. Been burnt before. About features, yes...sound, no. I've bought equipment that I could find nothing but raves about....not one single user that didn't go WOW!...The thing arrives, ad it sounds like shit. It's like music....ask what's good and they'll tell you Justin Bieber is WOW. Maybe he is, I have no idea what you like 8)
 
My two cents, the Axe FX is worth the money. I had an HD500 while waiting to get the Axe FX2, the pod is gone and I managed to recoup some cash, but I hardly used it because I didn't find it responsive or alive. Even if you have to wait if you can stretch to the 2 or an ultra it is worth it.
The Axe Fx2 is now firmly something that I will keep for years, and I use it all the time.
Can't comment on the 11 rack as I haven't had or used one.
Whatever you get look at the longer term, as changing gear always costs more in the long run. Hope that helps.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom