Audio clip after long verb/delays..looking for suggestions

C

codyraptor

Inspired
Long time user...but never found a happy balance on this. I'm running verbs and delays in parallel...now using the new killdry function. I have my amps and drives set where when I'm at my loudest..I'm just at unity gain on the output meters. Once I use a delay or verb for huge ambient tones...the verbs bloom out of that range and cause it to clip. I either have to turn down the level of the verb....or turn down my overall preset to account for that loudness when I go to a big ambient patch.

Question...how do you guys normally tackle this? Just turn the level down on the verb for that channel? I assumed the killdry function simplified this where 'mix' was all we need to worry with. I'm clearly missing something though.

Thanks!!!
 
Other than removing the dry signal, Killdry has no impact on how the effect processes the signal. Two ways I keep the signal from clipping are:

1. Reducing the Level in the Delay or Reverb block(s) that cause the clipping.
2. Placing a compressor in the dry signal chain after the parallel Delays and Reverbs, using it as a limiter to keep the signal from clipping.
 
JoKeR III said:
Other than removing the dry signal, Killdry has no impact on how the effect processes the signal. Two ways I keep the signal from clipping are:

1. Reducing the Level in the Delay or Reverb block(s) that cause the clipping.
2. Placing a compressor in the dry signal chain after the parallel Delays and Reverbs, using it as a limiter to keep the signal from clipping.
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That's what I figured. Just didn't want to limit the verb from being as present before it starts becoming louder. I haven't tried the compressor after the verbs....was hoping the verb itself had a way to limit this. No worries. Thanks for the input!
 
JoKeR III said:
Other than removing the dry signal, Killdry has no impact on how the effect processes the signal. Two ways I keep the signal from clipping are:

1. Reducing the Level in the Delay or Reverb block(s) that cause the clipping.
2. Placing a compressor in the dry signal chain after the parallel Delays and Reverbs, using it as a limiter to keep the signal from clipping.
Click to expand...
Actually....curious if people put an envelope on the 'level' of the reverb...and have it turn down if the volume gets over 100%...or something like that?? surely there's a way to contain it while keeping it musical/dynamic
 
codyraptor said:
Actually....curious if people put an envelope on the 'level' of the reverb...and have it turn down if the volume gets over 100%...or something like that?? surely there's a way to contain it while keeping it musical/dynamic
Click to expand...
There is more than likely another way to accomplish what you're looking for, I just haven't explored anything else at this point. I'll be watching this thread for any other solutions.
 
When you say the output clips, what do you mean exactly? I set my rhythm tones up like you do your dry, but then they go over with a lead tone. I don't hear it clipping though.
 
jakel said:
When you say the output clips, what do you mean exactly? I set my rhythm tones up like you do your dry, but then they go over with a lead tone. I don't hear it clipping though.
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Lead tone clips maybe 1db as far as going in the red a little....nothing wrong with that. The big reverbs 'bloom' and end up clipping the output...like digital clipping. too much output.
 
The outputs are calibrated at 0 = -12dBFS . The S/N ratio is huge, Set your levels lower. You'll still have plenty of noiseless headroom!
 
jakel said:
When you say the output clips, what do you mean exactly? I set my rhythm tones up like you do your dry, but then they go over with a lead tone. I don't hear it clipping though.
Click to expand...
With some longer ambient delay and reverb types and/or combinations, the trails will increase the overall volume causing them to clip.
 
mr_fender said:
Red on the OUT block meters in the editor is not clipping. There's 12 dB of clean headroom above the 0dB line on that meter.
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While it may not be "clipping", there is some distortion in reverb trails that disappears if the level is brought below the red. This occurs regardless of volume from the speakers/monitors.
 
JoKeR III said:
While it may not be "clipping", there is some distortion in reverb trails that disappears if the level is brought below the red. This occurs regardless of volume from the speakers/monitors.
Click to expand...

Are you sure? That would be a pretty serious bug, but I don't recall ever observing that.
 
how are you connecting your unit? if it's via analog outs into an audio interface, maybe it's the interface that's clipping?

like others have said, you can always reduce the level of your presets. i run all mine fairly conservatively, because i often use a shedload of fx and i need the headroom.
 
JoKeR III said:
While it may not be "clipping", there is some distortion in reverb trails that disappears if the level is brought below the red. This occurs regardless of volume from the speakers/monitors.
Click to expand...

There are no blocks after the parallel split? Post a preset.
 
If adding the heavy verbs/delays causes clipping, your options include:

1. Change your gain staging to create more headroom (enough that the loudest presets won’t clip)

2. Reduce the level of the verb/delay signal chain

3. Add a limiter at the end of the reverb/delay chain. This is particularly useful if the delays are at or approaching infinite feedback or oscillation

4. Try adding a high pass filter at the end of the delay/verb chain (or possibly at the beginning, or within a feedback loop on the verb/delay chain if you have one) - sometimes clipping is caused by subsonic sounds that aren’t musically useful anyway

5. Use side-chain compression on either of the dry or verb/delay chain such that when one gets very loud the other ducks (or use a ducking delay, if appropriate ….)
 
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