Power amp questions for Axe Fx users! Tubes vs SS (big difference?)

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webstersp

Inspired
Well I know that I ahve 2 possibilities with the Axe Fx for power amps,
solid state or Tubes.
Many poeple seems to like the Fryette 2/50/2 and for the SS power amp the ART SLA2
looks like a great choice.
There is a huge difference in price between them (299$ for the ART and 1499$ for the Fryette).

I don't want to pay that much but I use to owned a mesa 20/20 that was pretty loud and only 1 rack space, and for around 500-600$ I can get one on ebay.

So I want to know what would be the main difference between both?

* By the way I'll be using an orange 2x12 with V30's, I'll may add a second 2x12 avatar cab later.

Thanks
 
tube vs ss

if i had the cash i would do the fryette, simply because it does sound better than the art sla2. I own the art sla2 and have played through tube power amps before. The power amp sims on the axe are amazing but only get you 80% of the way. The art sla2 is nice because its 1 rack space, but keep in mind it is very heavy. IF you were playing live i think in larger venues i think the tube amp is better and will take less eq to sound perfect vs the sla2. If you are playing smaller venues you could just go direct and use the wedges as a monitor up front. if i had the money i would buy the vht or fryette for sure, but im happy at home using the power sims and cabs sims through nierfield monitors. If you don't need all that air behind you i would go direct and use the atomic powered wedges for reference. Just depend on what you really want. i would try out the mesa power amps if i were you before buying, same with the art sla2.
 
The fryette must be better but is it 1300$ better than an ART SLA2!?
I don't really want to pay more than 700$ for a power amp.
And I want a small portable kit.
I use to own a mesa 20/20 with a sans amp psa 1 from tech 21.
The mesa is a sweet power amp with lots of power for it's size!
And would like to know how it sounds with an Axe Fx (with deep mod)


By the way the SLA2 is not that heavy at 19.8lbs...
The fryette is 2 rack space and 37 lbs.
 
The last time I had the Axe, I had a 2/90/2 a 2/50/2 and the Art SLA2. I liked the ART least as it seemed very small in comparison when the volume went up. This time around I've been using a Carvin DCM 1540L (2 spaces and 14 pounds) and it runs at 1500w bridged mono. I actually have two of the Carvins becasue they are cheap. I run them in bridged mono one for each side. Plenty of balls when the volume goes up. I find the only difference between the tube power amps and the SS are that the tube amps are much easier to get a familiar tube tone. The SS requires a bit of EQ finesse to get there. The key for me on SS was more wattage for the headroom. The Carvin DCM was only $439 shipped brand new. I also bought a used Carvin FET 1000 because I wanted to see how a Mosfet amp sounded. For SS, it is definitely more "tube-like" but nothing the EQ can't fix on the DCMs. I've run the AXE through the power sections of my tube amp heads as well. They sound good, but nothing I can't replicate with SS & the EQs.
 
Have you thought about the velocity 300? I've a/b'd it against a marshall 9100 and could get it to sound just as good. With the reactance and the presence controls it's also more tweakable.
 
Check out my Matarix XT800 v VHT 2:50:2 thread. I used to tuse the Art and the VHT/Fryette is quite a bit better - however this Matrix is really good. I dont have to worry about cost as I already own the VHT, BUT, Im 95% sure the VHt is on its way.

GOOD SS amps can be as good as valve amps - most are still heavey and expensive. The Matrix works out at around $600 delivered which is twice that price of the Art, but less than the Fryette. Other SS options that work are more than that.
 
mhenson42 said:
The last time I had the Axe, I had a 2/90/2 a 2/50/2 and the Art SLA2. I liked the ART least as it seemed very small in comparison when the volume went up. This time around I've been using a Carvin DCM 1540L (2 spaces and 14 pounds) and it runs at 1500w bridged mono. I actually have two of the Carvins becasue they are cheap. I run them in bridged mono one for each side. Plenty of balls when the volume goes up. I find the only difference between the tube power amps and the SS are that the tube amps are much easier to get a familiar tube tone. The SS requires a bit of EQ finesse to get there. The key for me on SS was more wattage for the headroom. The Carvin DCM was only $439 shipped brand new. I also bought a used Carvin FET 1000 because I wanted to see how a Mosfet amp sounded. For SS, it is definitely more "tube-like" but nothing the EQ can't fix on the DCMs. I've run the AXE through the power sections of my tube amp heads as well. They sound good, but nothing I can't replicate with SS & the EQs.
Click to expand...

When you say the SS need a bit of eq finesse to get there, are you fine tuning an EQ block or the amp block (SAG, advanced and Amp geek options) on the Axe?
 
paulmapp8306 said:
Check out my Matarix XT800 v VHT 2:50:2 thread. I used to tuse the Art and the VHT/Fryette is quite a bit better - however this Matrix is really good. I dont have to worry about cost as I already own the VHT, BUT, Im 95% sure the VHt is on its way.

GOOD SS amps can be as good as valve amps - most are still heavey and expensive. The Matrix works out at around $600 delivered which is twice that price of the Art, but less than the Fryette. Other SS options that work are more than that.
Click to expand...

I'm from Canada, and Matrix is fro the UK so shipping could be pretty high!
Anyonne tried the Mesa 50/50? How would they compare to the matrix or Carvin DCM 1540L
You can find them at a pretty good price use.
 
The Mesa is a coloured power-amp.

What this means in real world terms is you will always have a bit of 'mesa' type tone in your sounds.
This may or may not be desirable for you.
Many people here are looking for a flat response power stage so it is less than ideal.
 
It's a matter of what you can live with. I had the SLA-2 and after trying my setup with a Mesa 2:100 I sold my SLA-2 and went FRFR. SLA-2 is okay but when compared to a real amp it sounds like Valvestate Marshall combo. :(
 
i wouldnt go that far. The Art in particular I owned first with my Axe. it was OK, but only having binding post O/Ps was a nause. also there was always something withthe EQ. The low mids/bass I found too "round" or "thick". it didnt have dynamics there. The highs were alittle brittle but also lacked dynamics. It was what it was - a cheap SS power amp.

The Messa 2:50:2 I tried but as James says, it does have the messa sound. the VHt stuff is more linear/neutral. Its still not flat, but pretty good for a valve power amp, and it does as you would expect offer the dynamics the Art is missing. It just felt much better to play through.

There are many SS power amps out there that would work well, BUt there pretty much all 2u, close to the same weight as a valve amp, and as much if not more money. Think Lab Gruppens, Brysons, top end Crowns, Hafflers etc.

It is, when you can put up with. For me (although I still have one last test to do when I find a location) the Matrix actually ahs the dynamics. it is flat so is slightly different to the VHT, however thats an EQ thing which isnt a problem. The thing that IS important is its dynamic, sounds good, and it very well designed and built. its very cheap for what it is. I ws pointed to 2 other UK amps that are aimed at the same spot in the PA market, and who are directly competing with the Matrix amps. They were both over £1500, and arnt any better.

So, to the question. I guess you get what you pay for. the MAtrix is the cheapest SS amp I have found (and I include the Carvin and Rocktron stuff in there as I have tried those) that actually does deliver. The fact its 1U and light is just an added bonus. If you want tohe best you either get a quality SS amp or a valve amp, but cost wise there not going to be far appart.

Even to the states/Canada the Matrix represents pretty good value IMO, even if its not as cheap (relavively) as it is in the UK, but its your choice. How much is a Messa 2:50:2 or a VHt 2:50:2 in Canada? i dont know Im just asking. i would expect those to be more than the Matrix, though no doubt there are used ones available. if you cant afford the price of the Matrix, then you have to lower your expectations, in which case something like the Art or Rocktron are still fairly good options - there just not the best out there.

at the end of the day, as Jay and co keep saying, a well designed quality SSs power amp is actually preferable to a valve power amp, bu they cost too. why pay $1500 to $2000 on an Axe-FX and amplify it through a $300 amp? Each part is just as important.
 
in fact, having looked at your fisrt pst again, and doing a conversion, you get

Art SLA - $300. OK, but nothing spectacular
Fryette 2:50:2 $1500. Great gerat amp, heavey though and expensive

the Matrix works out at around $690. Thats half the price of the Fryette, and just over twice the Art. Personally having owned all 3 now I think thats a pretty fair reflecton. I would still go Matrix at thoses prices, but if you really want the best, and dont want to risk not being happy with SS then the VHT is still a great piece of kit.

Everything in context.
 
It is a bit like if we XT-800 owners are starting to get a bit pushy. Let the guy decide for himself what to do. It is his money!

He got his wanted advice!

Lightningboy, when are you going to follow the white rabbit?
 
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Absolutely DADA, im not pushing him toward the Matrix (at least Im not meaning to). im mearly saying that cheap SS amps are not as good as valve amps. If youcan live with what the DO do then thats fine. i was then pointing out that GOOD SS Power amps can match a valve amp. I also mentioned there are plently out there - many more accessible to those in N. America, however theMatrix despite its import and £/$ costs is still a viable option IMO.

His choices for me are;

1. Art SLA, cheap and known - both the good (size/weight) and bad.
2. Propper Valve amp - expensive, large and heavey
3. Something in between in price - that is quality SS WHICHEVER one he goes for. Brysons and Crowns are going to be more availbe to him used than to us for instance.
4. If he doesnt feel he can go SS, then the used valve market is there, at about the same price point I should think as the Matrix would be (and maybe thinks like the Steward Work that Lightnigboy uses?)
 
Oh - I would also comment on the Messa 20/20.

personally Iwouldnt touch a 20/20 rig with the Axe. Not that their not good, BUT there isnt so much clean headroom - and that is really a must with the axe. Although their loud woth normal Pres lIm not convinced on their suitability with the Axe-FX.

$700 would get him a pretty good SS amp, even if not the Matrix )which will run at 500Watts bridged into an 8 ohm cab shiould you wish) there wold be some pretty good used options for that price I should think (though obviously I dont know th Canadian market).
 
paulmapp8306 said:
Absolutely DADA, im not pushing him toward the Matrix (at least Im not meaning to). im mearly saying that cheap SS amps are not as good as valve amps. If youcan live with what the DO do then thats fine. i was then pointing out that GOOD SS Power amps can match a valve amp. I also mentioned there are plently out there - many more accessible to those in N. America, however theMatrix despite its import and £/$ costs is still a viable option IMO.

His choices for me are;

1. Art SLA, cheap and known - both the good (size/weight) and bad.
2. Propper Valve amp - expensive, large and heavey
3. Something in between in price - that is quality SS WHICHEVER one he goes for. Brysons and Crowns are going to be more availbe to him used than to us for instance.
4. If he doesnt feel he can go SS, then the used valve market is there, at about the same price point I should think as the Matrix would be (and maybe thinks like the Steward Work that Lightnigboy uses?)
Click to expand...

It was a thought and of course I agree totalyyyyyyyyyyyyy:D
 
A big thanks for all you reply!
I don't want the cheapest one, my budget is around 700-800$ for the power amp.
And light weight is jsut a bonus (sound is the most important) I want the best bang for buck to get the sound I want!

Is the type of music i play important for the type of power amp I choose? (ss vs tubes)

My main band sounds like: (The Used, Story of the Year, Finch etc)
I also play in a cover band, most of the songs we do are 80's hair metal (White Lion, Def Leppard,Guns)

At first I'll be using an orange 2x12 cab with V30's, I'll may try the FRFR route but later!
 
I forgot to ask
How loud is a SS power amp like the matrix or the Stewart?
I mean I know how loud mesa are and most tube amps but waht about SS?
 
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