Will this ever sound good in a live band setting?

Thanks for all the responses and assistance. I've did try FRFR using the passive Atomic CLR/Matrix GT1000. Don't go through FOH at smaller gigs, which is one of the reasons I went for the Matrix option. I A/B'd FRFR (with cab sims) vs Guitar Cab (without) and found I got a better and more realistic sound with the later. Have spent today trying to get my rig to sound more 'realistic' without that 'digital' sound I keep hearing. After hours and hours it still sounds somewhat artificial to me. (NB: I did set my presets at gig type volume with backing tracks and as mentioned above re-checked at rehearsals and soundcheck.) Something's just not working for me.

Here are the presets I used. Very straight forward. Rhythm sounds on Scenes 1 & 2, lead sounds on Scenes 4 & 5.

Any more thoughts?
 

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I go FRFR to front of house and into a CLR monitor for myself and I am loving the tones i am getting. Many of the advice here is good, I did many of the suggested things in this string. The only thing I miss is controlled feedback onstage because I'm using my monitor at relatively low volumes, you should be able to produce that with your setup tho.
 
I tried your presets. They are dialed in very very dark. Why?

Also clipping. Do you have your Global EQ Gain turned down ?
 
yek said:
I tried your presets. They are dialed in very very dark. Why?

Also clipping. Do you have your Global EQ Gain turned down ?
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I initially dialled the presets in with the bass/mid/treble set flat and no adjustment on the EQ. They were far too harsh in the band setting... far too much treble; thin, lacking fullness and a balanced EQ. I had to back off the treble and add some depth to get something close to useable. I use a Strat (bridge & bridge/middle) and Les Paul (bridge). I have not touched the Global EQ or Gain. All are set flat. Gain at zero dB. No clipping... in fact I set all presets at 7-8dB below clipping as recommended. I tried FRFR again yesterday. Same issues, worse in fact, even more artificial.

The reality is that the real versions of the amps would require little tweaking to get a balanced full sound using a Port City cab with Celestion V Types. It should not require this much mucking around to achieve the same out of the Axe.

Don't get me wrong; it sounds pretty good, but it's just not right. No matter what amp model I use, no matter how I EQ, whether I use my Strat, Tele or Les Paul, the sound is thin and somewhat artificial. I can hear the 'digital' tone of it.

Maybe there's an issue with my unit given the vast consensus that the Axe is an accurate representation of the real things. I no longer want to use the real thing. I want the versatility and flexibility that the Axe provides. At this stage however I would rate the sound reproduction at around a 75 - 80% representation of the analog amps modelled, which is not close enough for me. I'm persisting but am at a loss as to how to get this to sound useable for me.

Any other advice and assistance would be much appreciated.
 
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I've tried my axe numerous ways, FRFR, FRFR with matrix amp, matrix amp into many different cabs including matrix n-12's, I keep going back to FRFR. Have you tried "powered speakers" vs matrix into FRFR? I havent tried the CLR's yet but I get my best tone using powered speakers vs seperate amp and frfr speakers.

When I dont have FOH to plug into I use my home made half stack, it kills and gives the amp in the room sound in fact huge, it consists of a divided old 4x12 cabinet, two woofers and two tweeters installed into 12" round wave guides, two 550 watt class d power amps all robbed from a pair of pretty cheap Behringer B212D speakers I had.

I played around with acoustic foam inside until it sounded where I wanted it, it also has 2 band EQ on the amps so I can quickly dial it for the room or outdoors.
it was a cheap azz experiment that turned out fantastic. Here is the thread on when I built it http://forum.fractalaudio.com/amps-cabs/47126-building-my-own-frfr-cab-maybe.html

I also use EV ELX112p's, Qsc K12's and they are great too but my cheap azz cab just does the trick and I have played many gigs with it and no failures, always sounds great, even very seasoned musicians are pretty amazed when I show them what is really is and no one has ever guessed it wasn't a "normal" 4x12 cab.
This combined with good FOH system has given me the best tone ever in all my 40 years of playing. Now I just picked up an axe 2 (been using an Ultra). Since using the Axe FX I have never had so many compliments on my tone.........Period. All when using FRFR, cab sims etc.....and to my ears as well. You bring your best studio tone to a live environment, in the last year or so I have played with my best real amps that sound killer and I always come back to the AXE FX everytime.
Now, the absolute best huge rock tone I can get comes from the Axe FX combined (using an A/B box) with a miked little blackstar HT-5 mini stack and also speaker emulated line out of the Blackstar so L/R from the axe fx, sm57 and senhieser on both cabs of the 5 watt blackstar and L/R on the emulated out of the Blackstar line out.
You hit a power chord and its like being punched in the face and they all hit the board at fractionally different times and it sounds so fat and huge. When I have played with that set up, Whoa! Usually I am using an EAW wedge in front of me and its killer, speaking of which the EAW passive FRFR speakers are some of the best I have ever heard EVER and I dont see those mentioned on this forum.

Funny, I have had maybe 5 different people on this forum PM me if I wanted to sell my home made cab..........nope! you cant get 12" waveguides anymore only 10".
 
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stevieg said:
Maybe there's an issue with my unit given the vast consensus that the Axe is an accurate representation of the real things. I no longer want to use the real thing. I want the versatility and flexibility that the Axe provides. At this stage however I would rate the sound reproduction at around a 75 - 80% representation of the analog amps modelled, which is not close enough for me. I'm persisting but am at a loss as to how to get this to sound useable for me.
Click to expand...

IMO, there is something wrong or very unorthodox going on somewhere. Whether it is something external to the AxeFx, the way the unit is currently programmed or set up, or borked hardware/firmware, there's definitely something odd. It shouldn't be that gut wrenching to get good quality, full-bodied tones from the AxeFx.

Can you post a recording?
Have your tried to reload firmware?

If you are committed to the AxeFx, is it worth it to you to send it to the factory to check for problems with your unit?
Are you willing to let us know your general location so that there may be a chance a nearby forum member can help you compare rigs and share ideas?

Going back to early firmware on the AxeFxII, I've heard what it sounds like with cab sims disabled into the power section of a 2x12 combo amp, and there was nothing thin or digital sounding about it...and that's about 3 years ago. Current firmware is quite an improvement since then. Heck, I've even heard the Ultra sound very good going through an amp and traditional cab.

You're a new forum member here, so is this a new AxeFxII from the factory or approved vendor? Still within 15 day return policy? Or used?

If all else fails, then that's the way the cookie crumbles. Some people hear what they hear, and no amount of advice from forum members is going to make you hear differently if the gear is working properly. But the real question that is difficult to answer: is your stuff all working properly and what exactly does it sound like - not to you, but to the rest of the world? Not that what other people think matters, but point being that nobody is in the room hearing what you hear.

Your turn...
 
something isn't right...i gig the hell out of mine weekly and it kills every time, period. no "artificial" or "digital" tones. just huge, excellent guitar tones. period. i use a CLR for stage volume and send the same signal to FOH. every venue i play the techs love it....from clubs on Broadway in Nashville to Bridgestone Arena during a Predators game, (nashville hockey team, in front of 15k people) to my church on the weekends i'm home. too many others have the same experience as me (as well as national touring artists playing large venues on regular basis) to deny that the Axe is capable of producing stellar tones in any situation.
 
@OP: must be something wrong with amp, cables, cab or Axe-Fx.
 
Yeah something is really off. There are just too many people on here that get great tone myself included. I have always been a tube amp guy so I know how they sound and how they react. And now after G3 we are there or at least the gap now is so very small. Maybe check with support and if you can post a clip so we can hear what your hearing.
 
can we hear a recording of this "digital sound" that you get with your rig?

i'm unable to try your presets because they are for XL+ and i only have a mark I.
 
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Zwiebelchen said:
Let's be honest here:

This is probably a user error.
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Without more information, we really don't know this. User error and faulty gear are two different things that may have the same net result. No matter. The OP hasn't had a chance to answer some additional questions that may lead us to narrowing down the problem, so until now it is all speculation. I don't want to beat up on a user who appears genuine in his quest to get things rectified. There have been users post that things get funky after new firmware downloads, and discover they have a corrupted firmware that is fixed by re-loading it. There are just so many ways that things can go weird with any performance rig...

I would like to hear back from the OP with answers to my questions from last night, if he'd be so kind. :encouragement:
 
The red flags are goin up for me when you say that everything was too bright and thin with the EQ knobs at noon. Having all the knobs at noon might not be anyone's idea of dream tone but it shouldn't require heavy tweaking to cobble together something usable. I've lost hours and hours to a flat amp block when I told myself I was gonna scroll through the amp list. Reload firmware, reset everything, and try again with a fresh patch with as few moving parts in it as possible.

Somewhere in there a setting got goofed up. Don't lose hope man
 
this thread is going in typical fashion :) someone asks a question, doesn't return to the thread for a day or more, comes back to tons of posts. some people get overwhelmed at that point and quit. others do take the time to read it. and some don't read anything, but start another thread asking the same question saying "no one answered my question." :)

let's see which this will be.
 
paranoid said:
Hello jimfist! did you get your rig back or is the one you set up still loving yours? had not seen you post here for a bit?
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My guitarist buddy is still using my AxeFx...has been since I demo'd it to him in December. I'll get it back...some day!

sorry for the sidetrack...as you were...
 
Hi all, thanks for all your input. Just to clarify; I am a very experienced guitarist, live sound engineer and very good technically. Yes, I am new to the Axe FX so I too thought that I may have made some mistake with some setting. All I did however was turn the cab sims off, haven't touched anything else. I have been very thorough and a 'user error' is unlikely, however I will quadruple check everything. The issue I'm having is apparent on the basic factory pre-sets (e.g.: 65 Baseguy) as well as the pre-sets I created. My rig is: Axe FX XL+, Matrix GT1000FX, Port City 2x12 with Celestion V types, multiple high quality cables, Fender American Strat, Gibson Les Paul, Bill Lawrence Tele. Tried it today with a Mesa 2:50 instead of the Matrix. Noticeable improvement but still something not right. Going to A/B my Axe over the weekend with a Mark II that my local guitar tech has. Will also do further analysis with the Matrix/Mesa. I will also do a factory reset and reinstall 18.08 just to be sure. Interestingly, my XL+ has a fault with the 'new' screen with a vertical and a horizontal line visible, but this should not be an indication of anything else untoward...or could it be?! As for posting a recording, I'll attempt to make an acceptable recording of my 'live' rig after I've done the above.

I really appreciate all of your input and helping me work through this.
 
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This sounds like an FRFR vs amp cab situation. he likes the in the room sound vs frfr. Kind of like how I prefer pepsi to coke.
 
I guess that the most made and by far bigest fail when one wants a cab in the room sound is when he dails in too much highs as if it's for recordings or for for listening through studio monitors at moderate volumes. The right way is to reduce highs a bit (compared to what you'd need for recordings) and crank up the FRFR monitors, so they can fill the room without throwing out nasty highs.
 
Hey there Stevie G... whereabouts are you located? Maybe one of us can stop by and help? I would highly suggest, updating to the latest firmware, reset all parameters, dial up an amp and start completely from scratch.
 
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