thinking of switching from traditional (royal atlantic) to FRFR (freidman asm 12)

M

Mayco Lungo

New Member
Sorry I know that this topic has come up in the past, but my question is a little more specific and i cant seem to find an answer.

1) I am thinking of selling my Mesa royal atlantic and 2x12 recto cab and buying a freidman ASM 12, I've been using my royal atlantic head as the power amp (ax8 output thru fx return only) and the recto cab as the speaker (with speaker sim disabled off) and it sounds great even better than my amp most times. Would anybody be able to tell me what would the main differences be, as far as sound quality, of using my my AX8 thru my amp head/ guitar cab (just using head as a power amp) vs frfr speaker with power amp built in?

2) for those who have switched did you like it better or did you end up sticking with tube/cab? Also i am using the ax8 on my pedal board that has a voodoo labs power supply, should i scrap the voodoo power supply or will there be a major noise increase? (i'm not running any pedals into AX8)

Thanks any advice is appreciated :)
 
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I am interested in the ASM as well. I am ordering an AX8 and planned on using my Fryette Power Station and Splawn 2x12 but that seems like a lot to bring. I like the idea of a powered wedge but have been underwhelmed by most of the ones I've tried.
 
I'm sure some of the folks with more specific experience will chime in, but I thought I'd give you some thoughts on this. I hope it's helpful in getting your mind going in the right direction.

If you break down what you're doing now, you're using a 4xEL-34 tube 100 watt power amp into a 2x12 Recto cab to amplify your AX8. I don't know what you're using in your preset, but I would imagine using a Recto 2x12 cabinet block and a little EQ will get you close in sound. If it doesn't get you there, you may want to insert a amp type based on a 100 watt EL-34 sort of circuit and see if that gives you the flavor you're looking for in the preset.

The idea I am trying to get across is that an FRFR cab is going to give you what you give it (more or less). There are a plethora of amp types and cabinets on call with the AX8, and you can be sure the type of cabinet has as much effect as the amp in most setups... so feel free to change and try anything. You never know what will make the perfect sound or match what you want. And being able to put any amp block into any speaker block without blowing things up (like a 100 watt SLO running wide open into a 15 watt Celestial Blue for instance) puts you where you can try things you couldn't dream of "in real life."

Start with what is close to what you're using, then venture out from there.
 
Well the RA is a Mesas take on the Marshall design, if I recall correctly. So a JCM800 into a Recto 2x12 should nail it. But the whole reason to get a Fractal unit, IMO, is so you can build rigs you would never have access to normally. So in the end it's about creating your own rig and finding a signature tone of your own. That, and tweaking the hell out of famous amps :)
 
Mayco Lungo said:
Sorry I know that this topic has come up in the past, but my question is a little more specific and i cant seem to find an answer.

1) I am thinking of selling my Mesa royal atlantic and 2x12 recto cab and buying a freidman ASM 12, I've been using my royal atlantic head as the power amp (ax8 output thru fx return only) and the recto cab as the speaker (with speaker sim disabled off) and it sounds great even better than my amp most times. Would anybody be able to tell me what would the main differences be, as far as sound quality, of using my my AX8 thru my amp head/ guitar cab (just using head as a power amp) vs frfr speaker with power amp built in?

2) for those who have switched did you like it better or did you end up sticking with tube/cab? Also i am using the ax8 on my pedal board that has a voodoo labs power supply, should i scrap the voodoo power supply or will there be a major noise increase? (i'm not running any pedals into AX8)

Thanks any advice is appreciated :)
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Hi @Mayco Lungo I have an RA100 into Marshall 1936 (still do actually) and the RA100 is an incredible amp.

I tried the AX8 into a Mesa 20/20 with my 1936 Cabs with modelled Power Amps (PA) and Cabs off, with PA on and Cabs off and with everything still on. I joined a new band right when I purchased the AX8 and the style of music went from pub rock to low gain stuff so my need for sounds changed dramatically at that time. I didn't actually try to get my sound to that of the RA100 but I did play with it lots to get a good thing going. I was reasonably happy with my sound until I finally got an ASM-12 and went full FRFR. Wow - chalk and cheese - at least for me.

The AX8 is quite incredible. I love my lead sounds, the setup and teardown time, everything really. Every now and then I bring hte RA100 out of retirement and it is still an incredible sounding amp. It is really hard comparing the actual Amp in the room to an FRFR setup as you are comparing apples and oranges (there are lots of threads on this topic). I have not gigged with a tube amp since my first AX8 gig and will probably not again. There is a ton of great sounding amps and speaker cabs inside the AX8 and lots of free and presets available. There are some guys on the forum that make presets and sell them and they do really good work too. There are so many options available inside the AX8 that I have no doubt you'll find something that blows your mind. It might not be a replica of the RA100 sound but it will be a great and flexible sound just the same.

Good luck.
 
The IR that works for you with a quality FRFR is way more flexible and better sounding than traditional cabs to me. There are many many IR's that do not work for me. Then there are ones that are ok,....then you find a killer one that your ear loves. Research and try many before you make a final call on your comparing Trad cabs with Frfr's because that makes all the difference in the world.

I have an asm and if you plan to not move it often they rock! If you need a grab n go rig look to Xitone or a CLR! I have a CLR neo, an Asm and just heard from Mic that my proto type light weight Xitone cab should be shipper by the end of the week so I can provide thoughts on comparing it with the other two soon!
 
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I haven't used your power amp and cab setup, but I do have the ASM12 and can say that is has made the transition from pedals and amps and cabs to modeling far easier and simpler for me...feels like an amp behind you and that is great. It has integrated well into my band, although I miss the "spread" of an open back cab as we aren't quite at the point of everything into PA and so forth.
 
cragginshred said:
The IR that works for you with a quality FRFR is way more flexible and better sounding than traditional cabs to me. There are many many IR's that do not work for me. Then there are ones that are ok,....then you find a killer one that your ear loves. Research and try many before you make a final call on your comparing Trad cabs with Frfr's because that makes all the difference in the world.

I have an asm and if you plan to not move it often they rock! If you need a grab n go rig look to Xitone or a CLR! I have a CLR neo, an Asm and just heard from mic that my proto type light weight Xitone cab should be shipper by the end of the week so I can provide thoughts on comparing it with the other two soon!
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Hey Cragginshred, really interested in knowing your thoughts on the XiTone compared to the ASM. Right now I'm undecided about what cabs to use for the AX8: It is between two passive 1x12 XiTone cabs (hooked up to a Fryette PS2) or the Friedman ASM12. Standing by...

Thanks,

Roy
 
Day 3 Fed Ex truck has not moved from Reno Nv due to massive snow accumulation in Sierra's. Donner summit to be specific.
Fed ex is not able to give me any updates -was hoping to get it today.
 
I have 2 XiTone's, 2 CLR's and the ASM12. All of them are fantastic. I leave the Friedman at rehearsal cause frankly it's just to awkward and heavy to lug around. I keep the CLR's at home to practice and make presets on and I gig with my XiTone's cause they sound amazing and are light. My buddy is looking to buy his first FRFR and just did a shoot out between the Matrix, Mission, Friedman, CLR and the Xitone. We had them all at his studio at once. The XiTone was the winner FYI.
 
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mmpete said:
Hi @Mayco Lungo I have an RA100 into Marshall 1936 (still do actually) and the RA100 is an incredible amp.

I tried the AX8 into a Mesa 20/20 with my 1936 Cabs with modelled Power Amps (PA) and Cabs off, with PA on and Cabs off and with everything still on. I joined a new band right when I purchased the AX8 and the style of music went from pub rock to low gain stuff so my need for sounds changed dramatically at that time. I didn't actually try to get my sound to that of the RA100 but I did play with it lots to get a good thing going. I was reasonably happy with my sound until I finally got an ASM-12 and went full FRFR. Wow - chalk and cheese - at least for me.

The AX8 is quite incredible. I love my lead sounds, the setup and teardown time, everything really. Every now and then I bring hte RA100 out of retirement and it is still an incredible sounding amp. It is really hard comparing the actual Amp in the room to an FRFR setup as you are comparing apples and oranges (there are lots of threads on this topic). I have not gigged with a tube amp since my first AX8 gig and will probably not again. There is a ton of great sounding amps and speaker cabs inside the AX8 and lots of free and presets available. There are some guys on the forum that make presets and sell them and they do really good work too. There are so many options available inside the AX8 that I have no doubt you'll find something that blows your mind. It might not be a replica of the RA100 sound but it will be a great and flexible sound just the same.

Good luck.
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Thank you so much for your response it was really helpful, I'lm definitely going to buy the asm i just love the idea of taking one cab and a pedal board to any future gigs:)
 
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Rick said:
I'm sure some of the folks with more specific experience will chime in, but I thought I'd give you some thoughts on this. I hope it's helpful in getting your mind going in the right direction.

If you break down what you're doing now, you're using a 4xEL-34 tube 100 watt power amp into a 2x12 Recto cab to amplify your AX8. I don't know what you're using in your preset, but I would imagine using a Recto 2x12 cabinet block and a little EQ will get you close in sound. If it doesn't get you there, you may want to insert a amp type based on a 100 watt EL-34 sort of circuit and see if that gives you the flavor you're looking for in the preset.

The idea I am trying to get across is that an FRFR cab is going to give you what you give it (more or less). There are a plethora of amp types and cabinets on call with the AX8, and you can be sure the type of cabinet has as much effect as the amp in most setups... so feel free to change and try anything. You never know what will make the perfect sound or match what you want. And being able to put any amp block into any speaker block without blowing things up (like a 100 watt SLO running wide open into a 15 watt Celestial Blue for instance) puts you where you can try things you couldn't dream of "in real life."

Start with what is close to what you're using, then venture out from there.
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Thank you. I 'm kind of in that phase now of getting to know which amp models and cabs i ike best. And i've started to realize the lead tones I get from the AX8 are so much more to my liking. I think i am just going to buy the asm 2 and see how it goes. Even though its heaviy its still better then lugging my RA head, recto 2X12, pedal board, cables etc... It just seems so strealined i get excited thinking about it..lol.thanks again for the help
 
bishop5150 said:
I have 2 XiTone's, 2 CLR's and the ASM12. All of them are fantastic. I leave the Friedman at rehearsal cause frankly it's just to awkward and heavy to lug around. I keep the CLR's at home to practice and make presets on and I gig with my XiTone's cause they sound amazing and are light. My buddy is looking to buy his first FRFR and just did a shoot out between the Matrix, Mission, Friedman, Atomic CLR and the Xitone. We had them all at his studio at once. The XiTone was the winner FYI.
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so the xitone sounded better then all of them huh? now i'm not sure what to get..haha..what was it about the xitone that was better? Thanks for responding
 
The XiTone had a nice cab quality in it's sound which is great for on stage monitoring. Along with being light it has a Line X coating making it ideal for gigging.
 
I've never had the opportunity to try other frfr amps but I've tried several very good sounding PA cabs plus the JBL and KRK monitors that I used to create my presets. The presets sound fantastic through my XiTone Openback. The XiTone does impart a bit of that "real amp" vib that was missing from everything else I've played through yet requires no retweaking of my tones. The only thing I'll use is a little master EQ to adjust for the room. Everything sounds beautiful on stage and through the PA. Talk to Mick, he'll set you free, my brotha'!
 
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