Development with the next firmware

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Chromatizm said:
But I paid for a finished product, and never ever expected them to put any more efforts in it than what was available at day one.
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If you take this view (which I definitely do) then the updates are most definitely gifts you should be thankful for, in my opinion.

While Fractal has a long track record of providing frequent and amazing updates for all of their products for a long time, you paid for what you got: an outstanding piece of gear even if there's never another update.

There's nothing written on the product pages that expresses either explicit or implied free firmware updates.

I'd be willing to bet that a large percentage of users are not aware of the update history or have any expectations regarding them when they make a purchase.
 
Chromatizm said:
I didn't even mention it. I was talking about NDSP promises.
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Sorry, my bad. I misunderstood it.

Chromatizm said:
But yeah, that is also a great example that "the product is ready when its ready". They just tried to made even more money - this is exactly what you call business is business.
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Not really. The word "business" doesn't mean "made poorly". It just means that all the actions are about making it successful. Not all actions are the right ones.
Chromatizm said:
The price in EU is not of their making. Their original price is fair. We need to talk to whole different people about taxes and other stuff in EU.
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Then I don't understand, does Helix cost 400 in US? Because I thought it was in the same price range probably? 1000 maybe?
Chromatizm said:
Quite the opposite, I've mentioned this is their choice to stay the top dog.
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And this is why we choose them, right?
Chromatizm said:
But they'd be that dog on the original version of the FW which was sold with the unit.
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Don't think so. They added many actually crucial features, like Setlists. Or gapless switching. It is an important thing for many people, including me. Yes, there are workarounds, but workarounds are not neat and have some other flaws. Also, having a potential "more models" thing is very important for many people, because they choose to buy a unit if it finally gets the amp they need. The one that might replace their real amp.


Chromatizm said:
Competitors don't upgrade their algorithms, so there would be no danger to Fractal reign anyway. They are just way ahead of the competition, way way ahead, and need to do nothing to stay there.
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That's a very deceiving feeling in business. You can never stay. This gap gets small surprisingly quick :)

Chromatizm said:
Little to no chance that it's your and my money are the reason for them to push the envelope.
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Not mine or yours personally. But everyone who buys it. Including stars, who choose it to replace their expensive stacks and hence promote the FA further. And FA would not be able to cover more and more joining cases if it wouldn't add updates.
 
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unix-guy said:
If you take this view (which I definitely do) then the updates are most definitely gifts you should be thankful for, in my opinion.
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For the record - I do too! I've used enough software and hardware products, and was involved in development of more than a few to know that this business model is not something which a customer can take for granted.
unix-guy said:
I'd be willing to bet that a large percentage of users are not aware of the update history or have any expectations regarding them when they make a purchase.
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I was one of them!
gaaarfild said:
Not really. The word "business" doesn't mean "made poorly"
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Oh, by the word "business" I mean "we require more minerals", if you catch my drift.
It's really refreshing to see someone doing business not with this only thought in mind.
gaaarfild said:
Then I don't understand, does Helix cost 400 in US? Because I thought it was in the same price range probably? 1000 maybe?
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Their flagship is Helix Floor. It's price competes with FM9 in US, not FM3.
gaaarfild said:
They added many actually crucial features, like Setlists. Or gapless switching. It is an important thing for many people, including me.
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I get this, I do. Some of them important for me too. Except for the gapless, which not all competitors have anyway, it's still better than the rest, both sound, effects and feature-wise. And those who have gapless are not this good sounding.
Not a hard choice for a tone connoisseur!
gaaarfild said:
That's a very deceiving feeling in business. You can never stay. This gap gets small surprisingly quick :)
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I definitely share this sentiment, but FW1 Ares still beats them all years after the release.
So I start to suspect there is some magic powder involved!
 
I sometimes wonder if the FM3 would be cheaper had Cliff not have to budget for the data (bytes) for such counter-productive discussion.

No, those posting funny memes are not feeling entitled.
Yes, if you post something on a public forum, it’s open to interpretation.

Let’s wait for the next update.
 
Chromatizm said:
For the record - I do too! I've used enough software and hardware products, and was involved in development of more than a few to know that this business model is not something which a customer can take for granted.
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Please don't get me wrong. I never said or implied that this should be taken for granted. I am strongly advocating for acknowledgment of such a way of doing things and I think they are doing everything absolutely right and great! Love them for all of this.
And I am myself a software developer, so I know what it costs to do all of that.
 
One benefit to moving the newest amp model updates into the FM3 firmware release and holding off until both are ready:
It helps us get the FM3 and FM9 version numbers one step closer to being in sync, which is gratifying on an OCD level.
 
thepacifist20130 said:
I sometimes wonder if the FM3 would be cheaper had Cliff not have to budget for the data (bytes) for such counter-productive discussion.

No, those posting funny memes are not feeling entitled.
Yes, if you post something on a public forum, it’s open to interpretation.

Let’s wait for the next update.
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I suspect active user forums generate interest and buzz for a product + can be a cost effective exposure mechanism regardless of whether the posts are thoughtful insights, helpful instruction, relentless arguing, obsessive nitpicking, or dumbass shit.
 
IronSean said:
One benefit to moving the newest amp model updates into the FM3 firmware release and holding off until both are ready:
It helps us get the FM3 and FM9 version numbers one step closer to being in sync, which is gratifying on an OCD level.
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Yes! I feel ya!

Those are the two units that I own, and whose presets get shared between them. Which is what I said about 400 posts ago when I was talking about ‘wouldn’t it be nice if they updated at the same time’ yadda yadda. 🤣🤣

It’s important to me that the shared presets have the same amps and effects, whenever possible.
 
I feel like this community should be sending the FAS office homemade cookies more often or something. Or science lab, or classified deep underground military research facility or whatever they work on this stuff in.

Maybe we’ll draw straws for who has to approach the front gate. The penitent man will pass, the penitent man will pass…
 
Mmmmmmmmmm. Cookies.

Cookies Baking GIF
 
RifferMcDuck said:
I feel like this community should be sending the FAS office homemade cookies more often or something.
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IIRC, Cliff appreciates donations to cat shelters (or one near him?), but I too wish we could do things to personally pleasure him -- I mean w/o him losing his marriage :p or, God forbid, behaving on the forum...! ;)
I guess you can at least send cards 'n' stuff to the company address. Does he collect something besides amps?
Just imagine how he could entertain us with daily unboxing videos! :sweatsmile:
 
We're buying the products and are participating in + enjoying the evolution - I'm guessing that in itself is quite sufficient appreciation - in both directions.

Edit: (before the flames come lol): But more / other forms of appreciation in either direction isn't a bad thing either.
 
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