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Noob question on 4CM with two speakers

rickbarclay

Inspired
Hello. Thought I'd start a new thread for this. I have my rig set up according to the instructions on page 21
of the manual. I have my power amp and speakers connected to OUT1-L and In2 L and I have my combo
amp's RETURN connected to OUT1-R. I get sound out of both rigs, so I'm happy with that.

In order to get simultaneous sound out of both rigs, I had to configure my preset as shown in the photo below.

The top line is connected to my power amp and speaker cabinet. The line below that is my combo amp connection.
All the inputs and outputs are set to stereo. What I want to do is get some kind of panning to and fro the speakers.

My question is: am I doing this correctly, and what can I do to improve this preset's configuration?

Thanks, as always for your help.

 
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Zwiebelchen

Fractal Fanatic
If you only connected poweramp and cabinet to Out 1 L and your combo amps return to Out 1 R, then this is not a 4CM setup and does not require the FXL block.

If so, what is connected to Input 2 L? It makes no sense from your description. There shouldn't be anything running into Input 2 L from what you wrote.


To have both amp model sims going to different speakers, simply pan them hard left and hard right on the mix page.
 

rickbarclay

Inspired
Input 2L is connected to the power amp's SEND. The power amp produces no sound when the FX loop is bypassed. I panned
the speakers hard left and right as you directed, and they work very well. Thanks for that.

Everything is setup as shown in the preset photo above. The speakers actually sound better now than they
ever have, pre or post AXE. Usually, I surf around a lot with effects pedals, but I've been using this setup for
and hour or so, and I like it so much, I haven't changed to another preset once.
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
By "power amp" I assume you mean the Splawn amp following the 4-cable method diagram. (Typical amp head = preamp and power amp in one device. The power amp is what the signal goes through between the return jack and speaker output jack.)

You still have an FX Loop after an Axe-FX amp sim and other effects there. I'd replace that with a shunt before continuing. Or replace the amp block in that row with the FX Loop block.

If bypassing the FX Loop block causes the amp to not sound, it's probably set to MUTE bypass mode. You can change that to THRU but again, I don't think you'll want to start out by having 2 preamps (Axe-FX amp sim and Splawn preamp section) in series. Remove the FX Loop block or use it in place of the Amp block, before delay/reverb.

If you click "output" at the end of the grid there are level & pan controls for each row. Pan row 2 left (-100) and row 3 right (100) to isolate the rows to 1 output channel each. I'm not sure what you adjusted already but that's a simple way to ensure a row is going to just one side of Output 1.
 

rickbarclay

Inspired
Ok, I've deleted the top row amp and cab block and am using the fx loop block. That seems to be the only way to get sound out of the power amp (no fx loop=no sound). I checked the FX Loop block,
and it is set to THRU. That's where its been set the whole time. If I wanted to use an amp block instead of the FX Loop block, could I perhaps set the bypass mode to MUTE? I'll try that and
see what happens.

When I click on the "output" at the end of the grid I see 4 "LEVEL" controllers and 4 "BALANCE" controllers. I assume those are the PAN controllers you're referring to. I'll most likely tinker around
with those controllers to see how they affect the sound. Right now I'm using the pan controller for each individual block that I want to pan.

From what I gather from all these posts, I do not want to combine two amps (mine and an amp block) because there is a danger of damaging my amp's pre-amp? I also think I read in the manual that
using amp blocks together with a power amp can result in something called "booming," which I think I might have experienced already. Sometimes when I hit certain strings on certain frets the
amplitude goes way up, for that one note, while playing notes at a lower volume for other notes on different frets. What I'm trying to do here is get the best of both worlds--an effects processor that
allows me to model different amps or play through my own amp. I believe I was told in another post in a different thread that I could do amp modeling using 4 CM.

What if I set the P.A. SAG to zero? I tried that and seemed to get good results. Right now I'm running no amp block, just the FX Loop block.

Thanks for the input.
 
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Bakerman

Axe-Master
Ok, I've deleted the top row amp and cab block and am using the fx loop block. That seems to be the only way to get sound out of the power amp (no fx loop=no sound). I checked the FX Loop block,
and it is set to THRU. That's where its been set the whole time. If I wanted to use an amp block instead of the FX Loop block, could I perhaps set the bypass mode to MUTE? I'll try that and
see what happens.
You shouldn't need the FX Loop block to get a signal to the power amp. The only reason to use the FX Loop block is when you want to include your Splawn preamp in that chain. Are you certain you have everything connected as stated, and is your Splawn's effects loop engaged?

FX Loop block set to mute bypass won't do anything useful here.
 

rickbarclay

Inspired
Ok. I went over the connections again. To make a long story short, I now can play through
the Splawn cabinet with or without an FX Loop in the chain. The Splawn's effects loop is
engaged. I can adjust the volume up or down with the loop knob. So, where are we?

Now, I assume the following: no FX Loop block means we are playing through an amplifier block;
when we have the FX Loop in the mix, then we need to exclude the amplifier block. Am I
correct? I certainly hope so. I do apologize for being such a dork, and I think you for
bearing with me.

I'm going to fool (get it?) with this thing some more and see where it leads me.
 
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Bakerman

Axe-Master
If everything's set up correctly for the 4-cable method an FX Loop block is only necessary if you want your amp's preamp section included in the signal chain. It should always be possible to use a preset with no FX Loop. Then the chain is guitar - Axe-FX - Output 1 to amp return.

Are you certain your Splawn's effects loop is engaged? If it is, the Axe-FX output 1 level knob on the front panel will affect the volume heard from the amp, so that's one way to verify.
 

rickbarclay

Inspired
I'm certain the effects loop is engaged. There's a volume control knob for the effects loop. When I turn the
knob the volume changes. I think everything is working as it's supposed to. Both of my amp produce sound
through the AXE. I just need to adjust the presets so they sound like I want them to sound.

Thanks, Bake.
 

Bakerman

Axe-Master
Something's still not right if you need to use the FX Loop block to get any sound though. Can you try the Out 1 level test? When you're on a preset that produces sound, does the Output 1 level knob on the Axe-FX front panel change the level you hear? Turn off or disconnect the combo amp off during this test so you're only hearing the Splawn.
 

rickbarclay

Inspired
I no longer need the FX Loop block to get sound. I get sound without the FX Loop engaged. Level Out 1 adjusts the sound up and down.
 
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