Power Amp Opinions

BBN

BBN

Fractal Fanatic
Looking for some power amp opinions on what you may be using....
(For those who care to read this) here is the reason I'm asking:

I've been testing my Ultra though every amp/cab I own. I have 4 Mesa cabs ( 4x12, 2x12, 2x12 and 1x12 Theile)...all of which are loaded with V30's. (And I have some Mesa Black Shadow somewhere in my closet that I could load into a 2x12 or 1x12).
And for Rack Power Amps I have a Marshal Mono Bloc 9100 (100/100 all tube), Marshall Valvestate 80 Watt Solid State (garbage), Marshall 20/20 (all tube) and a Crown Powerbase 3 (Solid State).

The ultra sounds amazing and HUGE through the 100 Watt Marshall Tube Power Amp, and through my 4x12 Recto cab! (with the Power Amp sims off).
But what I'm realizing is that when trying different amp blocks in my Ultra, there isn't a 'huge' difference in tones because my Power Amp and Cab are always the same. And as some of you are probably already thinking....no matter what Amp Block I pick, by using the same Marshall Power Amp and Vintage 30's....my tone always has a "marshall feel" to it.
So in effect, I don't feel that I'm getting the most out of the Axe's versatility.
(I'm fully expecting a comment here like - "if you don't want the Marshall tone, why did you buy 3 Marshall Power Amps?!")
I do like Marshall tone...but I'd like to get of a variety of tones (since the Axe is great at doing that)

Now taking the alternate approach....if I run through my Crown Power Base (Solid State), and turn the Amp Sims on. I get a very good tone...but it still doesn't have quite the same open/crunch tone as my Marshall Tube Power Amp. But on the other hand, when running through the Power Base Amp, with amp sims on, the different amp blocks seem to have more of their own flavor (more differentiation between amps)...which I like.

My question is....is there a middle ground here? I'd like to go though a Solid State amp so I can keep the amp sims on, so that I get more distinction between amp blocks....but I would also like a bit more of the open/crisp/air type tone that my tube power amps provide.

Any opinions on if the new Rocktron Velocity 300 may bridge that gap a little....or would more people recommend using the Art SLA 2, and just tailoring the power amp section in the amp block on the Axe to get closer to a real tube tone.

Just a quick note....I usually gig with my 1x12 cab (or the 2x12 on larger stages)....so lugging out the Marshall 100 watt tube power amp, isn't something I really want to do. I'd like to have a 1 space Power Amp.

So any opinions on what 1 space amps people are having great results with, would be very helpful.

Thanks in advance for any advice and opinions!
 
You may find the old Mosvalve power amps interesting. One of the configurations I'll go out with is the Axe into a Mosvalve 500 (Model #942) and into 2 1x12 cabs. Advantages: Mosfet circuitry that provides more of a tube like feel -- Some coloration, but A LOT less than your Marshall or most others so the powerblock sims can be of use-- serious amount of headroom --Cheap, usually you can find one in good condion for somewhere around $350 or so. Disadvantages: No longer made and can be a bit tough to find one in good shape -- Heavy as hell -- The 500/#942 is two space, the lower wattage #962 is one space, but may not have enough headroom.

I also use the SLA-1 and SLA-2 and find them to be great choices as well. I don't find a dramatic difference between using them and the Mosvalve. Imho, the Mosvalve has a better feel, but that's about it.

You may also want to try a tube amp that is less colored. Occasionally, I'll go out with the Axe plugged right into the front of a 50 watt Holland Lil Jimi that's set up to run cleaner and biased just a touch cool. I use some power sims and also just run some patches with effects and drive blocks but no amp block. Now I'm not looking to nail certain amp tones dead on with this kind of a rig, but it does "flavor" the Holland pretty nicely. This is about as close as I ever get to a grab and go rig. Check out the Pearl from Daniel Klein over at Port City Amps. It's built specifically for this purpose. I have one on order to use exactly like this. For club work, this is starting to become my favorite setup.

I think one of the best things about the Axe is that anyone and everyone can find a way to fit it into their gear and mindset. I have specific rigs set up for specific gigs and each has it's own set of patches tweaked for that purpose. For recording, I'll use the Axe direct with all the sims on and with Redwire IRs. For larger live gigs it's FR and directly to the FOH with an 8ma or Atomic 6l6. For clubs where vocal are FOH but backline has to cover the room, it's the Mosvalve, Art Sla or the Holland (and soon the Pearl from Port City).

So check out all the options. You may be surprised at what works!
 
Ah....the old MosValve...I used to have a 962! Wishing now that I didn't sell it!

Any other power amp opinions out there???

Anyone who can comment around what type of flavor or color the Rocktron V300 adds vs. the ART SLA?
 
You may want to look into the FR world. I like to use a traditional cab when I miss having that look of tone behind me. So I went and bought a pair of unpowered FR cabs (Verve 12M's) and use my SLA-2 to run both types of cabs depending on what I want or need. FR will give you way more options with respect to tone but it is a little more challenging to dial in. All of my cabs have v30's in them as well and it pretty hard to get any of them to sound like a open back 212 loaded with Blues. Truth be known I rarely plug i to my traditional cabs any more and are sitting around collecting dust at the moment. his is what happened to my tube head when I started to realize how good the Axe was at producing a really good guitar tone.
 
Thanks Sixstring.
I should have also mentioned that I have a pair of QSC HP122i's and a pair of the old RCF ART200a's (....and an equipment purchasing issue).
I have tried briefly running into one of the QSC's and I liked it...but didn't love it....but I didn't really spend a lot of time dialing it in (to be honest). I was just wondering how the Amp Sim was going to sound when I try to run direct into FOH in a live situation. So maybe I'll mess with that FRFR option a bit more. And I should probably grab some Redwirez before I do (based on the discussions I've seen on this forum).

Would still love to hear some other rants/raves about power amps if anyone would care to share....?
 
The middle ground is use the Marshall monoblock with amp sims ON. Theres enough clean headroom so your not pushing the power valves - well I think there is as my VHT 2:50:2 handles it fine.

I used an Art SLA prior to the VHT, and while it was good - it was missing that opwn crunch you mention. The VHT does that. Turning the Power amp sims On gives more flexability.

That said the biggest limiting factor IMOis using real cabs - not the power amp (as long as the power amp is running clean). The only way round that is FRFR - which I find looses the feel of a real amp,but then its not supposed to be a real amp in that configuration but a mic'd cab.

Choices, Choices
 
Big fan of the Mosvalve stuff here... the 942 mentioned above, or the MV-962.. stereo, usable in Mono, pure power, no preamp.....
 
I have a Rocktron Velocity 300 that I use with two passive atomic reactor cabs and it sounds really good. I keep the reactance control very low as not to get too boomy sounding. The definition control gives you lots of flexibility in adding just the right amount of bite. It's relatively cheap and works well enough for me. It's fairly loud as well once you get it past the halfway point.
 
You have the right cabs, but the wrong speakers. DO NOT
use V30's, they will color they hell out of the sound. You will
play hell trying to EQ a natural sound out of your presets.
Use your Black Shadows in some Boogie cabs (Thiele's will sound
great). Then power the cabs with the Marshall power amp.
If that gets you close, then go the last mile and get some really
clear tubes in that Marshall. Especially the preamp tubes.
Get some NOS British on Ebay. For power tubes, JJ KT77
will sound bigger and clearer than EL34's.
 
Yes, I threw one of my Black Shadows in the Theile cab and it sounded nice. Clearer and less colored than the V30.
I A/B'd the Theile to a QSC K12 and thought the K12 sounded a fair amount better.
I also did hours of A/B'ing with the QSC K12 vs. the QSC hpr122i and found that the HPR is (so far) the best fit for me.

For anyone interested on the QSC K12 vs. QSC hpr122i....the HPR has a much tighter low end and just sounds bigger. The K12 has a clearer and sweater top end though. I like to do a lot of chunky palm muting, so the HPR was just a better fit for me. But both are great FRFR's. Together they sounded amazing.

As I get more acclimated to the FRFR, I am liking the sound of a real guitar cab less and less. I may still try the Rocktron V300 though with my Theile cab, since I have all kinds of GC Store credit after returning the K12. And I will continue my search for the FRFR that fits me best (Atomics are next...also excited to hear the QSC KW and JBL PRX600 series' when they come out).
 
BBN said:
As I get more acclimated to the FRFR, I am liking the sound of a real guitar cab less and less. I may still try the Rocktron V300 though with my Theile cab, since I have all kinds of GC Store credit after returning the K12. And I will continue my search for the FRFR that fits me best (Atomics are next...also excited to hear the QSC KW and JBL PRX600 series' when they come out).
Click to expand...

If you are running the rounds if you can, you may want to check out the FBT Verves as well.
 
I would love to check out the FBT Verves!....problem is finding one to try here in Boston (or surrounding states).
Nobody seems to stock these around here.

If anyone knows of a dealer or music store that has one of these, please let me know!
 
What you guys think of the Celestion G12t-100 speakers you think this would work better than the Black Shadows C90. ?
 
BBN said:
I would love to check out the FBT Verves!....problem is finding one to try here in Boston (or surrounding states).
Nobody seems to stock these around here.

If anyone knows of a dealer or music store that has one of these, please let me know!
Click to expand...

You might try these guys though I recall seeing a tread here that they were no longer going to carry them because it was to hard for them to get. But they still show them on their site. eMail them for a quote and see what you get.

Powered versions
http://springtree.net/catalog/fbt-verve ... -5359.html

Passive versions...
http://springtree.net/catalog/fbt-verve ... -5358.html
 
I agree that you should try switching speakers before the power amp, though I would recommend SS power. I have been using the Axe with SS power with great results - no need for tubes IME. I also have a couple of 4x12's and several 2x12's, all loaded with V30's. I like V30's, but have been wanting something less colored as of late to allow more of the Axe's versatility shine through. The FR/cab route doesn't appeal to me at the moment (for live sound) because I don't want to be limited to IR's, so I have been looking at speaker and cab alternatives.

I recently picked up a pair of EVM 12L Black Labels and loaded them into my Mesa Recto 2x12 - it was just what the doctor ordered. Cleans and dirt tones are much better, and the low end response if phenomenal due to the high Xmax of the EVM (compared to conventional guitar speakers). They really push some air. I've been pumping 450 watts into the 2x12, and it is slammin. I have another Recto 2x12 on order with another pair of EVM's waiting. The cabs also sound great turned on end in the vertical position. They didn't sound as good like this with the V30's due to the limited low end (compared to the EVM) and upper mid spike.

I have also had surprising luck running the Axe into my Bag End S15 D's. These cabs behave more like 12's in the midrange, and have great top end extension (up to 5kHz), so not your typical 15 inch speaker. I think the ideal may be the S12D though - gonna have to pick one up here any play around.

If you wanna go big, check out the Bergantino NV 412 - you need some high power SS to drive it, but it slays with the AxeFx.

While the Axe sounds great with conventional guitar cabs, pairing it with a lot of SS power and speakers to match really takes it to another level you can't get with a conventional rig, which is what its all about, right?!!

JR
 
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