Triaxis/Axe Shootout

mrstrat

mrstrat

Experienced
So, I've been contemplating selling off my Triaxis/G-Force/2:90 rig. This rig has been the backbone of my sound for many years, so you can imagine my trepidation in letting it go...:nightmare:

To help me make up my mind, I thought I'd record both, and do an objective shootout between the Triaxis Lead Yellow preset and the Axe Fx USA Pre Yellow preset, and see if the Triaxis sounded as good as I remembered.

I thought you might enjoy hearing my findings: :)



So here are the two configurations that were recorded:

(1) Triaxis=>G-Force=>2:90

(2) Axe-Fx II=>Matrix GT1000FX

Both rigs were run into the same set of two 1x12 cabs (1-Celestion G12T-75, 1-EVM12L)

I recorded using an SM57=>MOTU 8PRE=>Acid Pro. I did no DAW processing...what you're hearing is just the raw sound from the units.

This wasn't intended to be a "let me see how close I can get to my original Triaxis sound", but more of a reality check on my current Axe-Fx tone, and what I thought I remembered about my old Triaxis tone.

Anyway, I think the Axe is kicking my Triaxis' ass, and it's probably time to sell the old mare. Will be sorry to see it go... ;)

EDIT:

OK, folks, I've gone back and tried to even everything out, to do an apples to apples comparison between the Axe and the Triaxis (As much as possible anyway)

I disabled the PowerAmp (Sag = 0) in the axe, and moved all the tone dials (including presence [high cut]) to 12 o'clock. This seems to have solved the "honky"-ness problem. I also, backed off the Dynamic Voice ("V" tone scoop) on the Triaxis, and things seem to have evened out between the Axe and the Triaxis.

I'm really impressed with how well Cliff has captured the tone of the Triaxis Yellow Mode. :)

So given the above changes, here are the new recordings. As you'll see I ran both the Axe and Triaxis into both the 2:90 and the Matrix. In all fairness to the Matrix, although both the Axe and Triaxis came out sounding muddier on the Matrix than the 2:90, I think any differences in tone could easily be eliminated using simple EQ adjustments.

So now that I understand what's going on, I think I can go back and adjust the Axe Pre Yellow to get pretty darned close to my original Triaxis tone.

Anyway, here you go...enjoy! :)

Triaxis => 2:90


Axe => 2:90


Triaxis => Matrix


Axe => Matrix
 
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Hard to judge from the clip, as the first half is much wetter with reverb & delay(?), while the second half sounds fairly dry and is a good bit louder. With those differences, it's really hard to tell any real differences in the 2 tones (it sounds like pretty much the same tone to me).
 
Tones do not match and simply way different. G-force is very wet on mid freq nd not good to mix.
Second sample clips!
 
A light picker aren't you? :)

Umm.. yeah... hard to tell which one was better... they are different for sure.
 
Completly different mid one the latter.. I guess it would stand more out in the mix, due to more mid and less fx
 
shredi knight said:
Hard to judge from the clip, as the first half is much wetter with reverb & delay(?), while the second half sounds fairly dry and is a good bit louder. With those differences, it's really hard to tell any real differences in the 2 tones (it sounds like pretty much the same tone to me).
Click to expand...

This. I like the first one better, but it sounds about like the same amp with different settings and effects. The main difference I'm hearing is that the first one sounds a little more scooped and smooth whereas the second one is more mid-heavy and a bit honky in comparison.
 
Good observations guys. I think I'll go back today and try it again completely dry, and see if that makes a difference. It was kind of strange, while the room volume was the same on both takes, the Axe seem more "alive" and present. Sounded MUCH better to my ears live. Of course as you say, it might all be the differences in the effects levels.
 
shredi knight said:
Hard to judge from the clip, as the first half is much wetter with reverb & delay(?), while the second half sounds fairly dry and is a good bit louder. With those differences, it's really hard to tell any real differences in the 2 tones (it sounds like pretty much the same tone to me).
Click to expand...

I was actually surprised at how close the tone was, given how different the rigs are. I really like the Matrix.
 
Ok, here's another set of recordings, completely dry this time. (1) triaxis (2) Axe II



Apologies for the unmelodic wanking. Just trying to get something down quickly.

To my ear, the Axe II sounds "boxy"...more mid-heavy. The Triaxis is set to 7 on Dynamic Voice, which is a pretty steep "V" curve. It's funny, I like the "in the room" sound of the Axe better, but I like the recorded sound of the Traxis better.

Any thoughts on what frequencies to back out of the Axe to get it closer to the Triaxis?
 
the triaxis is def more scooped in both cases. so in the room and recorded the mid boosts on the axe will make it sound more alive, alone recorded the triaxis sounds better, but maybe not in a mix or live (would probably be sucked away). Can you scoop the axe 2 a bit more? and add a hair more gain?

Im curious about the red lead, my friend who owns a triaxis says this is where its at, and axe doesnt do this persay (maybe its the fas modern or something). He wont get rid of his triaxis for this reason, also he prefers to take the triaxis live and leave the axe at home.
 
I think this is a case of Mesa 2:90 (best tube power amp ever) vs Matrix. I would probably use the 2:90 instead. :D

IMO you can probably get a lot closer by tweaking the Axe a bit more. Presence way lower?
 
comparing the actual preamp means to check, if power amp sim is off (global or sag to zero) and set the NOW shelving EQ (Presence) to neutral 12 o´clock... on the axe-sim.
 
Definitely like the Triaxis better in the second clip. The Axe-Fx sounds way to mid heavy and "honky" for my tastes (but if you aren't doing something to simulate the Triaxis' Dynamic Voice eq scoop, then it's obvious as to why).
 
mrstrat said:
Any thoughts on what frequencies to back out of the Axe to get it closer to the Triaxis?
Click to expand...


What I do instead of use eq on my Mesa patches (the "USA" sims), is I put a Tone-Match block from one of the "Channel 3" patches posted in this thread....


http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-tone-match/52546-mark-v-amp-match-all-channels-modes.html


....and place it directly after the Amp block in the signal chain. The patches are Tone-Matches that were performed on a real Mesa Mark V. The Tone-Match blocks in the patches are amp matches only, meaning they are just the eq curve of just the amp and not a cabinet, so they would work perfectly fine with your setup since you are already using a cab (if you were going direct or using FRFR, you would have to add a Cab block after the Tone-Match block).

These sound great with my patches and have saved me a ton of time messing with the Axe-Fx's eqs, trying to recreate the Mesa "Classic V" curve. It's already ingrained in these Tone-Match blocks. My personal favorite is from patch #14 ("Mark V Ch3 IIC+ Bright"). The Tone-Match blocks from the "Extreme Mode" patches are also really good for a more scooped metal tone. They might work really well with your mid heavy, boxing sounding Triaxis patch.
 
Here, there difference is only in the EQ and one can be extremely easily match to the other with a simple,e EQ. So my opinion is that the Axe matched the gain structure perfectly and one is not better then the other.
 
Clark Kent said:
I think this is a case of Mesa 2:90 (best tube power amp ever) vs Matrix. I would probably use the 2:90 instead. :D

IMO you can probably get a lot closer by tweaking the Axe a bit more. Presence way lower?
Click to expand...

Ya, I LOVE the 2:90. So I think I'm going to try doing an A/B running both the Axe and the Triaxis through the 2:90 to test you hypothesis. Also, what I didn't mention is that I am running the Power Amp Sim ON in the Axe. I'm wondering whether that could also be causing some of the "honky"-ness. So anyway, more tweaking and testing today! I'm going to run the Axe through the 2:90 with Sag at 0 and see where that gets me. :)
 
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