A depressing realization (and unpopular opinion): most of the amps sound very similar.

Rex said:
That all-amps-sounding-the-same thing is also an artifact of low-volume monitoring. When playing loud, you can hear clear differences that are inaudible when playing softly.
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Also, for me, a clean amp or mid gainer played softly feels underwhelming.

The lack of interaction between the speaker and guitar is like playing with in ears only. Makes it thin and lacking vibe for me.

Tones with gain are better played softly but not as satisfying as when played with a decently loud speaker in the room.
 
Ed DeGenaro said:
except that's less the difference in amps but rather interaction between amp sound out if the cab and guitar, plus room compression.
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The point is that there are differences between amps that are only audible when you turn it up. That's above and beyond acoustic feedback and room resonances (not sure what "room compression" is).
 
I just got done watching the broadcast of an hour long TV gig I did a month back. I knew it was gonna be hell from what others doing that show told me. Plus it was headphones only.
Preparing for it, trying to travel light I ordered a FX8 and was gonna use a small amp loaded down.
The FX8 didn't get there in time so first rehearsal I used an Atomic Amplifire which I love even in the worst monitors but I using it with the MFC before the latest firmware some if the midi CCS didn't play nice.
Next laptop with UAD Apollo controlled by the MFC, loved what it sounded like but I ended up with 59ms latency on some of the heavy presets.
So I said sod it I'm taking the rack. Back to dialing in tones for headphones.... Spent actually two days on it and was happy. Got there and instead of the expected mono mix and whatever else I've been cautioned ended up being stereo. I dug what I heard in my cans....

Here's the promo they ran for the show the rest will be on YouTube in 2 weeks...
 
Rex said:
The point is that there are differences between amps that are only audible when you turn it up. That's above and beyond acoustic feedback and room resonances (not sure what "room compression" is).
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I'm neither talking about resonances nor acoustic feedback.
Room compression is what happens when a sound source in a room and air pressure don't make nice. Same principle why a large room has less issues with low end build up since a small one.
Also I didn't say that there aren't differences I said by comparison they're negligible.
Claiming otherwise seeing that I spent a good chunk as VP at THD Electronics be crazy.
 
I like the sound I'm getting from reactive digital load boxs and good IRs, as the amp levels rise to ear popping levels, takes the room acoustics out of the equation.
 
And before I forget there's psychoachoustic stuff And the eq that the ear applies listen to the bottom string of a guitar tuned to D and the D on the highest string note lower the the volume from loud as hell to 80 some db and the difference between those notes taking what the ear does not psycho acoustic perception...is 15dB.
 
hochha said:
I like the sound I'm getting from reactive digital load boxs and good IRs, as the amp levels rise to ear popping levels, takes the room acoustics out of the equation.
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Room acoustics are never out of the equation, but Fletcher-Munson can give that perception at ear-stressing volumes.

Hell, even Fletcher-Munson falls apart when your own eardrums are clipping.
 
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One point I don't think has been addressed on this topic is how different amps sound in the mix. I tend to use the same IR's for a type of amp. For example if it is a combo amp type (Fender, Vox etc.) I will just use my go-to 2-12 IR. If it is a Marshall or other type you would typically run into a 4-12, I use my go-to 4-12. I hear moderate differences when demoed by itself. But in the mix they sound completely different than each other. The other instruments mask out certain frequencies and some frequencies that a particular amp excels at is what punches through the mix making the amps sound more different. Just EQ'ing the amps the same doesn't seem to have this same effect to my ears. I think it is just that some amps come alive at certain frequencies, and if that frequency range(s) is what you need to fit or punch through the mix, that amp will sound a lot better than another amp that doesn't excel at those frequencies.
 
If most of the amps sound very similar: wouldn’t everyone be playing a Peavey Bandit? (Which are also inexpensive, reliable, and fairly loud).

I must inhabit a parallel universe, because all the AX8 amp models I’ve spent some time with (maybe 20 so far) sound and handle different to my ears (sound different recorded, too). A Diezel will go places a Tweed Deluxe can never get to and visa versa. The AC15 model is different from a Matchless or Morgan or AC30 which are similar circuit designs. A JTM45 is a whole different animal than a Bassman even though the circuits are nearly the same. Each channel of the Dumbles or their derivatives are discernibly different and respond differently. Heck, swap in the 12AX7B for the 12AX7 in the preamp and it sounds crunchier. An EF86 has a different kind of definition when you overdrive it. So customizable, so cool.

Maybe its because I approach each amp with seeing what it can do and where it wants to go, rather than staying with just the meat and potatoes clean, crunch, lead tones (which is all some pros I know ever need): Getting the same tones out of a bunch of different amps makes no sense to me: If that's the goal: why not just use one amp?

Or maybe its because I’m usually on a slightly overdriven ride which distorts or cleans up depending on picking dynamics: which varies in character from amp to amp.

IME, all the different amp timbres in the AX8 bring up different ideas: One Dumble excursion ended up with a horn feel and I was riffing on Wayne Shorter. The Swart got me off into some North Indian keharwa I’d forgotten I'd forgotten. I, for one, really appreciate the variety and attention to authentic detail, and find it inspiring. No depression in sight.
 
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Gday,
I still don't buy it ... To me the amps are different! Sure there are some that are similar - for example some of the marshals are subtlety different, but each brand brings its own flavour.

Once again - to the op - you're using a cab and not frfr aren't you?

Thanks
Pauly
 
This whole thread makes me think about the way we choose IRs.
Maybe we'd need a favorite folder per amp in AE, so when we'd change to an amp we'd get a selection of IRs that FAS/we ourselves had setup as favorites for this one. That would allow for a faster changing of amp and cab together.
Searching for good IRs is a bit tedious and when you found some there is no technical support to it. Or is there a good solution for that?
 
I think there is indeed a big difference if you go FRFR or with a real cab.( and no cab sims of course :)) With a real cab lots of amps do sound more or less the same. I do use a real cab myself. Sometimes I wonder does everyone go FRFR because there is so little to find on good presets with a real cab....
 
yves vanmeenen said:
........ Sometimes I wonder does everyone go FRFR because there is so little to find on good presets with a real cab....
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Too many variables perhaps? Guitar and pickup type, Power Amp type and real cab type then there's the original creator's playing style and what playing volume was the preset dialled in at ...... bit of a nightmare to find a likewise user that can use the preset straight out of the box and more likely you'd get other users with non-similar equipment complaining that it doesn't sound great to them

Even the FRFR designed presets are a lottery for what will work with your guitar and your FRFR monitoring ....... the most value I've got out of the majority of them is looking at how they were set up ....... maybe tweaking some blocks to suit myself or just copying some nice FX blocks for use elsewhere ..... there's never been one FRFR preset (both commercial or free) I could say I could just plug in and play using my FRFR setup without additional tweaks.
 
yves vanmeenen said:
I think there is indeed a big difference if you go FRFR or with a real cab.( and no cab sims of course :)) With a real cab lots of amps do sound more or less the same. I do use a real cab myself. Sometimes I wonder does everyone go FRFR because there is so little to find on good presets with a real cab....
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I think all of @yek presets are setup for real cab on stage and IR for FOH.

He posts a fine collection of presets for free.
 
Rex said:
Room acoustics are never out of the equation, but Fletcher-Munson can give that perception at ear-stressing volumes.

Hell, even Fletcher-Munson falls apart when your own eardrums are clipping.
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My point was to recording using reactive load boxes and IRs direct to audio interface, running your amps hot that way you can avoid ear problems but once you play it back thru monitors then room acoustics are involved.
 
hochha said:
My point was to recording using reactive load boxes and IRs direct to audio interface, running your amps hot that way you can avoid ear problems but once you play it back thru monitors then room acoustics are involved.
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Understood. Thanks for clarifying.
 
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