How can I make amp models more... punchy?

Greg Ferguson said:
Have you tried putting a Gate/Expander somewhere after the Amp block, sidechained to Input 1?

From the Blocks Guide:

Raise the output Level to compensate for the reduced volume of soft sounds.

Also, reducing the gain in the Amp block will help improve the dynamics because the audio isn't being compressed as much.

And make sure your power amp has sufficient headroom to cleanly handle the "pop".
Click to expand...
I do run the amp gain as low as I can stand, I do try to keep the model gain in line with the amp gain. Not by number on the dial, but by amount of sustain and compression.

Given that I am A/B'ing the amp and model through the exact same system, it's not a headroom thing. I've definitely run to the end of my understanding of the models. What model parameters might affect this?

So far I've got
Amp gain - keep as low as possible
Amp speaker impedance - I've tried a few. Possibly I need to try them all.
Output compressor in amp block - I've not tried this yet.
Thump on amp speaker page - I've not tried yet
Punch the listener - I so want to do this
 
elvis said:
I get more punch with the real amp. I run both at the exact same volume. It's definitely NOT a "you must play louder" thing. I've A/B'd MANY amps and models this way. I have gotten amp models to sound VERY like the real amp. The dynamics are the thing that has eluded me.
Click to expand...

Mic your amp and play it back through a clean system. Will it still have more punch than the modeler? Just asking because I don’t know.
 
Well, ChatGPT says:

You said:​

How can I make the tones in my Axe-FX III more punchy?

ChatGPT said:​

Getting a more punchy tone in the Axe-FX III requires a combination of amp settings, speaker dynamics, and some advanced tweaking. Here’s a breakdown of areas to focus on:

1. Amp Block Adjustments​

  • Input Trim: Increase slightly for more attack without adding too much gain.
  • Master Volume: If using a non-MV amp model, balance it to avoid unwanted compression.
  • Negative Feedback: Higher values can tighten and add clarity to the tone.
  • Power Amp Hardness: Increasing this can make the power amp response more percussive.
  • Supply Sag: Lower values give a faster transient response, increasing punch.
  • Dynamic Presence & Dynamic Depth: Adding a little of both (1.0–2.0) enhances the low-end and high-end attack.

2. Speaker Impedance Adjustments​

  • Speaker Compression: Lower values (0.2–0.5) keep transients sharp instead of squashing them.
  • Speaker Drive: Reduce this to avoid excessive low-end bloom.
  • Speaker Resonance Curve: Match it to the cab type; a well-matched curve enhances punch.

3. EQ & Filtering​

  • Low Cut (Pre-Gain): Set around 80–120Hz to remove flabbiness.
  • High Cut (Post-Gain): Keep around 8-12kHz to avoid harshness but retain presence.
  • Dynamic EQ: Add a band around 100Hz & 1-2kHz to boost attack when palm muting.

4. Compressor & Enhancer​

  • Input Compressor (AMP BLOCK): Try "FAST" with a ratio of 2:1 to add controlled punch.
  • Enhancer Block: If using, stick to Classic mode with Mix <20% to widen the sound slightly without losing focus.

5. IR & Cab Tweaks​

  • IR Choice: Use a tight, dynamic IR (Mesa V30, ML Sound Lab, York Audio, etc.).
  • Proximity Effect: Reduce it slightly to prevent excess boominess.
  • Mic Blend: Try mixing an SM57 (mid punch) with a R121 or MD421 (low-mid clarity).

6. Pick Attack & Playing Style​

  • Use a thicker pick and harder attack for increased articulation.
  • If palm muting, focus on tightness and consistent pressure to maximize percussiveness.

7. Boost & Drive Blocks​

  • TS808: Low Drive, High Level (~6-8) for added tightness before the amp.
  • Horizon Devices Precision Drive: Boost with a Tight knob at ~4-6 for extra punch.
  • EQ Boost: A small 1-2dB boost around 1.5kHz can help cut through.
Would you like me to help tweak a specific amp model you're working with?
 
elvis said:
Output compressor in amp block - I've not tried this yet.
Click to expand...
That will reduce the pop or punch because it’s compressing the sound.
elvis said:
Thump on amp speaker page - I've not tried yet
Click to expand...
I'm not sure that will help either. The parameters are really designed for FRFR cabs at lower volume. If you’re using a real cab, turn up the volume and the speakers will naturally thump. See Thump in the Amp Block page in the Wiki for more information.
 
GlennO said:
Well, ChatGPT says:

You said:​

How can I make the tones in my Axe-FX III more punchy?

ChatGPT said:​

Getting a more punchy tone in the Axe-FX III requires a combination of amp settings, speaker dynamics, and some advanced tweaking. Here’s a breakdown of areas to focus on:

1. Amp Block Adjustments​

  • Input Trim: Increase slightly for more attack without adding too much gain.
  • Master Volume: If using a non-MV amp model, balance it to avoid unwanted compression.
  • Negative Feedback: Higher values can tighten and add clarity to the tone.
  • Power Amp Hardness: Increasing this can make the power amp response more percussive.
  • Supply Sag: Lower values give a faster transient response, increasing punch.
  • Dynamic Presence & Dynamic Depth: Adding a little of both (1.0–2.0) enhances the low-end and high-end attack.

2. Speaker Impedance Adjustments​

  • Speaker Compression: Lower values (0.2–0.5) keep transients sharp instead of squashing them.
  • Speaker Drive: Reduce this to avoid excessive low-end bloom.
  • Speaker Resonance Curve: Match it to the cab type; a well-matched curve enhances punch.

3. EQ & Filtering​

  • Low Cut (Pre-Gain): Set around 80–120Hz to remove flabbiness.
  • High Cut (Post-Gain): Keep around 8-12kHz to avoid harshness but retain presence.
  • Dynamic EQ: Add a band around 100Hz & 1-2kHz to boost attack when palm muting.

4. Compressor & Enhancer​

  • Input Compressor (AMP BLOCK): Try "FAST" with a ratio of 2:1 to add controlled punch.
  • Enhancer Block: If using, stick to Classic mode with Mix <20% to widen the sound slightly without losing focus.

5. IR & Cab Tweaks​

  • IR Choice: Use a tight, dynamic IR (Mesa V30, ML Sound Lab, York Audio, etc.).
  • Proximity Effect: Reduce it slightly to prevent excess boominess.
  • Mic Blend: Try mixing an SM57 (mid punch) with a R121 or MD421 (low-mid clarity).

6. Pick Attack & Playing Style​

  • Use a thicker pick and harder attack for increased articulation.
  • If palm muting, focus on tightness and consistent pressure to maximize percussiveness.

7. Boost & Drive Blocks​

  • TS808: Low Drive, High Level (~6-8) for added tightness before the amp.
  • Horizon Devices Precision Drive: Boost with a Tight knob at ~4-6 for extra punch.
  • EQ Boost: A small 1-2dB boost around 1.5kHz can help cut through.
Would you like me to help tweak a specific amp model you're working with?
Click to expand...
Sweet! The amp I'm working on is here (not scene 1, scene 3 is the one I'm working on)
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/slo-30-preset.211682/
 

You said:​

Sweet! I'm using the Solo 100 Lead model. Please provide more details to fine-tune it further.

ChatGPT said:​

Below is a deeper dive into fine-tuning your Solo 100 Lead tone on the Axe‑FX III. These adjustments focus on optimizing gain structure, dynamics, EQ, and cab simulation for enhanced clarity and punch:

1. Dialing in the Amp Block​

  • Input Drive & Overdrive:
    • Start with Input Drive around 5.0. If you need extra saturation without muddying the tone, gradually increase Overdrive (e.g., 7.5–8.5).
    • Watch for excessive breakup—keeping it balanced helps preserve articulation.
  • Bias Settings:
    • Preamp Bias: Aim for about 0.6–0.7. A slightly higher bias adds saturation, while a lower value can help the attack stand out.
    • Bias Excursion: Try values between 0.1–0.3. Lower settings tighten the response, making your pick attack more defined.
  • Dynamic Controls:
    • Dynamic Presence (+2 to +4): Enhances the upper harmonics and gives the tone more bite.
    • Dynamic Depth (+1 to +3): Controls the low-end “thump.” Lowering it a bit can reduce any excessive boominess.
  • Sag:
    • Reducing Sag (e.g., 3.0–4.0) tightens the overall feel. Less sag typically results in a snappier, more immediate response.

2. Refining the EQ & Tone Shaping​

  • Basic EQ Curve:
    • Bass: Set around 3.5–4.5. This range tightens the low end without losing body.
    • Mid: Boost slightly (around 5.0–6.5) to help your tone cut through a mix—this is crucial for that lead definition.
    • Treble & Presence: Adjust between 6.5–7.5 to accentuate attack and clarity.
  • Post‑EQ Adjustments:
    • High-Pass Filter: Set between 80–120 Hz to clean up any low-end rumble.
    • Low-Pass Filter: Around 7–10 kHz to smooth off any harsh highs while keeping enough edge.
    • Targeted Boost/Cut:
      – A subtle boost around 1.5–2.5 kHz emphasizes pick attack and presence.
      – A gentle cut between 250–400 Hz can reduce muddiness without sacrificing warmth.

3. Optimizing the Cab Simulation​

  • Cab Block & IR Selection:
    • Try different cab IRs that are designed for high-gain tones. A 4x12 with V30s is popular for its tight, punchy low end.
    • Experiment with the Speaker Impedance Curve: Start with a “Modern” setting, or tweak a “Custom” curve by reducing the low‑resonance peak (around 50–60%).
  • Mic Choice & Positioning:
    • Emulate a combination of an SM57 and a ribbon mic (like an R121) to capture both bite and warmth.
    • Use a proximity setting between 0.5–1.5—closer mic positions will emphasize midrange attack while keeping the lows in check.
  • Speaker Drive & Compression:
    • Keep Speaker Drive moderate (around 0.2–0.6) so it adds a bit of warmth without softening transients too much.
    • Adjust Speaker Compression (e.g., 0.3–0.5) to maintain a dynamic response that preserves your initial attack.

4. Enhancing Dynamics with Compression​

  • Input Dynamics Block:
    • A slight boost (0.2–0.5) can help make the transient peaks more defined, ensuring your initial attack is heard clearly.
  • Additional Compressor Settings:
    • Attack: Set to a moderate speed (around 30–50ms) so the initial transient isn’t squashed.
    • Release: A setting between 100–200ms keeps the compression natural and avoids a pumping effect.
    • Ratio: A gentle ratio (2:1 to 4:1) can help control peaks without sacrificing dynamics.

5. Player Technique and Final Tweaks​

  • Pick Attack & Pickup Height:
    • Remember that even with the perfect settings, your playing dynamics matter—experiment with a harder pick attack or a thicker pick (around 1.0mm or more).
    • Adjust your guitar’s pickup height to balance output; too close can be boomy, while too far may lose some definition.
  • Iterate and Listen:
    • Make small incremental changes and listen critically. The Solo 100 Lead is a responsive model, so subtle tweaks can make a big difference.
By fine-tuning each block—from the amp’s drive characteristics and bias settings to the detailed EQ and cab simulation—you can sculpt a Solo 100 Lead tone that’s punchy, articulate, and well-suited for high-gain applications. Experiment with these parameters to dial in the exact feel you’re after, and don’t hesitate to revisit each section as you refine your sound.
 
GlennO said:
Well, ChatGPT says:

You said:​

How can I make the tones in my Axe-FX III more punchy?

ChatGPT said:​

Getting a more punchy tone in the Axe-FX III requires a combination of amp settings, speaker dynamics, and some advanced tweaking. Here’s a breakdown of areas to focus on:

1. Amp Block Adjustments​

  • Input Trim: Increase slightly for more attack without adding too much gain.
  • Master Volume: If using a non-MV amp model, balance it to avoid unwanted compression.
  • Negative Feedback: Higher values can tighten and add clarity to the tone.
  • Power Amp Hardness: Increasing this can make the power amp response more percussive.
  • Supply Sag: Lower values give a faster transient response, increasing punch.
  • Dynamic Presence & Dynamic Depth: Adding a little of both (1.0–2.0) enhances the low-end and high-end attack.

2. Speaker Impedance Adjustments​

  • Speaker Compression: Lower values (0.2–0.5) keep transients sharp instead of squashing them.
  • Speaker Drive: Reduce this to avoid excessive low-end bloom.
  • Speaker Resonance Curve: Match it to the cab type; a well-matched curve enhances punch.

3. EQ & Filtering​

  • Low Cut (Pre-Gain): Set around 80–120Hz to remove flabbiness.
  • High Cut (Post-Gain): Keep around 8-12kHz to avoid harshness but retain presence.
  • Dynamic EQ: Add a band around 100Hz & 1-2kHz to boost attack when palm muting.

4. Compressor & Enhancer​

  • Input Compressor (AMP BLOCK): Try "FAST" with a ratio of 2:1 to add controlled punch.
  • Enhancer Block: If using, stick to Classic mode with Mix <20% to widen the sound slightly without losing focus.

5. IR & Cab Tweaks​

  • IR Choice: Use a tight, dynamic IR (Mesa V30, ML Sound Lab, York Audio, etc.).
  • Proximity Effect: Reduce it slightly to prevent excess boominess.
  • Mic Blend: Try mixing an SM57 (mid punch) with a R121 or MD421 (low-mid clarity).

6. Pick Attack & Playing Style​

  • Use a thicker pick and harder attack for increased articulation.
  • If palm muting, focus on tightness and consistent pressure to maximize percussiveness.

7. Boost & Drive Blocks​

  • TS808: Low Drive, High Level (~6-8) for added tightness before the amp.
  • Horizon Devices Precision Drive: Boost with a Tight knob at ~4-6 for extra punch.
  • EQ Boost: A small 1-2dB boost around 1.5kHz can help cut through.
Would you like me to help tweak a specific amp model you're working with?
Click to expand...
Wow, we carbon units are near obsolete LOL!

That's pretty good!
 
Wow man. This AI thing is getting smarter. Pretty wild. I have no doubt some of that training came from this forum.
 
I’m glad you’re making every effort to compare apples to apples, 99% of posts like this are people comparing the modeler through some $50 headphones or a plastic PA speaker to their 412 guitar cab and asking why they don’t sound the same.

Can you put a looper early in your signal chain, record some riffing into the looper, and run that through the fractal amp and real amp so we can hear the differences you’re describing?
 
OK, did a more thorough survey of speaker impedance. Currents faves:
1x12 G12T-75
2x12 5153 Stealth
2x12 Recto
Hipower Lindsey B
Load Box LB2 UK

Altogether it's VERY subtle, with some being noticeably not what I want.
 
strabes said:
I’m glad you’re making every effort to compare apples to apples, 99% of posts like this are people comparing the modeler through some $50 headphones or a plastic PA speaker to their 412 guitar cab and asking why they don’t sound the same.

Can you put a looper early in your signal chain, record some riffing into the looper, and run that through the fractal amp and real amp so we can hear the differences you’re describing?
Click to expand...
I could, though I have to open my DAW...

I don't know if the difference would be audible after Soundcloud's algorithm killed all the dynamics. I will say it's SUPER subtle. I'm going after that last 1%. I think I got partway there tonight with a different speaker impedance and a bit more work on the tone controls.
 

You said:​

Is much of what you suggested total B.S.?

ChatGPT said:​

Nope, it’s all legit! Everything I suggested is based on how the Axe-FX III models real amp behavior, speaker interactions, and dynamics processing. The Solo 100 Lead (Soldano SLO-100 model) is already a high-gain beast, but subtle tweaks can make a big difference in how punchy and articulate it feels.
Of course, not every suggestion will be necessary for your specific setup—some things are worth experimenting with, and some might not make a huge difference depending on your playing style, pickups, and cabinet IRs. But if you’re trying to get more punch, the key factors are:
✅ Tightening the low end (bass settings, impedance curve, drive pedal)
✅ Enhancing transients (bias excursion, sag, dynamics, compressor attack)
✅ Refining the mids (EQ sculpting, mic choice, presence tweaks)
If anything feels off or unnecessary, let me know what’s working (or not), and we can fine-tune further! 🤘🎸
 
elvis said:
I get more punch with the real amp. I run both at the exact same volume. It's definitely NOT a "you must play louder" thing. I've A/B'd MANY amps and models this way. I have gotten amp models to sound VERY like the real amp. The dynamics are the thing that has eluded me.
Click to expand...
Use the Input Dynamics in Amp block last page. Turn that up to .25 or even .50 or more -- the amp will react more to your touch.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom