Anyone else using Marshall 9200 Tube power amp with Axe3?

Rasmus Toftlund

Rasmus Toftlund

Member
I was wondering if anybody else have experience with using a Marshall 9200 Tube power amp and real Cabs, with the Axe3?

If so, do you switch of the "power-amp simulaton" as suggested in the manual? I am currently using my Marshall 9200 tube poweramp as described above, and I found it thin and lagging when switching of the "power-amp simulation", but when left on it sounded and felt great. - Which seems very odd, considering what the manual suggests?

Not that I am unhappy with this, I love my setup and the Axe3, and I didn't buy my Axe for easy lightweight convenience, but for tone and flexibility - but it seems counter intuitive and had me wondering.

Btw, I also own the Palmer Macht 402 Class D power amp, but when using it with the Axe3, WITH the "power-amp sim" on, it also sounds weak and thin to my ears (at least in neutral mode, without tweaking) - again odd considering the manual recommends a neutral FRFR power amp...

By the way, I only use real cabs (Mesa Rectifiers XL & Engl Pro 4x12's), no FRFR speakers, but I do run direct also (with Cab block on) from output 1 to FOH (Output 3, with NO Cab block obviously, goes to power-amp -> Cabs). Style is brutal metal.
 
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I used to run a 9200 many years ago. The only thing that pops into my mind is that maybe you're not sending a hot enough signal to the 9200. Try goosing it and see if it helps to thicken your sound. FWIW, several posters over the years kept the poweramp simulation and some cabs sims on when using tube amps and or/ real cabs. At the end of the day, do what sounds and feels best for you.
 
warlockII said:
I used to run a 9200 many years ago. The only thing that pops into my mind is that maybe you're not sending a hot enough signal to the 9200. Try goosing it and see if it helps to thicken your sound. FWIW, several posters over the years kept the poweramp simulation and some cabs sims on when using tube amps and or/ real cabs. At the end of the day, do what sounds and feels best for you.
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Thanks for the reply, I will try feeding the signal a little harder - good tip! Also, as you point out, it seems others tend to leave it on as well even with tube-amps, which is good to know.

And of course - whatever works! :)
 
I've got the 9200, and although I haven't used it in a while - I would use it with the power amp sim off.
Play around with the controls in the Axe and you'll get it to sound 'right' (not thin).
It does sound good with power amp sims on, but I find it's a little too muddy at times.
I also have a JMP-1 pre amp. I've done a Tone Match by feeding it into my Axe, and then send that into the 9200....sounds great.
 
BBN said:
I've got the 9200, and although I haven't used it in a while - I would use it with the power amp sim off.
Play around with the controls in the Axe and you'll get it to sound 'right' (not thin).
It does sound good with power amp sims on, but I find it's a little too muddy at times.
I also have a JMP-1 pre amp. I've done a Tone Match by feeding it into my Axe, and then send that into the 9200....sounds great.
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Oh I have no doubt it can be tweaked to work well, as the tone shaping possibilities is endless with the Axe3, but no need really as I am quite happy with just leaving "Power-amp sim" on. :) - It just had me a bit puzzled, as the Manual basically says the exact opposite.

Also, tweaking it to much, will sabotage the direct-to-FOH signal I have running thru output 1 (WITH Cab block) - In fact, turning of "power-amp sim" will basically ruin that as well, so I guess it's just perfect I prefer leaving it on with the 9200 :D

Btw, isn't there already a model of the of JMP-1 in the Amp-block?
 
Rasmus Toftlund said:
Oh I have no doubt it can be tweaked to work well, as the tone shaping possibilities is endless with the Axe3, but no need really as I am quite happy with just leaving "Power-amp sim" on. :) - It just had me a bit puzzled, as the Manual basically says the exact opposite.

Also, tweaking it to much, will sabotage the direct-to-FOH signal I have running thru output 1 (WITH Cab block) - In fact, turning of "power-amp sim" will basically ruin that as well, so I guess it's just perfect I prefer leaving it on with the 9200 :D

Btw, isn't there already a model of the of JMP-1 in the Amp-block?
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Yes, turning off Power Amp sim will ruin your FOH signal....but that signal path is already compromised as your amp block is tweaked for what the 9200 is adding to the tone. If you want a FOH signal that mimics what you hear from your 9200 and Cab, you should use a second amp block and send that path to FOH.

Yes there is a model of the JMP-1 in the amp block. But I cannot get it to sound the same as my actual JMP-1.
I also cannot get the AxeIII through a solid state power amp, into my Mesa cab to sound the same as my JMP-1 and 9200.
So I also profiled my JMP-1 / 9200 rig with a Kemper, then sent that Kemper signal into my AxeIII and did a Tone match. It sounds identical.
But again, I can't dial the Axe to sound the same as my Marshall rig without using Tone Match.
I'm sure it's pilot error, and somebody like Admin M@tt could dial it perfectly, but I've spent a ton of time trying, and just realized it's easier to Tone Match.
 
BBN said:
Yes, turning off Power Amp sim will ruin your FOH signal....but that signal path is already compromised as your amp block is tweaked for what the 9200 is adding to the tone. If you want a FOH signal that mimics what you hear from your 9200 and Cab, you should use a second amp block and send that path to FOH.
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You have a point, but in practice it seems to work well with the 9200 and "power-amp sim" on, as I dont feel the need to tweak much beyond the "authentic" page controls - especially not with Cygnus. And the direct signal still sounds great to my ears. :)

Also, I am already using both Amp-blocks, so that is not an option for me. 🤷‍♂️ But that would be a solid way around it for sure.
BBN said:
Yes there is a model of the JMP-1 in the amp block. But I cannot get it to sound the same as my actual JMP-1.
I also cannot get the AxeIII through a solid state power amp, into my Mesa cab to sound the same as my JMP-1 and 9200.
So I also profiled my JMP-1 / 9200 rig with a Kemper, then sent that Kemper signal into my AxeIII and did a Tone match. It sounds identical.
But again, I can't dial the Axe to sound the same as my Marshall rig without using Tone Match.
I'm sure it's pilot error, and somebody like Admin M@tt could dial it perfectly, but I've spent a ton of time trying, and just realized it's easier to Tone Match.
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I also have the JMP-1, and I actually had this same problem with my Axe2, but I thought it had been corrected in Axe3, I guess not.

Though it might not be that weird that you cannot get the same sound thru a SS power amp, as I believe it's only the JMP-1 that has been modelled, and not any power-amp stage. So basically running the AxeFX JMP-1 model thru a SS, will be like runing a pre-amp really loud directly into a Cab, without any power-amp characteristics - I THINK...others might be able to clarify this?
 
Rasmus Toftlund said:
I also have the JMP-1, and I actually had this same problem with my Axe2, but I thought it had been corrected in Axe3, I guess not.

Though it might not be that weird that you cannot get the same sound thru a SS power amp, as I believe it's only the JMP-1 that has been modelled, and not any power-amp stage. So basically running the AxeFX JMP-1 model thru a SS, will be like runing a pre-amp really loud directly into a Cab, without any power-amp characteristics - I THINK...others might be able to clarify this?
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Give the Axe III JMP-1 a try and compare to your actual JMP-1. Tell me what you think (I often wonder if my actual JMP-1 is 'different')...or maybe I'm not doing something right. Just make sure you turn off the power amp modelling for that test.
Oh, also adjust the pre-amp tubes. They default to something that is not 12AX7s. I think I used '12AX7Sylv' (because I have Sylvania in my JMP-1)

The JMP-1 model does have a power amp. There was a post about it a LONG time ago....I think Cliff used either a JMC900 or JMC800 power section as it 'should' pair well with the JMP-1. I also adjust the power section to have 6L6s because that's what my 9200 has. I'm sure there are some other tweaks in the power section that would get it closer to the 9200, but looking at a 9200 schematic and knowing how to apply that to Axe III, is beyond my skill level.

I had offered to drop off my entire Marshall set up to Cliff's shop (I don't live too far from there), but I'm assuming Cliff didn't take me up on it because he constantly pulls the amps back out to test/measure them....which would not work if I only lent it to him for a period of time.
 
Oh! My old setup: JMP-1 + Boss GX-700 + ART SGX2000 + Marshall 9200. I had hair also.

Now it feels like that was in another life. It is kind of nostalgic, but my back pain doesn't miss it
 
Piing said:
Oh! My old setup: JMP-1 + Boss GX-700 + ART SGX2000 + Marshall 9200. I had hair also.

Now it feels like that was in another life. It is kind of nostalgic, but my back pain doesn't miss it
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I had my (similar) rig in a 10 space rack, which had a pull off top cover (so case inside a case style). It was literally impossible to put it in a vehicle by yourself. I don't know what the heck I was thinking. But having it live in my basement now, I don't mind that (until the 9200 needs tubes....then I need to take out a second mortgage).

I still fire it up and compare it to Recto, Marshall, Bogner heads....and think the JMP1/9200 still holds it's own. It's my favorite tone.
 
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