Using power conditioners or voltage regulators with the Axe II

trancegodz

trancegodz

Fractal Fanatic
Is it necessary to use a Furman power conditioner, or even a Furman voltage regulator with the Axe II if you are playing a lot of different venues?
Or is the Axe II already pretty much immune any electrical variations you might run into on the road in the USA?
 
it has been discussed a few times. Seems the AxeFx will not perform any better witha conditioner or regulator but if you want one in case of catastrophe then go for it. I have a conditioner in my rack.
 
I always like a good conditioner with any equipment that I use. If anything, get yourself an APC G5 and it will power up and down all your gear in the proper order.
 
Ooh boy, jump onto any pro-studio forum and raise this topic if you want to watch the sparks fly.

The general consensus of the knowledgable people I have spoken to (such as the chief engineer of Australia's largest radio network) is that these power conditioners such as the Furman are snake oil, and nothing more than horribly over-priced surge protectors.

To really get clean power you need a power regenerator, which by necessity includes batteries (to provide a stable current in the event of a dropout), so it effectively doubles as a UPS. It converts the AC to DC and then re-inverts it to AC.

Without implying any recommendation, here's a link to one company that makes them: AG Series AC Power ReGenerator | Power Inspired

Having said all of that, please remember that I am still fundamentally a guitarist, so I reserve the right to be clueless.
 
Manning said:
Ooh boy, jump onto any pro-studio forum and raise this topic if you want to watch the sparks fly.

The general consensus of the knowledgable people I have spoken to (such as the chief engineer of Australia's largest radio network) is that these power conditioners such as the Furman are snake oil, and nothing more than horribly over-priced surge protectors.

To really get clean power you need a power regenerator, which by necessity includes batteries (to provide a stable current in the event of a dropout), so it effectively doubles as a UPS. It converts the AC to DC and then re-inverts it to AC.

Without implying any recommendation, here's a link to one company that makes them: AG Series AC Power ReGenerator | Power Inspired

Having said all of that, please remember that I am still fundamentally a guitarist, so I reserve the right to be clueless.
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Thanks. I didn't know that. What about the Furman Voltage regulator?

But do you need any of this stuff with the AXE II. I know how screwed up the electricity can be in different venues to tube amps. Will that negatively affect the Axe II in any way, or do we not have to worry about that at all with the Axe? I know it won't affect the tone, but could it damage the Axe II?
 
Having not reading anything over at the pro audio forums, I believe "Manning" was talking in reference to just straight up power conditioners. That I have no doubt about myself that power conditioners are extremely overpriced... as with most things considering where most things are being made these days, (parts and labor). Dirt cheap for them to make. However a voltage regulator is is another story. I use one with a balanced isolation transformer for all my studio gear and PC. Wouldn't do without it. Home or live. Extreme measures that cost me a few bucks but considering what is all plugged into it... best protection you can have for taking a hit and worth the investment in my books:D
 
I have the Furman conditioner, it was about $700.

Where I use to live, every time the A/C turned on, the rest of the home would dim and I lost my presets (this is pre-Axe Fx) in my guitar rack many times over. After the Furman I never had a problem again.

Then six or seven years later I read of a recall on the unit I had, which had expired years earlier. I called them and they honored the recall so the new unit cost me about $150. I have no complaints with them or their power conditioners. I can't speak about the power strip with the light tubes on it.
 
luke said:
I have the Furman conditioner, it was about $700.

Where I use to live, every time the A/C turned on, the rest of the home would dim and I lost my presets (this is pre-Axe Fx) in my guitar rack many times over. After the Furman I never had a problem again.

Then six or seven years later I read of a recall on the unit I had, which had expired years earlier. I called them and they honored the recall so the new unit cost me about $150. I have no complaints with them or their power conditioners. I can't speak about the power strip with the light tubes on it.
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Hey Luke. Do you recall which model it was? Just in case I or others have one. Was not aware of a Furman recall on anything. Thanks.
 
Even if it is a glorified surge protector, having your gear on a surge protector is a good thing, right?

Now, it probably is overpriced compared to an equally good "normal" surge protector. The "value" here would be in having it securely in the rack, with a switch easily accessible, a spare front outlet (on most units), and on some units, pull out lights. I'm not sure if I could do something equally clean in a 4 space rack. Maybe mounted to the inside of the rear lid, but it's still not as clean. I'd pay something for that, though not a crazy amount.

The other key question is whether these units really are good surge protectors. For example, is the difference between these two Furman units just marketing, or is the PL-8C really going to be a better surge protector?

Amazon.com: Furman M-8Lx Standard Level Power Conditioning, 15 Amp, 9 Outlets with Wall Wart Spacing, Pullout Lights: Electronics
Amazon.com: Furman PL-8C 15 Amp, Advanced Level Power Conditioning, SMP, EVS, LiFT, 9 Outlets, Pullout LED Lights, Isolated Outlet Banks: Musical Instruments

Note that I'm not actually saying that these are just glorified surge protectors. I can't say that their "conditioning" doesn't really add additional protection. I'm just talking about whether a basic unit (probably <$100) is such a bad value even if it isn't leaps and bounds above in terms of protection.
 
swass said:
However a voltage regulator is is another story. I use one with a balanced isolation transformer for all my studio gear and PC. Wouldn't do without it. Home or live. Extreme measures that cost me a few bucks but considering what is all plugged into it... best protection you can have for taking a hit and worth the investment in my books:D
Click to expand...

Here are two different Furman voltage regulators I am considering.

AR-1215 AC LINE VOLTAGE REGULATOR
FurmanSound.com - Pro A/V Product - AR-1215

P-1800 AR VOLTAGE REGULATOR / POWER CONDITIONER
FurmanSound.com - Pro A/V Product - P-1800 AR
 
Ok, so basically this pic speaks for itself ;) Furman PL-8.

428084_370821756276580_100000462752777_1481853_1102613406_n.jpg
 
My replacement unit is the AR-1215, don't remember which it replaced.
 
OK. Thanks. I also currently have the AR-1215 and hasn't given me any problems. However it 60 cycle hums until it's under load.
 
Has anyone witnessed, first hand, one of these actually working? In other words, you get a power surge at a venue, other gear (such as venue cash registers) fry and maybe explode, but your protected gear is safe? It must happen I suppose but it's gotta be rare.
 
GM Arts said:
Has anyone witnessed, first hand, one of these actually working? In other words, you get a power surge at a venue, other gear (such as venue cash registers) fry and maybe explode, but your protected gear is safe? It must happen I suppose but it's gotta be rare.
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It's usually too little power causing system crashes and loss of presets in my experience. My unit takes anything from 90-140 and converts it to 117v, anymore or less and it turns itself off.
 
GM Arts said:
Has anyone witnessed, first hand, one of these actually working? In other words, you get a power surge at a venue, other gear (such as venue cash registers) fry and maybe explode, but your protected gear is safe? It must happen I suppose but it's gotta be rare.
Click to expand...

I came across this guy's post in a search recently, found it again now. He says yes.

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-discussion/49668-axe-voltage-conditioner.html#post643421

On the other hand, a friend of mine had a lighting strike just outside her house recently (they found burn marks on a tree). She had some stuff not on protectors at all that survived. She had other things on protectors that also survived. And stuff in both states that got fried. She even had some stuff on the same power strip that survived while other stuff didn't. Most of the protectors were basic. Now, some could argue that she just didn't have good (expensive) enough protectors. I'm sure that's what Monster, Furman, APC, Trip-Lite, etc would argue. :) But if that's so, how did some stuff on no protector at all survive? I'm not saying the protectors were useless either though. But this was a massive spike. One of her regular light switches basically melted or was otherwise internally damaged to the point it would not move.

I think the bottom line is that there are surges that will jump across just about anything you put in front of them, no matter what it costs. And in the end, the power is going to seek out the most efficient way to get to a ground. There are a lot of variables that define what survives and what doesn't. A surge protector probably DOES increase your odds somewhat, but it's no guarantee. It probably does make it a less efficient path to ground, but the size of the spike and the alternate paths to ground are huge factors. I think spending within reason for protection makes sense. Defining "within reason" is a different question.
 
Interesting story about feeding 240V into 110V gear. Fortunately, I've had the opposite experience, playing on a cruise. Double checked in advance "Are you sure you've got 240V for our footpedals?" "Yes, no problem" they said. They lied.
 
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