Total noob. Plexi model sounds nothing like a Plexi?

W

woodbutcher65

Inspired
Today's day 1 with my new (to me) Axe-FX II.

There's a youtube video where a guy gives a tutorial on getting EVH's brown sound.

I've followed it as exactly as I can given the difference in firmware revisions between his rig and mine. (I updated mine to current, Quantum 9.04.)

I've done a full reset to factory settings.

I'm aware of how to enable or disable the cabinet emulation in the block screen.

I've gone through the whole video and copied over every setting (allowing for the fact that some
settings are different) and it's just not the same tone, not at all.

This 50 watt plexi setting sounds nothing like the one in the video?

In fact it doesn't sound like a plexi at all.

I found some settings to change that got rid of all digital clipping. But still, no joy.

Got any hints, tips, suggestions, etc, for a new user?

I know I'll get it eventually. I refuse to believe that my amp can't get that sound.
 
upload your preset and post the video you watched so we have an idea how to help. use the EXPORT button on the top right of Axe-Edit and upload the resulting file here.
 
The guitar is a Les Paul (essentially, I make my own guitars) and the amplifier I'm using is a 50 WPC Alesis feeding an Avatar 2x12 with reissue Greenbacks. Bridge pickup is a JB, neck is a 59, currently only worried about the bridge pickup. Its tone is very PAF-ish so that is not the issue.

Simply selecting the 50 watt plexi model and doing nothing else at all should get me a lot closer to the desired tone in this case. What I'm getting bears no resemblance to the expected plexi tone even ignoring the nuances of Eddie's specific setup.

I've never attempted to make a video and uploaded it. I'll have to figure out how to do that.

Forgive my playing in advance. I'm a hack. I don't practice as much as I should.
 
woodbutcher65 said:
The guitar is a Les Paul (essentially, I make my own guitars) and the amplifier I'm using is a 50 WPC Alesis feeding an Avatar 2x12 with reissue Greenbacks. Bridge pickup is a JB, neck is a 59, currently only worried about the bridge pickup. Its tone is very PAF-ish so that is not the issue.

Simply selecting the 50 watt plexi model and doing nothing else at all should get me a lot closer to the desired tone in this case. What I'm getting bears no resemblance to the expected plexi tone even ignoring the nuances of Eddie's specific setup.

I've never attempted to make a video and uploaded it. I'll have to figure out how to do that.

Forgive my playing in advance. I'm a hack. I don't practice as much as I should.
Click to expand...
I didn’t ask you to make a video.

Please upload the preset you are using, and show us the video you watched.

It seems you’re running through a real guitar cab. Have you setup the Axe-Fx like the manual suggests when using a real cab?
 
Gotcha.
I don't have enough posts yet to add links. But, the video is titled "Van Halen Brown Sound in 10 minutes -- Step By Step -- Axe-Fx II"

I started with preset number 191, exactly copying the video, because, why not? I didn't care much for that sound anyway.

I'll do the rest tomorrow. It's late and I'm not much of a night owl these days.


 
Hi woodbutcher and welcome!
If you're creating the preset exactly, make sure you aren't including the cab block (or bypass it). As you are using a 2x12 cab, it'll sound like crap if you have a cab in the preset.
Thanks
Pauly
 
Yes, the cab is bypassed. When I turn my computer back on I'll upload the preset I'm working with.

Or....maybe someone would be so kind as to post a file that definitely has that "Brown sound" for me to download and try?

Or both...
 
Tried it with the 50W Hi 2, given similar guitars, it sounds the same. But it's a heavily modified plexi to fit a certain IR mix, so why should it sound like a stock plexi in your own cab?
 
I found it, and I learned that unlike the last amp I was using, this is modelled so accurately that I was missing something very important: Master volume setting. I can't afford to disturb the neighbors so I never crank it up. With this amp, if you don't crank up the master you don't get the tone of a cranked amp.

So I've had to drop the input gains on the power amp almost to nothing and then crank the master, and now things are sounding a lot more like I think they should. But I still have a long way to go and much to learn.
 
If you are using a solid state amplifier to a real cab, and you want the most authentic plexi sound possible, do this:

Load up an empty preset.
Just add an amp block. Select the plexi amp model.
In the amp block, turn down the speaker compression knob to 0. Speaker compression only gives authentic results with cab Ir's, not real cabs.
Adjust the "Speaker" page, by ear, to fit your cab. Real amps are naturally affected by the speaker load. A modeller cannot know what speaker is connected, so you have to set these settings manually for authentic results.

There ya go. An authentic sounding plexi.
Now EQ to you liking, in the basic page.
 
speedloader said:
Tried it with the 50W Hi 2, given similar guitars, it sounds the same. But it's a heavily modified plexi to fit a certain IR mix, so why should it sound like a stock plexi in your own cab?
Click to expand...

The first preset I tried with the 50W Hi (1 or 2) sounds so far off, in my setup, that I know I'm doing something wrong.

In the past I've had a variety of Fenders, two Mesas, (SOB and Mark II), and a few other amps and even though I could swap between Celestion and EV cabinets you could still hear that you were playing the same amp. Even though an EVM-12L and a Greenback are very different speakers. What I was getting with the first preset was so far off the Plexi sound I expected that I would never think it WAS a Plexi model. Not blaming the model. Blaming my total noob level of experience.
 
I'm not familiar with your amp but it sounds like something is not jiving. I would try adding a cab block and listen thru some headphones to some of the factory plexi sounds just to get a baseline
 
woodbutcher65 said:
I found it, and I learned that unlike the last amp I was using, this is modelled so accurately that I was missing something very important: Master volume setting. I can't afford to disturb the neighbors so I never crank it up. With this amp, if you don't crank up the master you don't get the tone of a cranked amp.

So I've had to drop the input gains on the power amp almost to nothing and then crank the master, and now things are sounding a lot more like I think they should. But I still have a long way to go and much to learn.
Click to expand...

It sounds like you have the Axe FX turned up too loud. Your power amp that's powering your cabinet doesn't need to be that sensitive. Remember you can turn the volume down on the Axe Fx, as well. I recommend setting the volume on the patch first, and then control the Output Level knobs on the front Panel.

The best way to accurately set the volume of your patch is to press the UTILITY button on the front of the Axe FX, use the Page buttons to go to the right until you're on the VU Meters tab. You should see horizontal meters. Start playing guitar and start turning the Quick Access Knob A to set the volume Level of Amp Block 1. Quick Access Knob B controls the volume Level of Amp Block 2. Set it so the meters are hovering around the 0dB line.

Once you have the patch volume set properly, adjust the Output Level knob on the front panel to taste. This knob doesn't affect tone at all. It's purely volume.
 
Welcome wood butcher. Keep at it. The Axe is not really a plug in and play device, especially if you have a certain specific sound you are chasing. It does take some work, but when you finally get the sound you want, it is sonic bliss.
 
That's pretty much what I expect. This thing is not for the casual player who just wants to flip a switch, turn a knob, and jam. It's an expert level device and there is a LEARNING CURVE to it.

I build guitars. Some people assemble Strat kits and say they're guitar makers. I buy raw lumber and go crazy,
and the difference is kind of like that. More work, more thought, more attention to detail, better results.

OK, I guess I AM a casual player but I'm also a tone freak and a total tech head. So...this is gonna work for me.

I was starting out, like I usually do, with the power amp's inputs cranked wide open and starting with the Fractal's output way low. But what vintage Marshall sounds good with its master volume down around 1 or 2? It's got to breathe to sound good but that doesn't mean it has to be dimed.

I realize I'm not making a big distinction between the model's volume and master volume controls (as applicable) and the output level, but I'm playing with all of these to see how it all works and affects tone.

So I've made those changes. Power amp's inputs turned down, Fractal's output turned up a good way. This obviously is a better sounding approach.

This thing is just not aimed at a bedroom commando like me. It's oriented toward the working musician so I have to THINK like a working musician when figuring out how to make it sound like what I want.
 
woodbutcher65 said:
This thing is just not aimed at a bedroom commando like me. It's oriented toward the working musician so I have to THINK like a working musician when figuring out how to make it sound like what I want.
Click to expand...

Sure it is. I play in my bedroom with it almost everyday, either plugged directly into studio monitors or sometimes an actual guitar cabinet (with a solid state power amp). At bedroom volume.

If you're just playing in your bedroom, I would just use your power amp that powers your guitar cab as just a simple volume control. I wouldn't rely on it as a source of guitar tone. Let the Axe FX do the power amp tone.

I personally found the Axe FX easy to use, but I've been using guitar modelers for 15 years. The Axe FX looks super complex, but if you just focus on basic features (patch volume, output volume, gain/bass/mid/treble/presence/master volume, basic tabs on other effects blocks) you'll be fine. Ignore all of the advanced parameters for now and just enjoy the controls on the Axe FX as if it were a real tube amp. I've had mine for about 3 years now and I do 95% of my tone shaping with basic parameters and cabinet impulses.
 
woodbutcher65 said:
I found it, and I learned that unlike the last amp I was using, this is modelled so accurately that I was missing something very important: Master volume setting. I can't afford to disturb the neighbors so I never crank it up. With this amp, if you don't crank up the master you don't get the tone of a cranked amp.

So I've had to drop the input gains on the power amp almost to nothing and then crank the master, and now things are sounding a lot more like I think they should. But I still have a long way to go and much to learn.
Click to expand...

if you turn up the master volume of the amp,, turn down amp level to compensate. it won't change the tone.

all the plexis have the master volume set at 10 by default. leave it there.
 
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