No good blues rock sounds? Why?

S

Stratmann

Member
I posted this thread a couple of days ago, but it disappeared for some reason. I stated that there are no good blues rock sounds possible with the Axe. My combination was AxeFX Standard > SS power amp (350 Watt per side) > 1 1xEL12L Thiele cab and 1 1x12 V30 Thiele cab.

I got a few answers with soundclips. Some were played very nicely but the sound wasn't what I am looking for. After 3 weeks of testing different combination including tube poweramps and tube heads I finally gave up and sent the Axe back.

My conclusion: If you are looking for a big number of quite decent sounds or you are into quick recording, the Axe might be for you. But if you are into just one convincing sensitive organic tube amp sound and you can afford to take your time for micing the amp, you should rather go the old fashioned way.

I don't want to talk it down, but for me it is not in the same class of a real amp. It comes closer than a Boss-GT or a Pod but it is still not there. I believe for the future it will replace real amps. This is the way to go and I will watch it. As soon as the Axe takes the next big step I am back and I will get one.

Music is a matter of taste, so you may think totally different. That's good, because than we don't sound all alike.

I wish you all a lot of fun and success with your music and thanks for willing to help. Nice forum!
 
I'd have tried to use different cabs than yours.
I'm pretty sure it's hard if not impossible to get the sound you're after with a 1*12" Thiele or (especially) a Vintage 30.
 
To me, sending gear back after three weeks is just crazy. Particularly something as complex as the AxeFX. If you were after one particular tone, why the f*ck did you buy an AxeFX? I have some units that took me years to appreciate and find their perfect niche. There are owners on this forum who have had their units for two years and are STILL finding new uses and sounds. Madness.
 
I think you may have missed an opportunity. I've stated this before and not everyone agrees but IMO, to get the best out of the Axe, you need a good FRFR setup, preferably in stereo (although not necessary). Your biggest limiting factor is your speakers, not the Axe.
 
I have a SS PA and 2x12 Cab (v30 and g12H).

Im more than happy - I think its just as good as my VHT 50ST head, and also my mates Orange Rockerverb.

Im more and more sticking to one amp/patch too. Its the Fryett High model. 2 gain levels with a FS. Cleans up really nicely with SCs with a lower gain setting, and rocks with a HB and the higher gain.

I use 5 patches total - but that patch gets 95% of my playing. Most of the rest is a clean Maz 38 patch.

It took 6 months of tweeking before I was happy to get rid of the real amp. 3 moths later I dont miss it.
 
This is the one 'downside' (for lack of a better word) to a unit as deep as the AFX - it's going to take some serious time to learn how to get exactly what *you're* looking for, but once you find the keys to creating you're tone it's all gravy, and any remaining learning curve becomes exciting as new possibilities keep popping into your head. :p
 
The Axe-Fx has defeated other players, as well. No one single piece of gear can be perfect for all players, all the time.

The Axe-Fx was clearly not the right solution for this player. However, both I and others have gotten some damn fine blues-rock sounds out of the Axe-Fx.

It's down to individual preferences - which is as it should be.
 
Radley said:
This is the one 'downside' (for lack of a better word) to a unit as deep as the AFX - it's going to take some serious time to learn how to get exactly what *you're* looking for, but once you find the keys to creating you're tone it's all gravy, and any remaining learning curve becomes exciting as new possibilities keep popping into your head. :p
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The depth got to me too... I'm a techie, and it's hard to resist the urge to just keep tweaking things. Just like one of those mice in a drug test, I'll keep hitting the Axe paddle for another dose and stop eating :twisted:

I need some kind of neural net headgear that can take the sound I envision and automaticlly program it.

But I agree, 3 weeks isn't enough time for most common processors, let alone the Axe.
 
To me, sending gear back after three weeks is just crazy. Particularly something as complex as the AxeFX. If you were after one particular tone, why the f*ck did you buy an AxeFX? I have some units that took me years to appreciate and find their perfect niche. There are owners on this forum who have had their units for two years and are STILL finding new uses and sounds. Madness.
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:lol: You make me laugh. Hey - I mean 3 weeks 5 hours a day and still not the right sound? Come on! Something must be wrong with the usability of this thing. If I wait till next year to get my sound out of this box, my version of the Axe is probably outdated by then. I bet. That's why I just wait. They will make it one day, I am sure. Then they also will have good working factory presets for all kinds of setups. Even the one I used.

I think you may have missed an opportunity. I've stated this before and not everyone agrees but IMO, to get the best out of the Axe, you need a good FRFR setup, preferably in stereo (although not necessary). Your biggest limiting factor is your speakers, not the Axe.
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Yes - you might be right. I didn't try it because a lot of people complained about the loss of the real amp feeling, which I need to have.

Just play gain sounds on your low e-string and compare it to a real tube amp and you will know what I didn't like. A good tube amp brings out a full and punchy bassy tone WITH a good portion of steel / edge / high frequenzy /twang . . I don't know how to describe it in english. The Axe didn't, at least not for me.

Why is no great blues rock player using the Axe. I have searched the whole net. What I found was a lot of fusion sounds but no sounds with real soul - for my taste. How about a Fender Super Reverb boosted with a TS808. Very common. Never heard such a sound like this comming out of the Axe. Example: Greg Koch

Or take Joe Bonamassa's tone. It's always a 2 amp setup he uses (actually 4 amps, but he uses only 2 at the same time) Great sound. Not heard from the Axe. I mean, maybe I am just to stupid, but nobody else could deliver such nice sounds too.

How about John Mayers tone on his live CD. I think he used a Fender Vibro Verb. This is what I am talking about. Not Petrucci or Greg Howe sounds. Incredible player, but the sound is not attracting to me. Take Derek Trucks for example. That's what I am looking for.

Can somebody come up with such sounds? Please let me hear it.

Thanks for your comments so far. I really appreciated it. Like I said, I will give it another try at a later time, because I want to get rid of all my heavy gear and I want to have the freedom to hook everything up like I want. I also like tweaking but after a certain time I have to get results.
 
Stratmann said:
Just play gain sounds on your low e-string and compare it to a real tube amp and you will know what I didn't like. A good tube amp brings out a full and punchy bassy tone WITH a good portion of steel / edge / high frequenzy /twang . .
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So does my Axe-Fx/FRFR system. Sorry you weren't able to find that. It was not at all difficult for me.

How about a Fender Super Reverb boosted with a TS808.
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Although I can't stand tube screamers, that is a very easy sound to get from the Axe-Fx.

Your greatest problem in getting the sounds you say you want was your choice of cabs. Neither of those is going to sound even remotely similar to Super Reverb speakers.
 
Tomorrow I will get some active pa speaker for rehearsal. I am going to buy 2 LD Systems Revolver 15A. It's actually ment for the singer. Maybe even for small clubs. If I get a chance to try the axe with it, I will give it at try. It's still here and waiting for the pickup back to G66. Maybe the long story ends up good.
 
Stratmann said:
How about a Fender Super Reverb boosted with a TS808.
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Are you able to get that sound through your current set of cabs using some other amp setup? I'm guessing not.

I don't get it. The axe isn't going to magically compensate for the other things in your signal chain. In fact that's whats' great about it - it acts like a real amp. Plugging a Marshall into a Boogie Cab will not sound like a Fender combo, so why do you think an Axe-FX into a Thiel will sound like a Boosted Super Reverb? If you want the tone of a Fender cab, you're either going to need one, or you're going to need to let the Axe-FX model one and then listen to the output through a Full-Range-Flat-Response setup.

The Axe does what it does very well, but it doesn't have mystical powers.
 
Sorry to hear you didnt 'click' with the axefx.
Im a new user as well, looking for similar sounds to what you describe and i admit Im having a harder time achieving them than other sounds such as higher gain and fusion tones but i think im halfway there. It really is a case of getting familiar with the unit and really learning how it all works together, there is no way you can do that in 3 weeks in my opinion.
I was just as worried after 3 weeks with my unit, but thanks to alot of help from the guys on the forum, alot of reading and research i started to get somewhere and now i have no regrets. (had the unit about 2 months now)
Im still not happy with the bluesy kinda tones im after but I feel like I will get there eventually.

It differs from person to person, some people have a real talent with tweaking and using their ear to achieve what they want, some people dont. I like to think im somewhere in the middle.
Generally speaking I have found it easier to get nice fusion and higher gain sounds than the lightly overdriven, tube-like, compressed tones but theyre in there somewhere.

If someone has nailed that tone it would be great to get a clip of it recorded direct online, especially as i notice this comes up quite a bit on the forum.
Certainly would prevent the arguing, just let the tone do the talking.
 
I'm a year into mine. I still have a long way to go with learning it. However, I'm quite happy with the sounds I'm getting out of it and others that I play with agree. I knew I needed to be in it for the long haul and... I am. I still have a Suhr Badger, my analog pedal board and a couple cabs. But, they haven't been used in 9 months. Chip away a bit at a time. It can get overwelming if you try to take on too much at one time. At least for me. YMMV
 
Stratmann said:
Just play gain sounds on your low e-string and compare it to a real tube amp and you will know what I didn't like. A good tube amp brings out a full and punchy bassy tone WITH a good portion of steel / edge / high frequenzy /twang . . I don't know how to describe it in english. The Axe didn't, at least not for me.
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Now I'm really at a loss. I have a recording of Kingdom Come's "Living Out Of Touch" that I did to hear what the "Evil 800" stock preset sounded like and I hear all that you describe. Right out of the box, no tweaking to the preset. If you want, I will post a link.

It's been said before. Your front end was lacking. Try it with a good full range system and then make your judgement.
 
I will give it a try. But I'll take a break for now. The Axe is already sent back. But a friend still has one he could borrow me. Like I said, I am still interested, but I refused the FRFR solution from the beginning on, because of the statements about the missing amp feel and the another reason was, in addition to the Axe I had to buy some good FR speakers. A lot of money just for testing.

Now I have bought 2 active speaker for rehearsals and small club gigs as a little pa system, but I don't have the Axe anymore to test. When I get it from my friend, I will continue testing.

Do you think the speakers are suited to the Axe: LD Systems Revolver 15A
 
I bought a Standard, sent it back, then bought another one a few months later. This time I couldn't be happier. It happens.
 
Wow,

I have the opposite problem. I can get more good sounds than
I can reasonably use or keep track of.

I got a killer "clean on the edge of distortion" blues sound the
other night using the cranked maz38 model. It went into the
top 10 and is now my default "pseudo clean" blues sound. I need to
add a pedal in front of it to push it over the edge. I have the drive
pedals switching with CC command (from a 2nd midi controller).
2 killer lead tones for the price of one :).

pneil
 
Would you post a clip of your sound? Play a few phrases also on the low E- and A- String in your sample. I am excited to hear it.
 
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