low pass filters

M

mousey

Member
How many of you use the filters aggressively in the cab block for frfr playing live. EG high cut to as low as 1500hz-4000hz to tame those high frequencies that really stand out and thin out the sound at loud volumes, as well as sounding more like "amp in the room."

I know many of you roll off the tops but how aggressive do you go. (I know it depends on the cab, but e.g. a bright sounding cab, will you slash heaps off the top).
Usual suspects for low cut may be around 80hz-110hz but Im more interested in your high cuts for live.
 
I usually cut everything below 100hz and everything above 8k. Sometimes I have to go to 4k because of the glass like shrill of some presets. What I find most often, now that I stopped micing the cab, is once I get the tone, to what I feel is perfect in the cab, I have to do some serious EQ to channel 1 going to FOH. This has always puzzled me, as I never had an issue when I mic'd the cab. Yesterday I raised my cab to ear level, after reading it is a good idea to tweak tone, I found every preset was too tinny and glass like, with no bass at all. Put the cab back on the ground and because of acoustics, it sounded fine. That bothered me because we are on stages and the cab is always ear level to the crowd. I've experienced this with all 3 of my cabs, 4 x 12, 2 x 12 and FRFR.
 
Tommy Tempest said:
I usually cut everything below 100hz and everything above 8k. Sometimes I have to go to 4k because of the glass like shrill of some presets. What I find most often, now that I stopped micing the cab, is once I get the tone, to what I feel is perfect in the cab, I have to do some serious EQ to channel 1 going to FOH. This has always puzzled me, as I never had an issue when I mic'd the cab. Yesterday I raised my cab to ear level, after reading it is a good idea to tweak tone, I found every preset was too tinny and glass like, with no bass at all. Put the cab back on the ground and because of acoustics, it sounded fine. That bothered me because we are on stages and the cab is always ear level to the crowd. I've experienced this with all 3 of my cabs, 4 x 12, 2 x 12 and FRFR.
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Thats guitar cabs for you! There is a reason sound guys hate guitar cabs. "In the room tone" pretty much only sounds good off axis.
 
mousey said:
How many of you use the filters aggressively in the cab block for frfr playing live. EG high cut to as low as 1500hz-4000hz to tame those high frequencies that really stand out and thin out the sound at loud volumes, as well as sounding more like "amp in the room."

I know many of you roll off the tops but how aggressive do you go. (I know it depends on the cab, but e.g. a bright sounding cab, will you slash heaps off the top).
Usual suspects for low cut may be around 80hz-110hz but Im more interested in your high cuts for live.
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I cut down to 4000 pretty often but lately I have been cutting presence a pit more and leaving the low pass up around 6000-7000 there is some nice stuff happening up there that I ended up missing.
 
lwknives said:
Thats guitar cabs for you! There is a reason sound guys hate guitar cabs. "In the room tone" pretty much only sounds good off axis.
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Actually I've used both FRFR and guitar. I get the same reaction from both, when on or off axis. Could be my ears.
 
I use low pass filters a lot to cut the ear piercing highs that frequently come out of these presets. Usually I need to go down to 3800. But then it often sounds like there's a blanket over the amp. Its very frustrating to get the right balance. I'd like to know where the heck the ear piercing highs are and create some notch filters to kill them. Has anyone figured this out??
 
My mesa presets go down to about 4800.
I regularly cut 7500. Sometimes I'll get brave and cut way more but I think it's bad practice. That's just what my mind is telling me even though my ears are saying " ah it's cool 5-6k is good"
 
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I think the lowest I have ever had to go was 6K but most of the time I'm pretty good around 9-10k and I'm pretty much cut at 80 always.
 
Thanks for all the replies guys. As standard practice, I regularly cut between 5.5khh to 6khz and low cut around 90hz. These guidelines are just for playing live at volume and not to be confused with me just jamming on headphones or bedroom volume through hifi/studio speakers as some users do but don't detail their context. Lately I have experimented with a new mesa cab from the bi polar pack, but have found all the IR's too high end and shrill/thin. (again only for frfr with volume)

I was starting to like what I was doing with a drastic cut at 3.3khz and 90hz. It wasn't loud volume but it was a starting point at studio volume before I go into a rehearsal studio and turn up and decide if it's a keeper. Initially, it reminded me of the sound of an amp in the room. My quest is for that sound but coming from the speaker aiming directly at ear level from the CLR's. This way I will eliminate the on axis/off axis sound difference going into the pa and will not blow any heads off in the audience as has been the case for many users over the years.
sThe goal is to hear the same sound regardless of the perspective i.e. performer or audience. I will note that I am feeling confident that I am close to getting to where I want to be hence my curiosity to the original question. I used to go to the advanced speaker parameter section and cut down the low res/hi res etc but with v7.02 I am just adjusting the basic amp controls but still always adding cuts in the cab block filters @12db slope. I welcome anymore feedback with any specifics that has worked for you.
 
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I hope this thread continues to get some feedback because the hi cut value is something that's really difficult to not get wrong.
It's like looking at the sky and asking "is it blue enough"
 
Yeah, So many users talk about fav presets and at times, some may mention the cabs. Perhaps there are more people playing the axe fx in a studio/bedroom/low volume/headphone setup when they post comments? I have the axe covered in the recording setup, it sounds fantastic and totally authentic sounding, but as mentioned before, my quest is to get it to sound killer live. For the record, I am pretty happy with my live sound but I know I can extract the last 5-10% that will make it totally conniving to me.
 
ConnorGilks said:
I really depends. I don't like to roll off too much high end, and I don't have to if I've chosen the right IR. A lot of people overcompensate for resonant frequencies in the 2-6kHz range with severe LPF's, but that's a band-aid solution and you lose the nice "air" to the sound.

I've gone as high as 15kHz and as low as 6.5kHz. Whatever gets the job done!
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What IR has tickled your fancy that sounds right from the get go?
 
I've never went past 6kHz and that was just for a filler track. If you're having trouble with highs, then you need to look elsewhere. Pickups, speakers, microphones, ect.

You can always use a PEQ between 2kHz to 4kHz with a wide Q and suck out a few dB's after the Cab block. The more you take away, the less intelligible your guitar will be in the mix.
 
B:ASSMASTER said:
I've never went past 6kHz and that was just for a filler track. If you're having trouble with highs, then you need to look elsewhere. Pickups, speakers, microphones, ect.

You can always use a PEQ between 2kHz to 4kHz with a wide Q and suck out a few dB's after the Cab block. The more you take away, the less intelligible your guitar will be in the mix.
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Thanks for the reply, I assume you are talking about the same context as mine, playing loud with a frfr setup (in my case, CLR neo)?
 
I'm cutting at 85hz and 8.5khz. I've gone from around 100hz to 15khz and everything in between those but I read somewhere awhile back about Cliff mentioning 85hz and 85khz and that his been good middle ground for my ears at gig volume. Bass isn't woofy and the highs are just right. Not too bright but not dull either. Also, took me awhile to find the right IR. I finally found one that I thought sounded great right out the gate at gig volume and just added the low and high cuts in the cab block.
 
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Right now I am cutting down to 15000. Over the years I have gone as low as 6000. Also done alot between 6000 and 8500. I tried 15000 after a post from the Metallica guitar tech. It was a more than I was used too but it didn't sound bad so I left it. I feel like the cab sim, cab sim and actual speaker you are listening too. For example if I was listening via a k12 I would cut more highs cause that thing gets harsh. I stated using the AC20 again yesterday and with my cab choice I am prob going to cut lower than 15000
 
In the cab block my go to values are. Low cut 110 hz High cut 5000.
I use FRFR and / or in-ears.
 
I know that you asked about low pass, but high pass is also being discussed. I thought you might be surprised to know that I've seen HPFs set as high as 200Hz in live tones used by bands like Metallica.
 
Admin M@ said:
I know that you asked about low pass, but high pass is also being discussed. I thought you might be surprised to know that I've seen HPFs set as high as 200Hz in live tones used by bands like Metallica.
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To some degree that's going to be based on the size of the venue I think - they need to employ some heavy-handed methods to prevent the "woof" filling up a stadium
 
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