Need advice about FRFR vs (Power amp + Cab)

S

satchfrk

Member
Hi folks,

I'm a proud Axe Fx user and have been for a couple of years now. For the most part, I've used it on studio recordings. This year however, I formed a new band and now actively gig locally.

So far, I've been using a QSC K12 with the Axe FX. I make my patches at home on studio monitors at a decently loud volume and they translate pretty well when I play on the QSC K12 at gig volumes. However I've always found it very hard to be able to create patches entirely from scratch because it's so hard to pick a new amp AND a new cabinet. As we all know, the cabinet is such a big part of the sound and having that as a variable makes it even harder to create patches from scratch.

Last night I turned off the cabinet modeling in the Axe FX and plugged it into the effects return of my Blackstar HT-40 combo amp. WOW! The next few hours were just unbelievably fun. I was able to audition different amplifiers on the Axe FX and hear exactly how they all varied with respect to each other. I even discovered some amp models that I had never paid attention to before because I couldn't get a good perspective with the stock presets. Having the cabinet part of the equation be a constant was such a big deal. The other thing was that the sound was fantastic. It sounded punchy and big and just better than the K12 in general. The K12 sounds great but I'm using it specifically for this purpose and nothing else.

My dilemma now is whether to go this new route or not. I'm not at the liberty to have lots of gear lying around. So I would probably have to sell the K12 to get a power amp + guitar cabinet. I'm just curious to hear what other people think about this and if anyone else has been down the same path?

Cheers!
 
Why not just keep everything you currently have and just run the Axe into your Blackstar as you explained? Sounds like it worked great for you.
 
I played with a guitarist who used the AxeFxII plugged into the Blackstar HT-40 combo using the 4 cable method, and I agree with you. It sounded really nice, and though far from perfect with respect to the cabinet matching the amp sim, you still got a good representation of the different types of sounds available when changing amp models. There is nothing wrong with using the AxeFx this way, or with a power amp (like the Matrix) and a traditional guitar cabinet of some kind. A lot of players prefer going this route. There is no right or wrong way of using the AxeFx. It is designed to sound excellent in a number of different usage scenarios.

btw, search over at the AMPS and CABS section of the forum. All of the answers to your questions are there.
 
Tbh I was really skeptical about FRFR but playing through the Matrix 2x12 FRFRs at Amp Show was an eye opening experience. It's very cool! Not really anything to compare it with besides the fact that it sounded like a recording tone I had used, but in the room. was crazy. With that being said, i think both are great and have their own applications. cabs are still cool. I personally run poweramp+cab
 
Some people will not gel with FRFR, no matter how much you spend. I had the RCF NX-12SMA which is highly regarded.
In a search for better Feedback when needed, I bought a Diezel D-Moll Half Stack and it was so much better than FRFR for me.
Many people use the 4 Cable Method with an Amp.
Granted when I get too old to lug my amp around (currently 45), I could easily be happy with an FRFR, but I would miss the feeling an Amp gives me on stage.
 
I run the Axe with a pair of Bogner 1x12 V30's and Matrix 1000 and it's absolutely awesome. Choosing a great cab and stick to it made my guitar life easier.... (and sound much better than FRFR).
 
Thanks for the input! It sounds like there's no substitute for a real cab in the room to get that feel. I might consider going that route now..

That being said, maybe it's worth investing the time in parallel to find/create one cab impulse to use with all amp models for studio recordings and FRFR. That way I won't go crazy picking a different impulse for each new patch that I'm creating.
 
satchfrk said:
and plugged it into the effects return of my Blackstar HT-40 combo amp. WOW! The next few hours were just unbelievably fun. I was able to audition different amplifiers on the Axe FX and hear exactly how they all varied with respect to each other.
Click to expand...

I would guess the Blackstar's power section isn't neutral.

Maybe try the axefx in the Blackstar's effects loop and just use it for effects (no amp or cab sims).
 
This is an old thread but I wanted to post an update here in case someone else reads it in the future. A friend of mine was selling a Mesa 2x12 cabinet and also threw in his old power amp because he wasn't using it. I picked it up this morning, hooked up the entire setup and jammed on it for an hour.

All I can say is WOW. I had so much fun playing on the Axe Fx. The amp models are nothing short of stellar. And the best part was that now I had a solid reference point (in terms of a physical cabinet) and I could refine my patches. Personally I feel like I'm just going to keep the cab at home and use it to dial in my tones. For live playing, I'm going to continue to use FRFR and just find a suitable impulse or make one that matches my cab.
 

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Of course the downside is that certain amp models sound best with certain types of cabs (IMHO)

You can have an awesome 4x12 cab, like my 70's Marshall large check (don't make them like that anymore) loaded with GB's and for some amp models, like a Marshall-y type sound, it sounds just awesome. HOWEVER.... when I load up an amp model of something like a Fender Princeton, or basically any open back combo, it just doesn't sound right through my 4x12

Gets an overall tone more like the real amp when paired with a good 1x12 IR with some JBL or similar speakers. Ownhammer stuff in particular is awesome for 1x12.

Thats the advantage of the IR's and/or FRFR systems, in that they can give you the sound of a lot of different speakers and cabs, which would be impractical to own/carry


If you just like the sound of one cab all the time, more power to ya, but I think it cuts down on a lot of the tonal variety the axe is able to achieve
 
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