Wish Ability to attach modifiers to manual controllers

[Ugly Bunny]

Based on my previous wish, now that I've played with the concept a bit, I think it would be incredible to be able to attach a modifier to a manual controller. The ability to assign a number of parameters to one controller in any range or any orientation is wonderful, but it would make it extremely powerful to be able to, for instance, control that manual controller with an Expression pedal.

For instance, we could assign the amp gain, master volume, and EQ functions to the knob where the EQ and master volume compensate for the changes in gain for the best result. Then, we attach that to the Expression pedal and we can control the tone that way. It might have some edge-case use, but I could also see controlling the levels of delay mix & feedback in proportion to reverb mix/time AND amp gain & block volume all together for a solo sound when you push the toe down, then bring toe up and all the time based stuff fades into the background, the gain returns to normal, and the volume drops back down, all without needing to actually change scenes or channels on particular blocks.

TLDR: eliminate the need for some scenes and the resultant gap when changing scenes by being able to control manual controllers with modifiers.

 

[Bakerman]

Just checking since you didn't reply to my post in the first thread: Do you understand that a pedal can be directly assigned to more than one parameter, with unique modifier settings for each?

 

[Ugly Bunny]

Just checking since you didn't reply to my post in the first thread: Do you understand that a pedal can be directly assigned to more than one parameter, with unique modifier settings for each?

Oh!! I must have missed that. Thank you

I think I'll leave this wish here just because (a) your reply is very helpful for others who might be looking for the same thing and (b) I still think it would be neat to have the EXP pedal as a sort of "meta" controller for the Manual Controller, since if I don't have my exp pedal hooked up at home, for instance, I can still set up the parameter adjustments using the manual controller (for testing, tweaking, experimentation, etc.) and then attach that to the EXP pedal, once it's perfected, for use at rehearsals/gigs where I will have my EXP pedal.

Thanks again, @Bakerman !

EDIT: Also, do you know exactly how many parameters can be connected to one modifier?

 

[Bakerman]

The only limit (other than CPU%) is the total number of modifiers a preset can have. It's 24 on the Axe-FX II and I can't remember if that increased to 32 on the Axe III, but the number of spots at the Controllers: Modifiers page will answer that. (The pedal here is really a "source". A modifier is the assignment of any source to any one parameter.)

You can also access modifiers from that menu in Axe-Edit pretty quickly if you need to change the source of several for testing at home. On the Axe-FX II "enter" could access them on the front panel too, but the III didn't have a way to do that the last time I used one.

edit: Actually you can make this easier with dual modifier sources like mr_fender mentioned in the other thread. Set it up to multiply the pedal and knob values, and store the preset with the manual knob at 100%. When the pedal isn't present, the manual knob can be used. This assumes an unused pedal port is read as 100%. If it was 0% instead, you'd need to add the values and store with manual knob at 0%.

 

[Ugly Bunny]

So, the thread flair says "Implemented," yet this is what my Manual page looks like (no yellow circles).



Granted; this is the FM3 and it may be a feature not available for it. Can anyone confirm that the little empty circle like controls you can defintely add modifiers to on the Axe Fx III?



Just wanna make sure I'm not crazy... or make sure I am?

Mods; if this has been implemented on the Axe Fx III, Can you move this to the FM3 Wish section and change it back to "Wish?" Thanks! @iaresee @Admin M@

 

[iaresee]

So, the thread flair says "Implemented," yet this is what my Manual page looks like (no yellow circles).

View attachment 95310

Granted; this is the FM3 and it may be a feature not available for it. Can anyone confirm that the little empty circle like controls you can defintely add modifiers to on the Axe Fx III?

View attachment 95311

Just wanna make sure I'm not crazy... or make sure I am?

I set the title to Implemented.

As @Bakerman said above: you can already assign a controller to multiple things at the same time. This is true for the AFIII, FM9 and FM3. This has been the case for maybe 10 years or more now.

Here's a preset where Manual 1 controls the AMP block's gain, bass, middle and treble to different amounts. As you turn up Manual 1 the sound gets darker, scooped and more distorted. Study it. Everything in the AMP block with a yellow dot below it will change when you alter the Manual 1 controller:



I also put Manual 1 on the Performance Page for the preset. Just fip to that page and turn the A knob to change the sound of the amp.



You can replace Manual 1 with a Pedal or External Controller if you want to use that. Or a scene controller.

Attaching modifiers to Manual controllers doesn't make any sense -- they're already controllers. Controlling a controller? Just change the controller source to what you'd rather use. Or use the dual source trick from the other thread to control the parameters using either-or controllers.

 

[Ugly Bunny]

Just change the controller source to what you'd rather use.

Is there a way to do this for every parameter that's being controlled by that controller at the same time? That's the crux of this. I understand that this would effectively be attaching a controller to a controller:

Attaching modifiers to Manual controllers doesn't make any sense -- they're already controllers.

This is the whole point, though; as I said, the request is for a sort of 'meta' controller: My request is specifically geared at (first) attaching and perfecting the Manual/"Hotknob" controller as a dial, and (second) being able to attach to this manual controller either an EV-1 or a MIDI CC# or hell, even an LFO if you wanna get funky.

I also put Manual 1 on the Performance Page for the preset. Just fip to that page and turn the A knob to change the sound of the amp.

This is an excellent idea and perfect for making those adjustments manually. This is great for when I'm creating the Manual controller at my desk for later use with my EXP pedal, but then it'd be a huge chore to transfer those assignments back and forth between the Manual Knob and the EXP pedal. If everything were on the manual controller, all I'd have to do would be to remove the modifier from the manual controller and I'd be back able to use the knob (but I also have a Wish in to change this behaviour as well...).

Or use the dual source trick from the other thread to control the parameters using either-or controllers.

I'm not sure what you're referring to, but I'm almost certain it doesn't replicate exactly my wish, which is modifiers on Manual Controllers...

In any case, I respect your authority as a mod and I won't contest your actions, but I don't think it's fair that you dismiss this wish because there are (insufficient, IMO) workarounds when those workarounds do not address the functions I'm specifically requesting in this very wish; I mean, if workarounds is answer enough, you can probably close a bunch of threads down. But given I'm the first one to ever request this, obviously it wouldn't be high on FAS's priority list even IF anyone thought it was a neat idea, so I guess it's whatever. Anyway, feel free to close this thread. Cheers!

 

[GlennO]

I set the title to Implemented.

It's not quite the same thing. The indirection he's asking for is a pretty common feature in remote control systems. A typical way to use it is to define a few important controls for each preset via manual controllers (to use the Axe-FX term), each of which can control one or more underlying parameters, then attach a midi cc to each one. The definition of the "important" ones can vary from preset to preset, but the midi controllers you use to control them can remain fixed in your rig.

 

[iaresee]

It's not quite the same thing. The indirection he's asking for is a pretty common feature in remote control systems. A typical way to use it is to define a few important controls for each preset via manual controllers (to use the Axe-FX term), each of which can control one or more underlying parameters, then attach a midi cc to each one. The definition of the "important" ones can vary from preset to preset, but the midi controllers you use to control them can remain fixed in your rig.

I get that, but that's not how things work in the system we have.

The equivalence is possible without the indirection.

 

[iaresee]

In any case, I respect your authority as a mod and I won't contest your actions, but I don't think it's fair that you dismiss this wish because there are (insufficient, IMO) workarounds when those workarounds do not address the functions I'm specifically requesting in this very wish; I mean, if workarounds is answer enough, you can probably close a bunch of threads down. But given I'm the first one to ever request this, obviously it wouldn't be high on FAS's priority list even IF anyone thought it was a neat idea, so I guess it's whatever. Anyway, feel free to close this thread. Cheers!

I set it back to Wish.

 

[Ugly Bunny]

I set it back to Wish.

I appreciate it; thank you

Can you point me to the the "dual source trick" you mentioned earlier? That sounds interesting...

 

[sean.e]

Can you point me to the the "dual source trick" you mentioned earlier? That sounds interesting...

From your other thread, recommendation from @mr_fender: https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...tide-h9s-hotknob-feature.180833/#post-2213259

 

[Bakerman]

Also see the last part of post #4 in this thread. You might need to multiply them (Src1 x Src 2) if the pedal value is 100% with no pedal connected, which I'm pretty sure happens with any FAS pedal port. (I don't know about an FC pedal port when the FCx itself isn't even connected.)