Not getting what I want out of my Axe...

G

grunge782

Member
So I've owned the Axe Standard for about 2 months now. I've read around on the Axe-wiki a good bit and while I can get some great warm and fat clean tones and some great tight high gain tones there is a lot more I'm trying to coax out of it.

2 tones I am really trying to get right now is a nice fat rock jcm800 tone (the fucking champs) and a very bell-like, but shimmering clean tone. Something about the feel on the clean tones feel really off to me. They sound well, solid-state.

I'm running this setup

Axe FX Standard->MosValve 962 (gain and presence at about 9 oclock)->Legacy 2x12 (g12t75&V30)
JCM800 model
Blues model

What settings would you guys suggest and do you think there is a problem with my poweramp/cab/speaker setup? Should my MosValve SS poweramp level/gain be cranked and use the Axe-FX?

I'm trying to hold onto this thing, but it just isn't quite doing it for me right now.

I'm particularly interested in how you guys like setting up page 2 and 3(advanced) on the amp

Also one last thing I noticed about the Axe. I was very impressed by its Recto models on the low strings, but I am so confused how it sounds just like a recto there, but once I do leads it becomes way too smooth to sound like my Recto. Any ideas?

Guys, please be specific about settings too. If you think the speakers or the MosValve is the problem thats one thing, but I'd also like some help or trick/tips on using the settings (especially page 2 and 3 of the amp settings).

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
For the clean you are describing, try the Top Boost amp. However, the speakers you are using probably aren't the best match for what you're looking for.
 
kruzty said:
For the clean you are describing, try the Top Boost amp. However, the speakers you are using probably aren't the best match for what you're looking for.
Click to expand...

What would you suggest?
 
Thanks on the clean front guys. I worked with the dumble amp model today and got something I really like.

I'm still chasing that JCM800 tone though, I can't seem to coax that famous sizzle out of it.
 
grunge782 said:
Thanks on the clean front guys. I worked with the dumble amp model today and got something I really like.

I'm still chasing that JCM800 tone though, I can't seem to coax that famous sizzle out of it.
Click to expand...

Try direct, it could be your guitar speakers...
 
Muris_Varajic said:
grunge782 said:
Thanks on the clean front guys. I worked with the dumble amp model today and got something I really like.

I'm still chasing that JCM800 tone though, I can't seem to coax that famous sizzle out of it.
Click to expand...

Try direct, it could be your guitar speakers...
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought V30's are a good match for Marshall mid gain?

EDIT: Also all I have is a crappy guitarport, so for the time being thats all I have to go on. I have more V30's so I can swap the 75 out and I'll try that.
 
grunge782 said:
Also one last thing I noticed about the Axe. I was very impressed by its Recto models on the low strings, but I am so confused how it sounds just like a recto there, but once I do leads it becomes way too smooth to sound like my Recto. Any ideas?
Click to expand...

I'd like to take you comment further as it coincides with my own observations. It's not just the Recto model, all of the higher gain models have exactly the same distortion characteristics. It's as if they were all made by taking what I call a "base" distortion, then pre filtering, Eq-ing, etc until the frequency spread resembles that of the intended amp being modeled. But between amp models, this common "base" distortion makes every model "feel" the same, and it becomes apparent especially when you play leads. I don't like playing leads on a Recto, but I know what you're talking about, the gain on a Recto and its father the SLO100 is saturated and clear at the same time, and even with a full chord you can hear each note individually. I'm sorry to tell you that, unless M. Soldano's famous and much copied preamp circuit is modeled accurately, you will not get that on the Axe-FX.
 
grunge782 said:
2 tones I am really trying to get right now is a nice fat rock jcm800 tone (the f**** champs) and a very bell-like, but shimmering clean tone. Something about the feel on the clean tones feel really off to me. They sound well, solid-state.
Click to expand...

The cleans are tougher, but they are there. There's a preset called 'Squeaky Clean', that with tweaking has been awesome for me. You HAVE to set it up for your situation. #1. I'm not sure those speakers are going to get you there. IMO. I use the Atomic FR, so I have everything on, so YMMV. I will try later tonight to do a webcam thing that shows what I do, but I still don't get how we're not in Fender zone there....

The fat rock JCM800 tones are there. I get good stuff out of the JCM800, but try the Brown model, 5150, and/or the CAE Rhythm's (the Fractal crunch is VERY good too.) The problem with your setup is that the defaults may or may not work for you, so you have to compensate.

My impression is that it's your setup somehow, that something's not right there. For instance, DON'T TWEAK at bedroom volumes...don't work. Wait if you have to until you have the house to yourself, crank it, and you'll be amazed.
 
fuzznut said:
grunge782 said:
Also one last thing I noticed about the Axe. I was very impressed by its Recto models on the low strings, but I am so confused how it sounds just like a recto there, but once I do leads it becomes way too smooth to sound like my Recto. Any ideas?
Click to expand...

I'd like to take you comment further as it coincides with my own observations. It's not just the Recto model, all of the higher gain models have exactly the same distortion characteristics. It's as if they were all made by taking what I call a "base" distortion, then pre filtering, Eq-ing, etc until the frequency spread resembles that of the intended amp being modeled. But between amp models, this common "base" distortion makes every model "feel" the same, and it becomes apparent especially when you play leads. I don't like playing leads on a Recto, but I know what you're talking about, the gain on a Recto and its father the SLO100 is saturated and clear at the same time, and even with a full chord you can hear each note individually. I'm sorry to tell you that, unless M. Soldano's famous and much copied preamp circuit is modeled accurately, you will not get that on the Axe-FX.
Click to expand...

Boy do I not agree on that. The SLO is my favorite high gain amp so far. EVERYTHING about this amp is related to the cab model and how your setup works as well. I get good note definition and WHUMP.
 
To the OP.

I know exactly what you mean man, even though you will get eaten alive quick for saying it.

Most of the high gain models do indeed sound like the same basic distortion with layers of eq.

on the flip side , over at harmonycentral, someone posted up clips of like 9 different high gain amps through the exact same amp, with the exact same riff played through them.

It was unbelievable how close they all sounded.

As a matter of fact... ill post it here...http://www.mediafire.com/?mumexziz4md

so yeah imo , it feels like the axe-fx can really nail the low end differences between these amps, but in the single notes and really high timbres, it all begins to sounds very similar and not nearly as authentic as i would like.

Like its amazing how much tweaking i have to do (direct mind you) to get the recto model high end to sound like .... a real rectifier. Whereas in real life... good luck, dialing out the rectifier sound out of the rectifier.

Sometimes i wonder if the reason alot of people don't notice this is that high timbres are the first victims to hearing loss. In my case last time i had my hearing checked, i could hear a ways beyond what the average human could.
----------------

on a more helpfull note. Crank the dampening, that helps on single notes i find. Something around 7.5.

~mx~
 
oh and as was mentioned the new fender model that is coming out sounds like a 100% step forward in realism and authenticity.
I think that was the first clip to make me go WOW.
~mx~
 
I don't think the higher gain amps in the Axe-FX sound anything alike. At all.

Recto and SLO models sound similar to you? Really?

Sorry, can't help here. I am sorry you are not getting what you want out of the Axe-FX. Perhaps it is not the proper choice in gear for you.
 
The axe preamp are spot on the real ones.
Till v9.00, each amp sounded very different.
V9.00 improved power amp emulation lead to a "masking effect". There's a lack of trasparency, an overly compressed and saturated sound. The clean and crunch sound benefit are wonderful, whilst lead tone became "mesa style".

I miss my V8 lead, and I failed to tweak them to the same quality level in V9.

We'll see if v9.01 reworked poweramp emulation solve this issue...

Fuzznut, each amp in Axefx sound different. You can make they sound close, it's a matter of tweak... :)
 
Muris_Varajic said:
Maybe this is pointless but, you do have cab (and probably poweramp) sims OFF in AxeFx?
Click to expand...

Cab sims are off.

I wasn't sure about the poweramp sim with my MosValve since its a solid state. For a Marshall to sound right, you really need to hear its powersection in my experience.
 
electronpirate said:
grunge782 said:
2 tones I am really trying to get right now is a nice fat rock jcm800 tone (the f**** champs) and a very bell-like, but shimmering clean tone. Something about the feel on the clean tones feel really off to me. They sound well, solid-state.
Click to expand...

The cleans are tougher, but they are there. There's a preset called 'Squeaky Clean', that with tweaking has been awesome for me. You HAVE to set it up for your situation. #1. I'm not sure those speakers are going to get you there. IMO. I use the Atomic FR, so I have everything on, so YMMV. I will try later tonight to do a webcam thing that shows what I do, but I still don't get how we're not in Fender zone there....

The fat rock JCM800 tones are there. I get good stuff out of the JCM800, but try the Brown model, 5150, and/or the CAE Rhythm's (the Fractal crunch is VERY good too.) The problem with your setup is that the defaults may or may not work for you, so you have to compensate.

My impression is that it's your setup somehow, that something's not right there. For instance, DON'T TWEAK at bedroom volumes...don't work. Wait if you have to until you have the house to yourself, crank it, and you'll be amazed.
Click to expand...

Well part of the reason I want to keep the Axe is to use it at reasonable volumes. Its not "low" low, but its not completely cranked. I thought the Axe was good a low volumes?

And thanks I'll try out that clean preset.
 
Scott Peterson said:
I don't think the higher gain amps in the Axe-FX sound anything alike. At all.

No they sound pretty different to me, I'm happy with high gain mostly (except that weird quirk with the Recto on leads) What I'm asking for is help on getting a good thick JCM800 rock tone (NOT for lead wankery)

Recto and SLO models sound similar to you? Really?

I didn't say that....

Sorry, can't help here. I am sorry you are not getting what you want out of the Axe-FX. Perhaps it is not the proper choice in gear for you.

Cool then :roll:
Click to expand...
 
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