All amp models have have a high frequency rasp

OK, I tried to replicate Chromatizm scenario and I guess that now I get what's happening...

First of all, I created a preset with only IN 1 and OUT 1 blocks on the grid... OUT 1 level is at 0dB:

Screenshot 2024-01-02 at 15.46.09.png

Then, using Logic Pro, I recorded both the DI from my FM3 USB IN3 on the first track, and the OUT 1 signal on the second track:
Screenshot 2024-01-02 at 15.44.05.png

The first track signal is much quieter, because it's the pure signal from the pickup, and this is the audio signal that will be processed by each block in the grid. Also, this is the signal that we should focus and try to avoid clipping, using the Pad settings under the Input Config, setting it to "tickle the red". When this signal clips, we get the constant Red led in the input of your Fractal device of choice.

The second track is the audio signal from the OUT 1. It is louder, but I guess that internally all Fractal devices boost the signal in the Output block. But this is not an issue, as nobody should record DIs this way. When this signal clips, we can check the OUT 1 Clip led in the Fractal device.
 
hi ,
I also tested the input pad of the FM3 MK2T using my guitar.

After loading any preset, I created an empty track in cakewalk and set the input to FM3 input 3.

I played the same riff 4 times each and here are the results.

a1.png
* input pad : 0db -> 6 -> 12 -> 18


The following are enlarged photos of the first part of each recorded signal.
a11.png


a12.png

a13.png

a14.png

As you can see, the clipped part of my guitar signal disappears from pad 12db.
The point at which FM3's input clip LED no longer lights up Red is at pad 12db.


I've been using 18db since I was using Ax8. At the time, I didn't know how to accurately capture input clipping in this way.
So, I sat down for a long time, played, compared by ear, and ultimately decided that 18db sounded the most convincing to me.

But at the same time, I don't feel like I can't use 0-6db. They just sound a little harsher and more "angry". Just a little.
I wonder if I'm doing it right. (18db)
 
Looks like 12 dB is the right setting for you. There's no clipping there and you'll get a little better signal to noise ratio compared to 18dB.

Keep playing dynamics in mind though. You should test by picking the hardest you would normally pick. No need to pound on the strings unless you normally play that hard.

Ideally you want to set the pad as low as possible (smaller number) without clipping the input.
 
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mr_fender said:
Looks like 12 dB is the right setting for you. There's no clipping there and you'll get a little better signal to noise ratio compared to 18dB.

Keep playing dynamics in mind though. You should test by picking the hardest you would normally pick. No need to pound on the strings unless you normally play that hard.

Ideally you want to set the pad as low as possible (smaller number) without clipping the input.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the advice. I changed the pad setting to 12db as per your tip. I will share this method and your advice with other FM3 users in Korea. Happy New Year~!! :D
 
kywabunga said:
What I mean is that it's entirely possible that a bit of intentional clipping might actually sound better depending on the context, amp model, style of music, etc.
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I decided to go with 0dB pad for now, seemingly against the logic of signal quality.
It is just so much easier to play legato this way, it's like it was already pre-leveled without sounding like there is compressor pedal in the chain, and with the light touch it's not even touching red in a single coil mode. And with EoB amps, legato stuff just plays itself, no effort.

I would definitely change the pad to 12/18dB if I need to record, but for casual playing for fun 0dB is just... better. Feels better, smoother, easier to play. Maybe it's just hearing with the eyes, cause in blind test I couldn't guess always, tbh :)) But in most cases I felt like 0dB is less dynamic and notes have more power and punch, and 18dB seem to have more clarity and separation. It has more pronounced effect on low E, notes are wobbly with 0dB and have a "synth" sound to them.

But I'm really interested to see what Abasi's will show when we get the clipping warning in FM3. Looking at charts above, I wouldn't be surprised to see it on the screen 100% of time even with 18dB pad.

UPD. Tested again - nope, can't reliably spot a difference in a blind test :D
 
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I rerecorded the riff I played on the FM3 direct into a DAW. Here is the result:
https://on.soundcloud.com/73Gt2

Its a bit quiet, so you may have to turn up the volume of your phone/speakers to hear it (sorry about that).
The first time through is with a 0dB pad, output block level at 0, and amp block level at ~ -12dB. The second time through is with an 18dB pad, output and amp block at -18dB. I cannot hear much difference, but I thought i'd share it anyway :)
 
Aeser said:
Things I did about fizziness:

1: (I have an Axe FX III Mk II not an FM3 but I assume this is the same) go into setup, down to I/O, hit enter, then under Input 1/instrument turn that up or down until the meter “tickles the red”, you don’t want it solid red and you don’t want it TOO low, but first thing is to get the input level right.

2: Starting backwards, on the amp block in Axe Edit under Dynamics at the bottom change “Master Bias Excursion to 0% (it’s normally 100%).

3: Output EQ section, for the sake of testing this out make sure it’s all 0’d out on everything for the moment

4: Power Supply Change “Power Type” to “DC” (and you may want to turn the Variac to 60%, I do)

5: Power Tubes + CF Turn Plate Super. Diodes to “On” (it will be set to “Off” most of the time). You can also play around with the Power Tube Type to suit your taste, like you may like some different types of 6L6’s and EL34’s.

6: Preamp: To begin with make sure your input boost is “Off” (much as it is tempting to turn it on and rip, if you turn this off you will immediately hear a great deal of hiss dissipate) and generally you want to make sure the Saturation Switch is set to “Off (though SOMETIMES I leave it on but set it to 2.000 for the level) and I usually set the Preamp Tube Type to 12AX7A Syl and then if it’s a distorted high gain shreddy sound turn the “Tube Hardness” down to 0.00, if it is a Clean tone turn the Tube Hardness up to 10.00

7: I try to make sure the Amp block level is set to the default of -12.0 dB and that the preset volume (on Mac Command-L and it is the “level” at the bottom) is set to -15.0 dB then dial in to taste, sometimes you have to turn the preset volume up or down to be a good default volume with relation to the other presets, and sometimes you have to change the Amp Level with relation to the different scenes (if you have different amps in different scenes under different letter channels (A/B/C/D) as you don’t want to switch from say a quiet clean scene to the next scene that is a nuclear loud high gain tone amp scene.

8: Also someone gave me an example of a gate block I put in front of basically every high gain amp model, it’s always in front of everything so it goes Input > Gate > Everything else. The type is Classic Gate, Threshold: -40.00 dB, Attenuation -60.0 dB, Attack Time: 3.18 ms, Hold Time: 100.0ms, Release Time: 100.0 ms, Gain: -60.0 dB, Level: 0.0 dB, Balance: 0.0, Bypass Mode: Thru, Sidechain Source: Block L+R, Low Cut: 10.00 Hz, High Cut: 20000 Hz

Often when ever there is still fizziness I try starting over with that amp block at all default settings and try more gently tweaking them listening carefully for anything I do that introduces a bunch of fizziness. For me I found it was not one thing but a combination of a bunch of things that caused it but those things above helped it greatly.

Good luck and your mileage may vary.
Click to expand...
This looks like a lot of fantastic information and something I am going to work through tonight to see if some of my fizzy sounds can be cured. Thank you for sharing.
 
Chromatizm said:
I decided to go with 0dB pad for now, seemingly against the logic of signal quality.
It is just so much easier to play legato this way, it's like it was already pre-leveled without sounding like there is compressor pedal in the chain, and with the light touch it's not even touching red in a single coil mode. And with EoB amps, legato stuff just plays itself, no effort.

I would definitely change the pad to 12/18dB if I need to record, but for casual playing for fun 0dB is just... better. Feels better, smoother, easier to play. Maybe it's just hearing with the eyes, cause in blind test I couldn't guess always, tbh :)) But in most cases I felt like 0dB is less dynamic and notes have more power and punch, and 18dB seem to have more clarity and separation. It has more pronounced effect on low E, notes are wobbly with 0dB and have a "synth" sound to them.

But I'm really interested to see what Abasi's will show when we get the clipping warning in FM3. Looking at charts above, I wouldn't be surprised to see it on the screen 100% of time even with 18dB pad.

UPD. Tested again - nope, can't reliably spot a difference in a blind test :D
Click to expand...
I would think it would be better to use the 12 dB setting to get a clean input, and then use a compressor block first to properly compress the signal.
 
Interesting thread. I’ll check my input pad but it should be whatever the manual recommends.

Tube amps make a lot of noise when you drive them hard. Cliff models all of that. Hi gain tube amps make fizz. Just saying.
 
AlanAlligator said:
I rerecorded the riff I played on the FM3 direct into a DAW. Here is the result:
https://on.soundcloud.com/73Gt2

Its a bit quiet, so you may have to turn up the volume of your phone/speakers to hear it (sorry about that).
The first time through is with a 0dB pad, output block level at 0, and amp block level at ~ -12dB. The second time through is with an 18dB pad, output and amp block at -18dB. I cannot hear much difference, but I thought i'd share it anyway :)
Click to expand...
you need to increase the amp level, so the DAW can get signal between -12db to -6db . cmiiw

1704294442657.png
 
I have just recorded a quick clip of a high gain tone with the FM3:
https://on.soundcloud.com/WHWBj

It sounds quite different through my phone and other speaker I have, compared to through my monitors. Does it sound as though clipping is occuring? (Please excuse the shoddy playing 🤣)

Thank you!
 
Anton Karelin said:
Chromatizm, push your fishman lower into the body of the guitar, away from the strings
Click to expand...
Yep, the first thing that I did, it's the lowest I was able to get them.
I think there's a room for a bit more but I am afraid to push, because when I bought this strandberg it came with a broken neck pickup. When they replaced it, they told me it was probably damaged during the installation, so I just stay on the safe side.
 
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