Another Tri-Chorus thread

Azael said:
Hi guys, this is my attempt, trying to nail the tone in the video in past post, any advice is welcome.
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sounding very nice !
but... :) not exactly like a TRI ;) . like I said before, the Quad sounds great in its own right (and so does your patch), but there's just something in the TRI's circuit that makes it and only it sound the way it does (and even its three versions sound very different). you can hear the modulation too much in your preset. having said that, if you turn down the Depth, it won't be enough. the TRI's modulation depth for lack of better term is more "invisible" and "softer". to me the TRI always fell in the same rare category of Modulation effects that are really hard to copy, be it analog or a digital emulation. an original Uni-Vibe is another good example here...
 
Bump, because I love me some Dann Huff cleans! Would be thrilled to see a Tri-Chorus block added in a future firmware update!
 
VegaBaby said:
sounding very nice !
but... :) not exactly like a TRI ;) . like I said before, the Quad sounds great in its own right (and so does your patch), but there's just something in the TRI's circuit that makes it and only it sound the way it does (and even its three versions sound very different). you can hear the modulation too much in your preset. having said that, if you turn down the Depth, it won't be enough. the TRI's modulation depth for lack of better term is more "invisible" and "softer". to me the TRI always fell in the same rare category of Modulation effects that are really hard to copy, be it analog or a digital emulation. an original Uni-Vibe is another good example here...
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Thanks VegaBaby, actually is only a chorus block, and you're right, the Tri has something that is difficult to emulate IMO, I hope Cliff put a Tri in the future.
 
Funny how people hear different things in the same tone. In the video (page 1 of this thread), I hear bad compression giving a "spitting, brittle" note attack, and an out-of-tune chorus effect, both things I detest.

Not to say it's not a valid tone, quite the opposite, it's very distinctive and usable, even if it's now an '80s cliché.

And contrary to popular belief, the original chorus was not produced by mixing out-of-tune signals, it was done by combining signals with different delays, but of course varying a delay quickly causes a pitch shift. It's just my preference to use chorus with slow delay changes to avoid the out-of-tune sound.
 
Azael said:
actually is only a chorus block, and you're right, the Tri has something that is difficult to emulate IMO, I hope Cliff put a Tri in the future.
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ahh, ok. even nicer ! Cliff has done a really good job IMHO with the Dimension Chorus. pretty sure if he had the time and interest that he could come up with something real close...
 
Everyone needs to take a step back and remember that the "holy-grail" Mike Landau Tri-Stereo Chorus tone …, wasn't just the Tri-Stereo Chorus !

Probably the best analysis I've ever seen of his "Tales from the Bulge" tone was in a thread over at HRI: HRI • Huge Racks Inc • View topic - Full Landau's '90s FX rig on an Eventide H8000 Here's a little snipet from the thread ….

Michael's classic sounds were based off the following units ….

  • DBX, 160x compressor
  • DynoMyPiano, Tri-Stereo Chorus
  • Eventide, H3000
  • Lexicon, PCM70
  • Lexicon, PCM42 ( x2 )

I'm sure a rack compressor is placed before the Dyno. Seems logical to me that the compressed dry sound goes first thru the DynoMyPiano, which blends dry and chorus. When Michael switched chorus off, the dry signal only went thru the Dyno...meaning there is no separated dry signal path. So all other units process chorused+dry sound from the Dyno OR only dry sound from the Dyno.

A big debate! Were the Dyno and the H3000 (running Micropitch) in series OR parallel. If in series, I'd assume it was Dyno>H3000, not the opposite, right?

the PCM70. I have a feeling Michael used this unit for reverb, but mostly for the classic diffused delays, a typical Lexicon trick NOT possible on the PCM42. Basically a diffuser (a component used in reverbs algorithms, consisting of 2 or 4 short delays connected in nested routings, with high feedback) is placed before the delay input and receives signal back from the echo feedback path, producing subsequent smeared thick delay repeats. Are you aware of these and/or other uses for the PCM70 in his rig?

the PCM42s!!! I may be wrong but my feeling about these is a simple use, probably a 250/500ms. dual delays, without modulation maybe (?)....with generous feedback. Again...what do you know about them in M.L. application?
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Now ..., that said .... I think Azael's example is pretty damn good considering he might have achieved that with only the Quad Chorus block !
 
There's also a series of YouTube vids from the Dann Huff Instructional Video from years ago ....

He goes through a song composition example where he uses "the schmo" as he calls it. You can see him step on at least three ( maybe four ) pedal switches to turn on everything he needs for that tone ....
 
Rex said:
But does it get you closer? How does the architecture of the Tri chorus differ from others?
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it's multiple choruses in one. similar to the QuadChorus but with it's own / different vibe. the Triangular by itself won't get you there. it's a bit like that you could get close to a Dimension simulation with just the Chorus block before but not quite... until Cliff added the Dimension option. it's certainly possible to get there with the QuadChorus, and I'm really splitting hairs here. many users might not even hear a difference, but it's enough for me to encourage a dedicated TRI model.
 
VegaBaby said:
I assumed that was common knowledge ;) .
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Based on the comments ..., I wasn't so sure ?

Also, somewhere I saw a video ( probably another YouTube vid ), that broke the sound down element by element. The vid showed what each piece of equipment added by itself ( ie; compression, pitch, delay, etc; ) .... What really struck me is the Tri- all by itself really isn't necessarily "all that" .... It really took the synergy of the other equipment to really make it special ( at least to my ears ) .... YMMV ....
 
R.D. said:
Based on the comments ..., I wasn't so sure ?

Also, somewhere I saw a video ( probably another YouTube vid ), that broke the sound down element by element. The vid showed what each piece of equipment added by itself ( ie; compression, pitch, delay, etc; ) .... What really struck me is the Tri- all by itself really isn't necessarily "all that" .... It really took the synergy of the other equipment to really make it special ( at least to my ears ) .... YMMV ....
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...or maybe I misinterpreted the thread and it actually IS about the "Landau tone" :) !?! I only commented here because I thought it's TRI dedicated....
and you're absolutely right. if you're after the "Landau tone", the TRI by itself is not gonna get you there by itself and doesn't sound all that spectacular on its own, but it's still very unique and right up there in the chorus hall of fame with the Dimension D and TC1210...
 
VegaBaby said:
it's multiple choruses in one. similar to the QuadChorus but with it's own / different vibe. the Triangular by itself won't get you there. it's a bit like that you could get close to a Dimension simulation with just the Chorus block before but not quite... until Cliff added the Dimension option. it's certainly possible to get there with the QuadChorus, and I'm really splitting hairs here. many users might not even hear a difference, but it's enough for me to encourage a dedicated TRI model.
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Here's independent confirmation of what you've already said ....


From the Fulltone TERC Manual ….

TSC's are actually three separate chorus circuits, each using a Panasonic MN3007 Bucket Brigade ( BBD ) chip to create its delayed signal. These three choruses are treated with multiple modulations and mixed together across the stereo output field in a way that, not only , creates complex images, but creates Phasing artifacts as well.



From Italo De Angelis's website dedicated to the Tri-Stereo Chorus ….

The Tri Stereo Chorus has some hidden secrets within the guts. Its particularly rich and unpredictable modulation comes from the 3 intensity knobs. They actually control the blend of 3 different LFO waveforms sweeping the 3 delay lines.

Each chorus ( one left/one center/one right ) can be set on a different intensity, meaning a magic wave that “no longer is / not yet is” a typical sine or triangle or square wave, but a blend of two of them. Something like a “morph”..., a word that came in trend 20 years after, in digital technology.
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Eliju said:
I'm not too familiar with how he gets that tone. Can you elaborate on it or point me to some info?
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Italo's site is dedicated to how he's achieved the same tone w/ updated equipment ( specifically the Eventide H8000 ), but there's also some pretty good data on how & what Mike Landau used ....

Italo de Angelis

Here's the gist ....

A mono signal ( from a guitar preamp ) is sent to the Tri-Stereo Chorus which splits it in stereo L & R dry & wet ….
The left wet and dry signals are sent to a Yamaha SPX-90 in parallel, programmed to provide stereo detuning.
The right wet and dry signals are sent to the 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] Yamaha SPX-90 in parallel, programmed to provide the Stereo Hall Reverb.
This entire mix is then sent in stereo to the second stage of the routing mixer and then to 2 Lexicon PCM-42 digital delays in parallel.
One side of the Stereo mix is also sent to a Lexicon PCM-70, set to the Circular Delays preset, also in parallel.

​
There's also some compression from a dbx160 thrown in for good measure ....
 
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