Alright, how do I get tone like this?

S

Soilent

New Member
Going for recorded tones, for now I only have the stock cabs to work with, so keep that in mind.


I'm fairly sure these guys use rectifiers, so I've been playing around with those sims on the Axe. Haven't gotten too close yet.

Also! I was wondering how you guys go about getting brighter high gain tones with out them sounding buzzy or fizzy? Low pass filters maybe? Idk, I'm new to the Axe so help me out! Thanks.
 
Anything recorded professionally will undoubtedly involve multiple, layered guitar tracks, a ton of extra studio processing gear, and endless tweaking at the mixing board by an experienced engineer. There are just too many ingredients involved in that process to make reproducing "tone like that" with the Axe-FX alone practical (if even possible at all). I would suggest getting a hold of the raw guitar tracks and trying to reproduce that tone with the Axe-FX since that is how the amp sounded in the studio before it was dressed up with countless extra post effects. And then record all the layers of guitars like they did, apply all the same post effects that they did, and mix it like they did. That's the only way to nail their recorded "tone". Anything else is just blind guesswork and lucky approximation, which you pretty much have to do through pure trial and error. I'm not sure if specific advice would even be helpful here.
 
That's a good response. So, in that case, what sort of post processing do you think they do? Honestly, I'm just new in general to recording guitar, so any tip I can get would help.
 
chances are, if you were able to get the exact sound they use in this song, you'd be pretty disappointed.
It works very well with the kick, snare and bass (let's not forget the vocals) but if you'd mute all other tracks and leave just the guitars, it would most likely sound, weird, thin and artificial. This type of music features big kick and snare and up front vocals over a bass fundament, guitars have to fill the space that's left. And it's been limited to hell and back. Bands like this always amuse me... :)
 
Soilent said:
So, in that case, what sort of post processing do you think they do?
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I hate to sound so utterly unhelpful, but the honest truth is that this is where the art and science of music recording comes in. Every engineer has his own palette of tricks and techniques that make him (or her) unique in their craft. I don't remember all the details, but a full description of what Ted Templeman did to Eddie Van Halen's raw guitar tracks for the first VH album would make your head spin. So many guitarists try to cop that tone with an amp and a few pedals, but that just isn't how it works. It works for a live approximation, maybe (after all, Eddie himself had to come up with a rig that was passable for live performance), but using a recorded CD as a reference is only going to frustrate you.

There are many books on the subject of recording, even specific to guitar recording. And countless interviews and articles in magazines (though tracking them down is problematic). There are as many ways to cook heavy metal tone into a final product as there are engineers to do the cooking. I don't have a specific recipe for you to follow, but I imagine some of the books out there do. Start there.
 
zslane said:
I hate to sound so utterly unhelpful, but the honest truth is that this is where the art and science of music recording comes in. Every engineer has his own palette of tricks and techniques that make him (or her) unique in their craft. I don't remember all the details, but a full description of what Ted Templeman did to Eddie Van Halen's raw guitar tracks for the first VH album would make your head spin. So many guitarists try to cop that tone with an amp and a few pedals, but that just isn't how it works. It works for a live approximation, maybe (after all, Eddie himself had to come up with a rig that was passable for live performance), but using a recorded CD as a reference is only going to frustrate you.

There are many books on the subject of recording, even specific to guitar recording. And countless interviews and articles in magazines (though tracking them down is problematic). There are as many ways to cook heavy metal tone into a final product as there are engineers to do the cooking. I don't have a specific recipe for you to follow, but I imagine some of the books out there do. Start there.
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I don't know where you get your info. Sure, there has been a lot of experimentation but most of the classic rock stuff used very little post processing. You have to remember that they did not have the digital editing tools available today. Post processing required separate chains of FX on each track, and you mixed down in one shot live. Unless both Ed and Ted were lying, he recorded the majority of his guitar stuff live with very little post processing. Some EMG plate reverb on the Eruption track, which would simulate the live tone in a big room, a little delay. To insinuate that some studio magic is responsible for Ed's tone is pretty naive.

From an old GW interview with Ted at Extremely Rare- Ted Templeman Interview -- Guitar World 1991
TT:I can't really speak for Andy, but it's minimal. Ed will be the first one to add any EQ if he hears that the guitar is lacking in any area. People always ask me how I got such an incredible sound from Ed. The answer is simple. I put the right microphone in front of the right speaker and stood back. It's really all Ed. He understands sound better than any engineer or producer.
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The most common professional advice I've seen over the years for recording any instrument, is to get the best tone possible at the source and use the right mic and placement. If you have to "fix it in the mix" you're doing something wrong.

To the OP, I'd suggest start with just an amp and cab sim, and experiment by recording along with a backing track. IME, tones that you like to noodle with in your bedroom may not translate well in the mix. One "trick" that I've found to work well has been recommended for both traditional gear and modelers. That is, to get a big "in your face" tone, use less gain not more. Turn down the gain until you think it's just barely enough, then turn it down some more.

FWIW, I engineer in a studio with 24 track digital I/O and 24 track 2" tape. I have recorded bands using my Ultra, and it was pretty easy to get a good recorded tone.
 
I've heard the raw guitar tracks from songs like Unchained. They sound nothing like the final tone heard in the mix. Best of luck to anyone who thinks they can easily cop that tone with just an amp and a pedal or two.
 
tubetonez said:
To insinuate that some studio magic is responsible for Ed's tone is pretty naive.
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True true. I recently got to hear selected playback from a first gen. copy of the original multitrack masters of VH1, raw. I was pretty struck by three things.

1. What I heard sounded almost exactly like the mastered record-- no production tricks needed.

2. With no buss or track processing, the guitar sounded dramatically different solo'd than it did in the track. It didn't sound much like I imagined it would.

3. Under the microscope, it becomes obvious that classic tracks are two parts reality, one part listener's imagination. Taken by itself, I would never listen to that tone and say, "Destined to be a classic!" - it seemed too bright. Not as sustainy or driven as I'd have guessed. You really just immediately got the sense that it was almost ALL fingers.
 
Once you get the idea that these devices, preamps, amps, recording devices, processors, speakers etc. are for capturing and reproducing inputs, you begin to realize:

(some phenomenal talent) -> guitar -> [insert urban myth amp etc. here] -> recording = very inspiring recording

(me) -> guitar -> [insert same urban myth signal chain] -> recording = dayum I need to practice :)

Richard
 
I have 10 or 15 guitar-only tracks from VH that were stripped for Guitar Hero, and I agree with Matman 100%. Now that I think of it, I need to track down that CD.
 
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