12.03 firmware delay block question

Dimebucker

Dimebucker

Experienced
Hey


Can you cliff tell me ,when I was early firmware 12.0 my delay block feedback was all the way left 0.0%. And now that feedback is 12:00 clock ,if I want same like early firmware my feedback was. Must I then put that feedback 12:00 clock 0.0% or straight to the left -100%?
 
Hey

Im little confused whit that 0.0 or -100% ,because my ear there is some different whit those two settings. And I want know what settings was early firmware zero or minus 100. And what was that feedback adjust thing ,what I was see in that new firmware note description? Because there was something you must adjust feedback somewhere ,because that value have chance.

Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
0% feedback probably = 0% feedback.

what's it sound like at -100%?
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it's not about where the knob is - fully left, fully right, etc - it matters what value. a percentage is a percentage, so 0% feedback of the old method still = 0% feedback in the new method.

do you know what delay feedback is and why it's a % value?

From the manual:

FEEDBK – Sets the amount of delay feedback (a.k.a. regeneration) to determine the number of repeats.


while we're at it - what exactly does the reverse phase delay "sound like" - i'm away from my axe for a while so i won't be able to find out. would it be used on its own or mostly in conjunction with another delay or effects?
 
Hey

Thanks I must then put 12:00 clock value 0.0% ,if you say its then same value like old firmware. And what about that note what there was in 12.03 new firmware ,delay feedback have chance where is that option and what there have been chance?
 
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0.0% is the same as 0% on older firmware 0% - +100% would be the same as before ,0% - -100% would be the same feedback ,but the phase would be reversed!
 
Hey

Thanks okey I then put 0.0% value in this new firmware ,then Im same like 12.0 firmware delay feedback value was.

RDH said:
0.0% is the same as 0% on older firmware 0% - +100% would be the same as before ,0% - -100% would be the same feedback ,but the phase would be reversed!
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Haven't had time to update yet but I guess this new feedback type also means that there there is less margin to dial in precise (positive) feedback values? before you had the full knob to go from 0-100% now it is -100% to +100% for the full knob. Maybe not a big deal.
Wonder in what cases you will use negative values for feedback? Didn't see that much on other machines or pedals. Any good examples?
 
Just updated the firmware. As an addition to my post above; can someone explain the negative values for delay feedback? Just tried it out but I can not hear much difference when dialing the same amount of positive or negative feedback. What are the practical uses for it?
 
Bodde said:
Just updated the firmware. As an addition to my post above; can someone explain the negative values for delay feedback? Just tried it out but I can not hear much difference when dialing the same amount of positive or negative feedback. What are the practical uses for it?
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I'd say this is useful when you want to create custom chorus/flanger type effects with the delay block. You can also create a wider stereo image with phase inverting one side of the delay or fight phase issues with stereo->mono compatibility.

Early stereo enhancers reversed the phase of one side of the signal. If you listen to just one side, it sounds the same, but as soon as you listen to both sides, you get an extremely wide stereo image.
 
Zwiebelchen said:
I'd say this is useful when you want to create custom chorus/flanger type effects with the delay block. You can also create a wider stereo image with phase inverting one side of the delay or fight phase issues with stereo->mono compatibility.

Early stereo enhancers reversed the phase of one side of the signal. If you listen to just one side, it sounds the same, but as soon as you listen to both sides, you get an extremely wide stereo image.
Click to expand...

+1

You need to run in stereo to hear the widening effect of phase reversed delay feedback. It's really amazing. The delay trails expand far beyond the speakers. So make sure the delay comes after Amp and any other block which sums to mono (Drive, mono Cab), and make sure I/O settings are set to stereo.
 
yek said:
+1

You need to run in stereo to hear the widening effect of phase reversed delay feedback. It's really amazing. The delay trails expand far beyond the speakers. So make sure the delay comes after Amp and any other block which sums to mono (Drive, mono Cab), and make sure I/O settings are set to stereo.
Click to expand...
I want to add that this is useful if you use a mono amp/cab setup panned center (to improve the clarity of your playing in a live situation), but want the delay trail to be panned to the far left and far right side without tonal differences for the crowd standing closer to the left or right speaker.

However, as soon as you sum your signal to mono, the delay disappears, so you got to make sure that your sound man hardpans your channels. Also, you will probably lose all bass content in your delay trails like this, as the bass is usually mono (but it depends wether the bass is summed mono or left-channel only mono - the latter would still work).

Also, when listening to an inverted phase stereo signal for a long time, you might get a headache, as your mind is totally confused where the sound comes from.
 
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ok, will check that. Today I was listening listen in mono cause one of my monitors broke down. Are you saying that negative feedback only applies to the stereo delays so not to the mono delays?
 
Bodde said:
ok, will check that. Today I was listening listen in mono cause one of my monitors broke down. Are you saying that negative feedback only applies to the stereo delays so not to the mono delays?
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Negative feedback on mono delays only makes a difference when you have an extremely low delay time (i.e. in case of using the delay as a pre-delay) and will then probably only have an effect on low frequencies. It will then basicly cancel/amplify all frequencies based on f = 1/t.

So if you set the (non-inversed) delay to 0.02s (20ms, which is the typical value for pre-delays), then you will hear an increase of volume at 50Hz, 100Hz..., but an decrease of volume at 75Hz, 150Hz...
If you phase reverse that signal, the cancellation/amplification will be the opposite.


PS: I'm not 100% sure, though, it's been long since I had to deal with that topic in physics classes.
 
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