Dumb question about FM3 mark ii turbo vs axe iii

jzucker

jzucker

Experienced
other than the obvious power differences, dual amps, etc...

Are the algorithms different / better? For example, is the spring reverb more accurate on the axe iii than the FM3 mark ii turbo?

And what about the FM9 in that regard?
 
jzucker said:
Are the algorithms different / better? For example, is the spring reverb more accurate on the axe iii than the FM3 mark ii turbo?
Click to expand...
They’re the same algorithms.

jzucker said:
And what about the FM9 in that regard?
Click to expand...
They’re still the same algorithms.

Think about it this way: a spreadsheet can run on multiple different machines but will generate the exact same numbers on each. A phone, a tablet and a laptop can be used as well as a desktop computer to crunch numbers with the same results.

What differs between the modelers is listed in https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=Axe-Fx_III,_FM9_and_FM3
 
Pay attention to the effects list section of the wiki.
For example, "At the time of writing, the FM3 and FM9 may not have the most recent Pitch algorithm because of CPU constraints."
 
Firmwares arent always in sync, but the idea is they sound very close to each other. Last time I gave a more technical (and correct) answer on this fanboys lost their mind so Ill leave it as basic as that.

If you want the latest/greatest buy the flagship.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
They’re the same algorithms.


They’re still the same algorithms.

Think about it this way: a spreadsheet can run on multiple different machines but will generate the exact same numbers on each. A phone, a tablet and a laptop can be used as well as a desktop computer to crunch numbers with the same results.

What differs between the modelers is listed in https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=Axe-Fx_III,_FM9_and_FM3
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i'm a software engineer so I understand source code and compiling for different platforms.

There's something called #ifdef and unlike a spreadsheet, there's little reason a spreadsheet running on one computer would have advanced capabilities over one running on another.

#define SpringConvolution springreverbconvo.dat
#ifdef AXEFX_III
SpringConvolution = AxeFXIIISpringReverbConvo.dat
#endif

var springData = LoadConvolutionData(SpringConvolution);

Things like fourier tables could be more complex, larger in size, etc., on a platform that has more memory and more CPU bandwidth.

So, you may be right but the spreadsheet comparison is not quite right in this case...
 
jzucker said:
There's something called #ifdef and unlike a spreadsheet, there's little reason a spreadsheet running on one computer would have advanced capabilities over one running on another.
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The core algorithms across platforms, both in spreadsheets and in modeling, perform the same tasks. The icing on top of those, like charts, or as Cliff calls it, "superfluous stuff", doesn't exist, either initially because they're focusing on getting it out and then backfill later, or it's so esoteric it doesn't get ported. We get the cake, but what's stuck on top of it can vary.

And, there are lots of developers and ex-developers here, including me.
 
I believe the Axe III uses more oversampling in the Drive and Amp blocks so it will have slightly less aliasing artifacts than the FM3 will. The Axe III set to Min. Latency for its Oversampling Mode would be the same quality as the FM3 IIRC. Other than that, the algorithms are pretty much the same with the exception of the extra features supported by the III (4 cabs instead of 2, FullRes support, dual amps, tone matching block, etc.)
 
Yes, the oversampling differs, so there are subtle differences if only for that reason. However, I don't believe FAS has ever claimed the 3 models sound the same. There are very likely other minor algorithmic differences.
 
jzucker said:
other than the obvious power differences, dual amps, etc...

Are the algorithms different / better? For example, is the spring reverb more accurate on the axe iii than the FM3 mark ii turbo?

And what about the FM9 in that regard?
Click to expand...
Currently the Axe-Fx III has a different algorithm than the FM3. The Axe-Fx III algorithm is much better.

We are attempting to port the Axe-Fx III algorithm to the FM3 but the lack of horsepower is making this problematic.

The FM9 uses the same algorithms as the Axe-Fx III since it has twice the horsepower of the FM3.
 
FractalAudio said:
Currently the Axe-Fx III has a different algorithm than the FM3. The Axe-Fx III algorithm is much better.

We are attempting to port the Axe-Fx III algorithm to the FM3 but the lack of horsepower is making this problematic.

The FM9 uses the same algorithms as the Axe-Fx III since it has twice the horsepower of the FM3.
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Does this apply to the new plates as well?
 
yek said:
Yes. Simply because the Axe-Fx III 23.00 firmware release notes (Nov 2023) say "New Plate Reverb algorithm", and the latest FM3 firmware is from August 2023.
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Sorry, I was a bit unclear. I'm asking whether porting the plates is problematic as well. I don't care about spring reverb, I'd play with it for 10 minutes and then forget it exists, but I love plates.
 
Aleksi said:
Sorry, I was a bit unclear. I'm asking whether porting the plates is problematic as well. I don't care about spring reverb, I'd play with it for 10 minutes and then forget it exists, but I love plates.
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i love plates too but since I play a lot of clean jazz, the historical implications of fender amps and spring reverb is important to me. I realize that the biggest growth segment in guitar amp tech is metal/hardcore and that spring reverb (or reverb in general) is not hugely important...
 
Aleksi said:
Sorry, I was a bit unclear. I'm asking whether porting the plates is problematic as well. I don't care about spring reverb, I'd play with it for 10 minutes and then forget it exists, but I love plates.
Click to expand...

The existing plate reverb algorithm in the FM3 is already fantastic. Whereas the spring reverb has room for improvement, in the opinion of mny.
 
yek said:
The existing plate reverb algorithm in the FM3 is already fantastic. Whereas the spring reverb has room for improvement, in the opinion of mny.
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yes but it will never sound authentically like a fender amp with plate reverb. Not an issue for live playing but perhaps worth it to upgrade to an FM9 or axeIII for recording. I just prefer the smaller form factor...
 
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