Trouble syncing tremolo with midi/metronome

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leviatam

New Member
Hello, I've been looking for a solution to this for years, I hope somebody can help me.
I need to use precise tremolo on my guitar. I have midi signals from my DAW into the Axe FX III, and the drummer plays to a premade click track also running from my DAW. I press play on my DAW and all my effects are automated, drummer plays in sync, sound effects are running through the pa, everything is working as expected except whenever the tremolo effect gets engaged, the start and stop (phase) of the tremolo is completely random. I think the tremolo just keeps going behind the scenes and is only audible when it gets switched on, but I need the beginning of the tremolo phase to always start whenever it gets switched on so that it is consistent and exactly the same every time.
I haven't extensively tested this, but I suspect that other phase based effects like flanger, chorus, or phaser are working in a similar way.
I used to be able to solve this issue on my HX Stomp years ago, where hitting one of the stomp switches would reset the phase of the effect, so I would just set the midi to engage and reset the phase at the same time.
I can't get this to work on the Axe FX III no matter what I do. I've looked at many different forum posts and Youtube videos but nothing seems to work. I don't need to control the speed of the tremolo by hitting my string, that doesn't apply to my scenario. Using a midi clock has no effect. I just need the phase to be in the same position whenever it gets engaged so I don't have random tremolo.
I'm hoping somebody can help me!
 
The Axe-FX has no beat sync, so it won't follow your DAW. I'm not sure what you mean by "engaged", but you can control the start and stop of the tremolo, either by unbypassing it or using the trigger. Once you've figured out which way you want to trigger it, use the start phase to control the start point of the shape. Alternatively, use an LFO to control volume and remotely control the run parameter. If you want to automate any of that, you can do it with midi from your DAW.
 
Thanks for the reply, yes I mean unbypassing it using midi when I want to use the effect. Whenever I would unbypass it, the start of the tremolo would always be random. Let me try it out again and I will update this post if I can get it to work. I'm not set up right now, so it might take me a while.
 
Depending on the guitar part, you could play with the Trigger threshold value in the trem block as your method of resetting the phase to fit. Otherwise set the speed to the required subdivision value and the patch to the bpm of the song. Play around with the Start Phase position as well so you get the proper type of attack and sustain you want. But this is all contingent on the guitar part having a strong accent to sync to.
 
jamongrande said:
Depending on the guitar part, you could play with the Trigger threshold value in the trem block as your method of resetting the phase to fit. Otherwise set the speed to the required subdivision value and the patch to the bpm of the song. Play around with the Start Phase position as well so you get the proper type of attack and sustain you want. But this is all contingent on the guitar part having a strong accent to sync to.
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Thanks for the reply! Yes, I'm familiar with the trigger threshold method, but my application is such that i need the tremolo to act the same regardless of what the guitar part is (like a machine).
 
edwinstar said:
Maybe you can send a Tremolo Shaped Control Curve via Midi CC from your DAW to a Volume Block on the AxeFx?
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Actually I tried that, but it's not fast and accurate enough, and the start stop isn't choppy enough like how i need it. Otherwise, it would've been a perfect plan.
 
leviatam said:
Actually I tried that, but it's not fast and accurate enough, and the start stop isn't choppy enough like how i need it. Otherwise, it would've been a perfect plan.
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Were you controlling volume level via CC? If so, and you want really abrupt start stop, maybe try just engaging and disengaging the block (volume or filter) leaving level at 0, bypass set to thru (engage/activate block to cut/drop, disengage/deactivate to open) -- that could be less midi traffic than a drawn curve.
 
When I need this effect I set the Trem's Start Phase to 360 degrees so that the trem pulses are in sync with the beat when I activate the block on a downbeat. Here's 3 examples at 3 different tempos, two are an extreme effect with a 100% depth square wave trem, one with the regular VCA Trem set to a triangle. I bounced it with the click so you can hear them consistently starting at the same phase in the LFO. All I'm doing is hitting the footswitch on the downbeat. https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/dy28...hase.m4a?rlkey=i40gap92jxfmrmppvyzz87zx1&dl=0

DAW latency could be playing a role in your situation so I would get it working well just using a footswitch first, then add midi to the equation.
 
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sean.e said:
Were you controlling volume level via CC? If so, and you want really abrupt start stop, maybe try just engaging and disengaging the block (volume or filter) leaving level at 0, bypass set to thru (engage/activate block to cut/drop, disengage/deactivate to open) -- that could be less midi traffic than a drawn curve.
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I think I tried both ways, but I know I definitely tried the CC way. I'll try engaging and disengaging again once I get it set up to test out. I just moved, so it's gonna take me a while to set up again, but I appreciate the idea!
 
strabes said:
thanks! I'm gonna try this out once I get set up again, though it might take me a while cause I just moved and I have a lot of set up to do. I was prepared to deal with the DAW latency, but the problem was that sometimes it would be perfectly in time and sometimes it would be out of phase. testing it out and recording it, it was just totally random every time, which told me that the tremolo phase was just going on its own behind the scenes and ignoring when I was activating it.
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leviatam said:
thanks! I'm gonna try this out once I get set up again, though it might take me a while cause I just moved and I have a lot of set up to do. I was prepared to deal with the DAW latency, but the problem was that sometimes it would be perfectly in time and sometimes it would be out of phase. testing it out and recording it, it was just totally random every time, which told me that the tremolo phase was just going on its own behind the scenes and ignoring when I was activating it.
Click to expand...
Interesting. My method works and is repeatable, I've used it live many times, so definitely give that a shot and then try it with midi. Hope you get it working, be sure to post an update (and the preset) when you get a chance to try it out.
 
I haven't heard anything above that I can't do by syncing the Trem via Tempo (in my case averaging a bar's worth of 1/4 or 1/8 notes depending on meter, for lower overhead vs MBC), which I also use live with no probelms?

What am I missing?
 
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