Nasal quality to all my overdriven amp sounds - See video (Pearl Jam Alive)

Stringtheorist

Stringtheorist

Fractal Fanatic
I've noticed that all my overdriven amp sounds appear to have a nasal/honky quality to them which is bugging me. This goes whether it's the Energyball, Euro Uber or Marsha models (the three I use most). I would expect all these amps to sound quite different but in a live context I can hear virtually no difference between them, and they all seem to have this same nasal midrange.

Please view the linked video from my last gig for an illustration, and see what you think of my tone. (I used the Marsha BE model for this.) I know Youtube does horrible things to the audio but trust me, the original sounds more or less the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFQ2HkqGmX4
 
How did you capture the audio for this clip ... ?

Truthfully the vocal sounds the same way .... If this is from a room mic, the problem might be your PA ... ?

FWIW - your lead break and clean sounds didn't seem to have the same quality ?
 
It's just the camcorder mic which may not be brilliant but the fact is I hear this same tonal quality when playing live. The recording isn't the issue.

Incidentally, the solo sound is identical to the rhythm sound with a 3dB level boost applied. The clean sound isn't a problem. I can't figure why all my overdriven amp sounds seem to sound identical. Maybe I'm dialling them in a certain way because that's what my ears seem to like when I'm playing alone at home.

I'll try and post the preset.
 
I am unable to the post the preset because when I try to upload it says "exceeds quota by 139Kb". when I follow the link labelled "your attachments here" all I get is a list of smileys.... This, and being unable to receive private messages. What is WRONG with this forum?! :mad:
 
Do you use the same cab IR when comparing the different amps? Maybe all the honkiness comes from it.

BTW, your tone (and playing) sounds great, I would say it's the only part in the video that sounds pro. I don't think anyone could tell you're playing direct to PA unless you tell them. Your tone is really letting the guitar's qualities shine.

IMHO you are obsessing too much about it. You've got a great tone an I bet you could hear yourself very well in that gig. And you setup must have been sooooo easy.
 
O.K. then .... Still sounds like the camera mic that's playing havoc with this recording at least. But I'll take your word for it.

Just like you, I'm working VERY hard on my EQ right now. I'm having a difficult time balancing the bottom off against the top. Get rid of the "boom" and it sounds a little shrill, so take a little off the top, now it sounds boxy .... What I'm doing is making two mid cuts. The first is -2db with a 1 octave Q around 400 Hz, and the second is -4db with the narrowest Q possible at 5 kHz.

Jamming at home w/CD's it sounds real good at most all volumes, it cuts just fine and sits in the recording like "I" think it should. But when I'm just playing without a backing, it sounds awful ..., almost NO fun at all ....

There seems to be a VERY delicate balance between the low-cut and hi-cut, I just HAVEN'T found it yet ....

GOOD LUCK ....
 
Your tone seems okay, maybe a bit bright (no pun intended).

What IR(s) do you use?
Do you have the bright switch enabled (where it's not the default)?

To delete private messages:
- select the messages
- click on Selected Messages
- click Delete
- click Proceed
Works okay here....
 
I usually have the bright switch on but turn the Treble down to near zero. If I don't use the bright switch my tone seems to lose definition in the lower registers.

Yes, I use the same stereo cab recipe for all presets. I found that my preset tone and level was too inconsistent if I used different cabs for different songs, and every gig was becoming a headache. So I found one recipe I like and I use it for everything.

Re. private messages... I've deleted everything in my Inbox and it still tells me theres over 100 files in there. I keep clicking "Empty Folder" and confirming the command on the next page but nothing changes... :/
 
too_much_power said:
Do you use the same cab IR when comparing the different amps? Maybe all the honkiness comes from it.

BTW, your tone (and playing) sounds great, I would say it's the only part in the video that sounds pro. I don't think anyone could tell you're playing direct to PA unless you tell them. Your tone is really letting the guitar's qualities shine.

IMHO you are obsessing too much about it. You've got a great tone an I bet you could hear yourself very well in that gig. And you setup must have been sooooo easy.
Click to expand...
Thank for the compliments on my tone. Maybe I am being a bit anal but I'll try and post a video later where I'm using a different amp model and I'll bet you agree it sounds virtually identical.

BTW, you don't think the rest of the band sound "pro"?... Care to elaborate?
 
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R.D. said:
O.K. then .... Still sounds like the camera mic that's playing havoc with this recording at least. But I'll take your word for it.

Just like you, I'm working VERY hard on my EQ right now. I'm having a difficult time balancing the bottom off against the top. Get rid of the "boom" and it sounds a little shrill, so take a little off the top, now it sounds boxy .... What I'm doing is making two mid cuts. The first is -2db with a 1 octave Q around 400 Hz, and the second is -4db with the narrowest Q possible at 5 kHz.

Jamming at home w/CD's it sounds real good at most all volumes, it cuts just fine and sits in the recording like "I" think it should. But when I'm just playing without a backing, it sounds awful ..., almost NO fun at all ....

There seems to be a VERY delicate balance between the low-cut and hi-cut, I just HAVEN'T found it yet ....

GOOD LUCK ....
Click to expand...

Yeah, I have this problem too. I have a PEQ on all my presets that blocks the lows around 100-190 Hz and the highs at anything down to 6 kHz. At full volume this sounds about right (occasionally still a bit bright!) but at home levels this sounds like absolute garbage with no low string definition at all. I have to use completely different presets (not just bypassing the PEQ) to have any fun at all with my Axe-FX in this playing environment.
 
Well, treble at 0 is quite radical... Try everything at default and turn up Presence instead?

As with real amps, using the same cab makes hi-gain amps sound very alike.

And what cabs are in the stereo cab?
 
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I think it sounds good. Marsha is a mid-heavy amp so your tone is what I would expect it to be given your description.
 
yek said:
Well, treble at 0 is quite radical... Try everything at default and turn up Presence instead?

As with real amps, using the same cab makes hi-gain amps sound very alike.

And what cabs are in the stereo cab?
Click to expand...
One is a Redwirez Orange V30, i5, Cap, 0in. The other is one I downloaded from Axe-Change called "2off-preshigh". I've no idea what this is.

I'll try your suggestion to go back to default setting and turn presence up whenever I next get an opportunity.
 
Stringtheorist said:
One is a Redwirez Orange V30, i5, Cap, 0in. The other is one I downloaded from Axe-Change called "2off-preshigh". I've no idea what this is.

I'll try your suggestion to go back to default setting and turn presence up whenever I next get an opportunity.
Click to expand...

I think the "Cap, 0in" is your problem right there. If you have the mic directly on the cap at 0in away you're going to get a ton of high-end. No wonder you feel you have to turn the treble all the way down...

Try something a bit further away from the cap and not pointed directly at the middle.
 
AdamCook said:
I think the "Cap, 0in" is your problem right there. If you have the mic directly on the cap at 0in away you're going to get a ton of high-end. No wonder you feel you have to turn the treble all the way down...

Try something a bit further away from the cap and not pointed directly at the middle.
Click to expand...

OK, cool. I'll give that a shot.
 
AdamCook said:
I think the "Cap, 0in" is your problem right there. If you have the mic directly on the cap at 0in away you're going to get a ton of high-end. No wonder you feel you have to turn the treble all the way down...

Try something a bit further away from the cap and not pointed directly at the middle.
Click to expand...

This is a GREAT suggestion ....

Keep in mind, I'm still not totally satisfied. But what I do is turn everything in the Amp sim to the default .... Kill all the extra blocks, except the Amp & Cab. Then I work with the Cab IR until I feel like I'm as close as I can get to what I want. Then Step 2, work with the Amp EQ's to see if I can get any closer to the ideal. Finally, Step 3 is to dial in the Filters and PEQ's ....

It's kinda like the directions on a shampoo bottle .... Lather, Rinse ..., Repeat !
 
Stringtheorist said:
One is a Redwirez Orange V30, i5, Cap, 0in. The other is one I downloaded from Axe-Change called "2off-preshigh". I've no idea what this is.

I'll try your suggestion to go back to default setting and turn presence up whenever I next get an opportunity.
Click to expand...

Ah okay. It's been a while but I never liked the RW Orange IR. But that's just me.
 
Also, V30 is a speaker with a pretty sharp upper mid-range spike to it. It helps for cutting through but can sometimes be harsh (as you have noticed).

I think the combo of V30 plus mic directly on cap is what is bugging you.

I would suggest you try blending your V30 IR with a less mid-rangey speaker. I use a V30 and G12H30 blend. On each cab I use an IR with the mic usually on the cap edge and 1" or 2" away.

I blend using the stereo cab capabilities of the cab block by loading each cab and setting the levels and pans equal and then tweaking each one slightly higher or lower based on my ears.
 
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