Using a Fuzz in front of the Axe-Fx for cleans

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B-Rad

Member
In the below video, Pete Thorn discusses how to get Hendrix-y glassy highs with a clean tone by using a fuzz and turning down your volume pot. I read the wiki or maybe Yek's write-up and it discusses this effect but you can't do it in the Axe-Fx the buffer in the Axe-Fx makes this difficult if not impossible to do. I know it also discusses changing the input impedance, which I did with poor results. My question is, can I use a fuzz stomp box in front of the Axe-Fx, plugging my guitar into the fuzz, and then into the Axe-Fx to get the result Pete talks about or will the buffer in the Axe-Fx still ruin the sought out tone? Thanks!

 
B-Rad said:
can I use a fuzz stomp box in front of the Axe-Fx, plugging my guitar into the fuzz, and then into the Axe-Fx to get the result Pete talks about or will the buffer in the Axe-Fx still ruin the sought out tone?
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I don't know if it'll get you the tones you seek, but you can absolutely run fuzz boxes in front of the Axe-Fx. I've been doing that going on a decade now with great results.
 
As long as your guitar is connected to your fuzz pedal first in chain and you have passive pickups everything will work and sound great

Mind you, some fuzz pedals clean up better than others with the guitars volume knob.

Basic “rule” is nothing buffered, no wireless etc before fuzz for proper cleanup
 
That’s a great tone! I wonder if there’s a way to get the same tone in the box. Sans pedal. Maybe with some eq help? Could be a good addition to the effects project @austinbuddy is working on.
 
Dunconia said:
That’s a great tone! I wonder if there’s a way to get the same tone in the box. Sans pedal. Maybe with some eq help? Could be a good addition to the effects project @austinbuddy is working on.
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You can get the tone but not the cleanup, the Axe is a buffered input by nature so it’s not going to respond like a fuzz circuit connected to passive guitar electronics
 
lqdsnddist said:
You can get the tone but not the cleanup, the Axe is a buffered input by nature so it’s not going to respond like a fuzz circuit connected to passive guitar electronics
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Tone is all I would need. I’ve got 5 other buttons on my FC6.
 
Then you can basically dial in a drive block for a given tone, another block for a different tone etc. instead of rolling back your volume pot on your guitar and having a range of tones your hitting switches and changing to different drive settings
 
I'm still bewildered that in a time where we can send probes to Pluto and beyond we still can't design a fuzz that plays nice behind a buffer. How much of an actual rocket science is that?
 
Muad'zin said:
I'm still bewildered that in a time where we can send probes to Pluto and beyond we still can't design a fuzz that plays nice behind a buffer. How much of an actual rocket science is that?
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We can and there are tons of circuits that sound great anywhere in the chain, but the classic 11 component germanium fuzz face circuit depends on “seeing” the guitars passive electronics in order to achieve the non-linear clean up where 10 is raging fuzz and 9 is spanking clean.

There are also ways to build a pickup simulator box behind a buffer, after a wireless etc, and those work great too, only issue is that you need to reach down and turn a pot instead of the handy volume knob attached to your guitar.

We can put fuzz where we want, we can get the tone, we just can’t slightly tweak a volume pot on the guitar and get the range of tones on the fly.

It’s a very minor limitation honestly, and unless you really love germanium fuzz, and depend on that classic volume pot behavior, your not missing anything and it’s an overblown issue.
 
This works for OD pedals as well! Guitarists have been doing this forever out of the need (or laziness) to be able to have clean/dirty control at your fingertips. With real tube amps it will require you to play loud though... much louder than me or my band are comfortable with.
 
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B-Rad said:
but you can't do it in the Axe-Fx the buffer in the Axe-Fx makes this difficult if not impossible to do.
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I'm getting great "glassy highs" using the Face Fuzz model, with guitar volume turned down.
 
Aha, no. It's really the same using the model. I tested it, when updating the demo presets for the Drives Guide. It works just the same. Use a Face Fuzz model with a clean or dirty amp model. Turn down the guitar volume really low and you'll get those glassy cleans.

Besides, I hate making videos...
 
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I've always thought that this interaction between the guitar and the fuzz face was something that should able to be modelled. Ideally, I'd like to see a control in the block called "Volume Roll-off" that simulates that effect. Then assign it to a pedal.
 
If the fuzz is the first block and the input inpedance is set to auto, the fuzz will load the guitar as expected, including a little noise when un-bypassing it.
 
You can match the tones pretty well, you just can’t match the way a germanium fuzz can be full on wooly at 10 on the volume pot, but then totally cleaned up just rolling it back to 9.

Roll the volume pot down on the Axe model and it hardly makes a different from 10 to 9.5, and when you go down to like 5 you often end up losing some highs and output, even though it’s cleaned up.

That super clean-up with the volume pot is just unique to a germanium fuzz circuit. Even silicon fuzz don’t work as well, and this is why folks still bother with germanium fuzz....

Let’s face it, the transistors are rare and cost a fortune and a lot leak, don’t met spec etc, they are horribly temperate sensitive, noisy, often need to be wired reverse polarity, don’t like power supplies etc

Huge PITA but nothing does that unique tone...

It’s why AnalogMan can charge $300 for a box with 11 parts, and why stuff like a NTK275 white dot transistor will sell for hundreds of dollars, but a typical Silicon BC108/9 is worth only a few bucks
 
lqdsnddist said:
You can match the tones pretty well, you just can’t match the way a germanium fuzz can be full on wooly at 10 on the volume pot, but then totally cleaned up just rolling it back to 9.

Roll the volume pot down on the Axe model and it hardly makes a different from 10 to 9.5, and when you go down to like 5 you often end up losing some highs and output, even though it’s cleaned up.

That super clean-up with the volume pot is just unique to a germanium fuzz circuit. Even silicon fuzz don’t work as well, and this is why folks still bother with germanium fuzz....

Let’s face it, the transistors are rare and cost a fortune and a lot leak, don’t met spec etc, they are horribly temperate sensitive, noisy, often need to be wired reverse polarity, don’t like power supplies etc

Huge PITA but nothing does that unique tone...

It’s why AnalogMan can charge $300 for a box with 11 parts, and why stuff like a NTK275 white dot transistor will sell for hundreds of dollars, but a typical Silicon BC108/9 is worth only a few bucks
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I have to admit. I never really got fuzz pedals. I’ve seen other people use them and make them sound great, but I have only tried models. Great explanation as it has me curious now. I may need to try one if I can get my hands on a good one. The Fulltone 69 mark 2 any good?
 
Was not aware of this! Just A/Bd the fuzz face against a real ChaseTone 68 Red Velvet Fuzz, and its damn close , and the net affect with either is quite an epiphany !
yek said:
Aha, no. It's really the same using the model. I tested it, when updating the demo presets for the Drivers Guide. It works just the same. Use a Face Fuzz model with a clean or dirty amp model. Turn down the guitar volume really low and you'll get those glassy cleans.

Besides, I hate making videos...
Click to expand...
 
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