Acoustic instruments in Axe fx

Bodde

Bodde

Fractal Fanatic
I have my Axe fx for over three years but I have never tried to run my piezo equipped Acoustic instruments (12 string guitar, sitar and double bass) in my Axe fx. I want to try this now so I can use some effects over these instruments. Mostly for recording but if I am satisfied with the results I want to try this live as well.

Here are my questions:
1) This is the most important one: Normally I use my Fishman Platinum as a preamp for my acoustics because it is 10Mohm which is especially good for acoustic piezo pickups. For what I know the Axe fx is maximum 1Mohm (input Z/gate settings). Can this be set to 10Mohm somehow to be better suited for piezo pickups? If I wouldn't need the Fishman preamp anymore that would be great (the less gear to bring the better).
2) Are there any changes I should make in the I/O?
3) Is it best to plug my instrument in the front input or input 1?
4) Do you use the Tube pre Amp mostly (without cab block)? and do you place this block at the very beginning of the grid?
5) Where do you place the Compressor block or EQ block for acoustic instruments? at the start or end? Do you prefer the Studio compressor or the Multi compressor?
6) Anyone willing to share a good acoustic preset so I have some example for analyzing and a place to start (not trying to copy a specific sound).

Additional tips are also welcome of course. Thanks in advance!!
 
Bodde said:
1) This is the most important one: Normally I use my Fishman Platinum as a preamp for my acoustics because it is 10Mohm which is especially good for acoustic piezo pickups. For what I know the Axe fx is maximum 1Mohm (input Z/gate settings). Can this be set to 10Mohm somehow to be better suited for piezo pickups?
Click to expand...
No, it is 1M max. However, it may or may not matter. This is the kind of thing that very much depends on the actual piezo pickup and cable length etc. It is probably best to try it with and without the preamp to find out if it makes a meaningful difference.

Bodde said:
2) Are there any changes I should make in the I/O?
Click to expand...
Nothing special here, just set levels as usual.

Bodde said:
3) Is it best to plug my instrument in the front input or input 1?
Click to expand...
Since you're probably not gonna use Angle Severe with max gain, either should work just fine. The special sauce on the front input reduces the noise to ridiculously low levels which is only necessary when a humongous amount of gain (high gain amp sim.) is applied on the signal.

Bodde said:
4) Do you use the Tube pre Amp mostly (without cab block)? and do you place this block at the very beginning of the grid?
Click to expand...
Tube pre is one good option. Tone matching the piezo signal to a miked acoustic sound is another. The TMA block is really an awesome tool for acoustic instruments so I'd recommend experimenting with that.

Bodde said:
5) Where do you place the Compressor block or EQ block for acoustic instruments? at the start or end? Do you prefer the Studio compressor or the Multi compressor?
Click to expand...
There are many possibilities here and of course there's no "right way". It makes sense to do any major EQing after the compressor so that adjusting the EQ does not change the compression behavior. I would probably start with a filter block in lowcut mode to get rid of the extra lows. Then on to a compressor and EQ.

Studio compressor or multiband... well, it all depends on what the source sound is like. Multiband can be useful to reduce harshness or boominess on certain frequency bands. Note also that if you use the AMP block (tube pre or jazz chorus or ...) you have many compression options right there so you may not need a separate COMP block.
 
rdnzl said:
No, it is 1M max. However, it may or may not matter. This is the kind of thing that very much depends on the actual piezo pickup and cable length etc. It is probably best to try it with and without the preamp to find out if it makes a meaningful difference.


Nothing special here, just set levels as usual.


Since you're probably not gonna use Angle Severe with max gain, either should work just fine. The special sauce on the front input reduces the noise to ridiculously low levels which is only necessary when a humongous amount of gain (high gain amp sim.) is applied on the signal.


Tube pre is one good option. Tone matching the piezo signal to a miked acoustic sound is another. The TMA block is really an awesome tool for acoustic instruments so I'd recommend experimenting with that.


There are many possibilities here and of course there's no "right way". It makes sense to do any major EQing after the compressor so that adjusting the EQ does not change the compression behavior. I would probably start with a filter block in lowcut mode to get rid of the extra lows. Then on to a compressor and EQ.

Studio compressor or multiband... well, it all depends on what the source sound is like. Multiband can be useful to reduce harshness or boominess on certain frequency bands. Note also that if you use the AMP block (tube pre or jazz chorus or ...) you have many compression options right there so you may not need a separate COMP block.
Click to expand...


Can yo clarify, what is the TMA block? thanks!
 
I use my Godin Steel string into one of my CLRs every Thursday at my duo gig..A guitar player friend came in and couldnt beleive my acoutsic tone..it sounds so damn good. I did a tonematch of my Eric Clapton Martin. Converted it so i could use it as a cab block. Run some compression, delay, verb. etc..
 
I use the parametric eq's in the axefx. I use the eq's to slice out the frequencies added by the pickups to get back to the natural sound of my acoustic. I don't record, never made the time to do it. All my playing is live- can't tell you how many times guitar players chase me down to ask how I get such a crystal clear sound out of my acoustic...eq and .06ms delay in a parallel chain.
 
yeah i run the piezos from my electric into input 1 right. tube pre for basic toneshaping and level boost into a cab block which is an exported tonematch of an acoustic i found on youtube. some compression and saturation in the cab block with a touch more eq and it sounds amazing. parallel processing with the mag outs using volume blocks to input select and there's a whole world of possibilities
 
Thanks everyone for their input. Great help!

rdnzl said:
No, it is 1M max. However, it may or may not matter. This is the kind of thing that very much depends on the actual piezo pickup and cable length etc. It is probably best to try it with and without the preamp to find out if it makes a meaningful difference.
Click to expand...

Too bad is doesn't have 10Mohm. Especially for piezo pickups this sounds better I think. Especially for double bass.


rdnzl said:
Since you're probably not gonna use Angle Severe with max gain,
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What is Angle Severe?

rdnzl said:
Studio compressor or multiband... well, it all depends on what the source sound is like. Multiband can be useful to reduce harshness or boominess on certain frequency bands. Note also that if you use the AMP block (tube pre or jazz chorus or ...) you have many compression options right there so you may not need a separate COMP block.
Click to expand...

you mean the compressor knobs in the Amp block dynamic page I guess? somehow I have never touched these. Don't know if that works just as fine or better as a separate Compressor block? Find out that a Multiband compressor placed at the very end of the chain sounds pretty good. Although I have to admit the Multiband is a bit to complicated to dial in for me.


rdnzl said:
Tube pre is one good option. Tone matching the piezo signal to a miked acoustic sound is another. The TMA block is really an awesome tool for acoustic instruments so I'd recommend experimenting with that.
Click to expand...

I have no experience with Tone matching. When I have time I will search out how that works. Have to do some research on that since it seems a bit more complicated to me. Never was really interested in that but especially for acoustic I think it can work very well.
 
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Mike Snider said:
I use the parametric eq's in the axefx. I use the eq's to slice out the frequencies added by the pickups to get back to the natural sound of my acoustic. I don't record, never made the time to do it. All my playing is live- can't tell you how many times guitar players chase me down to ask how I get such a crystal clear sound out of my acoustic...eq and .06ms delay in a parallel chain.
Click to expand...

Can you please share a preset. Thanks in advance
 
Bodde said:
What is Angle Severe?
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Engl Savage I think. That was just a randomly picked example of a high gain amp model. The point is, for acoustic or other low gain sounds all the inputs are quiet enough.

Bodde said:
you mean the compressor knobs in the Amp block dynamic page I guess? somehow I have never touched these. Don't know if that works just as fine or better as a separate Compressor block?
Click to expand...
Yes, compressor knobs. But also dynamics, sag ...etc... we have a lot of tools for tweaking the dynamic nature of the incoming signal. A bit like using different compressor plugins in a DAW.
 
Mike Snider said:
Nagi,
Very sorry- i just packed everything up and is in a truck for tomorrow. I can post a preset in a few days.
Regardless, my preset wouldn't sound good for any other guitar/pickup setup. Are you familiar with parametric eq?
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Yes...but just cant seem to use it right...ok no hurry
 
Nagi Mysore said:
Yes...but just cant seem to use it right...ok no hurry
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Yea- took me a long time to really put all the pieces together. Im sure you have read all the same articles and tried various techniques - but best advice anyone ever gave me was to boost the gain in each band and sweep across the frequencies until the offending freq. jump out, then cut at that location> adjust the Q to narrow the cut as much as needed/possible then fine tune the cut in gain with the width of the Q.
Personally, I spent significant time playing>tweaking>playing>tweaking until I got just what I wanted to hear. The upside, I havent changed my PEQ block in 8 years.
My objective was to replicate exactly what I was hearing when I play my acoustic unplugged, so obviously the eq is specific to the guitar, string and P/U combination. All of my adjustments are cuts.
The axefx is such a versatile tool- I really enjoy reading all the different approaches.
 
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