Really helpful level layout that I'm using

Lance Holland

Lance Holland

Inspired
This wasn't my idea...but I've really found this layout very helpful for gigging. This layout quickly lets me quickly adjust levels for a preset/scene at sound check. I've found that regardless of what I do with the leveling tool, sound level meters, etc....once I get to the gig, I'll find that a preset/scene might be a little off. I have this layout tied to the hold function on the scene button. The switches adjust the amp level -2dB,-1dB, <save>, +1dB, +2dB. The middle "save" is handy if I find I want to lock in effects.

1708961058373.png
 
guitarplayer1969 said:
How do you differentiate whether it is setting the overall preset level vs just at scene level?
Click to expand...
If you notice, the settings in my picture show "AMP-1". It will affect the level for the AMP-1 block on the specific channel. If you change channels by changing scenes, you can use this layout to adjust level for each channel.
If you have multiple amps, this will only affect the single amp since it's tied to the specific block. (I guess you could make another layout for AMP-2).
 
Why wouldn't you use performance pages for this? (I'm no expert at this - you may have a good reason or I'm missing something).
 
I use a similar technique, however, I use the level on the Output block. I have it set to cycle thru channels on the block...A is set to 0, B is set to +3dB, C is set to +6dB, and another push on the foot switch cycles back to A. I use the switch 5 position for this on the SetList page (never needed the 5th position for a song part). I use the switch's HOLD/Long Press action to reset to the A channel no matter where in the cycle I am as a panic/quick out. I used the Output block because there's no downstream blocks that might suffer level problems. It just gets louder thru the PA and monitors. I stored the Output block in my block library so when I'm creating a new preset, I just grab my standard saved Output block. By putting the function on the Setlist page, it's there for every song without editing a bunch of Per-Preset pages. If anyone else has tried this and abandoned it, please let me know what problems you had.
 
Lance Holland said:
If you notice, the settings in my picture show "AMP-1". It will affect the level for the AMP-1 block on the specific channel. If you change channels by changing scenes, you can use this layout to adjust level for each channel.
If you have multiple amps, this will only affect the single amp since it's tied to the specific block. (I guess you could make another layout for AMP-2).
Click to expand...
Thanks. I was hoping it would help with adjusting the levels between the Scenes in one preset, like the output block has, but this seems to be only for the overall preset, but still could be helpful. By the way, there is option to have it adjust AMP 1+2 in switch config for that utility layout you made.
 
Last edited:
I do the same thing with the volume of the scenes, which allows me to decouple the adjustment of the volume in a live situation on the fly and the balancing of the volumes between the scenes which I do with the Level of the AMP block quietly at home.
 

Attachments

  • Capture.JPG
    Capture.JPG
    158.5 KB · Views: 15
Lolo-G said:
I do the same thing with the volume of the scenes, which allows me to decouple the adjustment of the volume in a live situation on the fly and the balancing of the volumes between the scenes which I do with the Level of the AMP block quietly at home.
Click to expand...
Sorry, but I am new to the FM9, so still confused and really struggling with this.. As far as I understand (Which could be wrong), and in my testing, the Amp Level block for a particular channel is not scene specific - It is the same for all the scenes in a preset. Isn't the output block the only place scene leveling is located?
 
guitarplayer1969 said:
Sorry, but I am new to the FM9, so still confused and really struggling with this.. As far as I understand (Which could be wrong), and in my testing, the Amp Level block for a particular channel is not scene specific - It is the same for all the scenes in a preset. Isn't the output block the only place scene leveling is located?
Click to expand...
Yes exactly.
I prefer to work like this, so as not to touch the volume of the AMP block, it is an arbitrary choice which suits well the organization of my patches.
 
Gladiator54 said:
I use a similar technique, however, I use the level on the Output block. I have it set to cycle thru channels on the block...A is set to 0, B is set to +3dB, C is set to +6dB, and another push on the foot switch cycles back to A. I use the switch 5 position for this on the SetList page (never needed the 5th position for a song part). I use the switch's HOLD/Long Press action to reset to the A channel no matter where in the cycle I am as a panic/quick out. I used the Output block because there's no downstream blocks that might suffer level problems. It just gets louder thru the PA and monitors. I stored the Output block in my block library so when I'm creating a new preset, I just grab my standard saved Output block. By putting the function on the Setlist page, it's there for every song without editing a bunch of Per-Preset pages. If anyone else has tried this and abandoned it, please let me know what problems you had.
Click to expand...

The one gotcha you'll run into with that approach is that if you have spillover enabled for your effects changing the output level could boost or cut the volume of your delay repeats and reverb tails suddenly. If you have your delay block set to MUTE OUT or THRU it won't be an issue because the moment you leave your delay scene all the delay gets cut off. But if you have MUTE IN set to let your delay repeats spillover into your rhythem preset after your solo the scene level could could abruptly change them.

guitarplayer1969 said:
Sorry, but I am new to the FM9, so still confused and really struggling with this.. As far as I understand (Which could be wrong), and in my testing, the Amp Level block for a particular channel is not scene specific - It is the same for all the scenes in a preset. Isn't the output block the only place scene leveling is located?
Click to expand...

You are right, this approach is about adjusting the amp level on multiple channels. It affects the amp level in the channel it's in, and it's changes will apply to all scenes using that channel. The scene level in the output would let you control scenes individually.

One of the hardest parts of learning the fractal system is how flexible it is: it allows you to do everything you could with a physical rig, including all the details of having different amps at different volumes and then different downstream levels to adjust them. So there are a number of different ways people can adjust the overall level of their scenes within a preset:
  • Use amp channels, the same way that you would use the channel volumes on a multi-channel amp to level the volume of your different sounds.
  • Use the output level of a downstream block, like the cab block or a volume block, as a separate way of boosting or cutting the volume of the block before it
  • Using the scene level in the output block (with the caveat I meantioned above that effects splillover can behave badly using this approach).
I think most people use the amp block volume as their main volume setting because it best resembles a rig with a multi-channel amp people are used to. You set your clean volume in channel A, your rhythm volume in channel B, and your lead volume in channel C. Any other scenes like "lead but with a delay" just layer on top of the lead volume setting just like engaging a delay pedal would in the effects loop. Then you're only volume levelling a couple channels instead of 8 scenes.

But you could recreate this same footcontroller layout to control the output block level potentially. You'd have to look at the options available in the layout editor.
 
IronSean said:
The one gotcha you'll run into with that approach is that if you have spillover enabled for your effects changing the output level could boost or cut the volume of your delay repeats and reverb tails suddenly. If you have your delay block set to MUTE OUT or THRU it won't be an issue because the moment you leave your delay scene all the delay gets cut off. But if you have MUTE IN set to let your delay repeats spillover into your rhythem preset after your solo the scene level could could abruptly change them.



You are right, this approach is about adjusting the amp level on multiple channels. It affects the amp level in the channel it's in, and it's changes will apply to all scenes using that channel. The scene level in the output would let you control scenes individually.

One of the hardest parts of learning the fractal system is how flexible it is: it allows you to do everything you could with a physical rig, including all the details of having different amps at different volumes and then different downstream levels to adjust them. So there are a number of different ways people can adjust the overall level of their scenes within a preset:
  • Use amp channels, the same way that you would use the channel volumes on a multi-channel amp to level the volume of your different sounds.
  • Use the output level of a downstream block, like the cab block or a volume block, as a separate way of boosting or cutting the volume of the block before it
  • Using the scene level in the output block (with the caveat I meantioned above that effects splillover can behave badly using this approach).
I think most people use the amp block volume as their main volume setting because it best resembles a rig with a multi-channel amp people are used to. You set your clean volume in channel A, your rhythm volume in channel B, and your lead volume in channel C. Any other scenes like "lead but with a delay" just layer on top of the lead volume setting just like engaging a delay pedal would in the effects loop. Then you're only volume levelling a couple channels instead of 8 scenes.

But you could recreate this same footcontroller layout to control the output block level potentially. You'd have to look at the options available in the layout editor.
Click to expand...
Yeah that is the same on the Helix - Multiple ways to do things, but the FA multiplies it by 10x. The Helix is really lacking in Metering and tools for preset and scene leveling so that is refreshing.
 
Actually I just discovered the Output Block lets you set up the same utility footswitch on a Scene by Scene basis too. Now I am intrgued... Looks like I am going to have to set up a "Utility" layout with some tools
 
I started out trying to use an expression pedal on the Output block volume, but, but for me, it's hard to fine tune with a pedal without falling over on my face.:)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom