My XL Sounded Really Bad through a PA Today, Thats a New Experience!

[gin]

problem with direct to PA is guitar sound depends heavily on the quality of the PA. I Setup my Patches on my studio monitors and on quality PA they sound awesome! so if my guitar sounds not good its most of the time the crapy PA system and not the axe fx

 

[Moke]

I too also recommend always bringing your own guitar monitoring system. It doesn't help whatever's going on out front, but at least you will be comfortable enough with what you're hearing and feeling to play properly.

 

[chucma]

I like how everyone always assumes there's a sound guy at every gig too

Agreed. That's why I do all my own HPF and LPF in the Axe-Fx rather than rely needing a sound guy to do it; then I tell the sound guy so that they don't go and cut my sound down even further.

We started using the X32 a year ago, and the best part about it is that you can save scenes for each member of the band. This has been great on days when we've not had a sound guy at our disposal cos the 'person' behind the desk simply loads a scene and leaves it at that.

 

[dbun]

I've had this happen before when I used to use a POD HD500.
At one venue my patches just sounded nasty, whereas they worked fine pretty much everywhere else with some minor EQ adjustments to account for room etc.

 

[clarky]

problem with direct to PA is guitar sound depends heavily on the quality of the PA. I Setup my Patches on my studio monitors and on quality PA they sound awesome! so if my guitar sounds not good its most of the time the crapy PA system and not the axe fx

a slightly different angle..

problem with direct to PA is guitar sound depends heavily on "someone else's stuff"

 

[chris]

Just remember, if you were mic'ing a real guitar amp and cab, the guitar sound in the PA would probably sound just as "bad." With your amp blaring on stage, you might never know it. Also with that amp on stage, maybe the mix for the audience isn't the best and too guitar-heavy.

It all depends. But I enjoy hearing exactly what the audience hears (I can turn off my stage volume if there is any, to hear the FOH only) and making the right adjustments so it sounds good there.

 

[clarky]

Just remember, if you were mic'ing a real guitar amp and cab, the guitar sound in the PA would probably sound just as "bad." With your amp blaring on stage, you might never know it. Also with that amp on stage, maybe the mix for the audience isn't the best and too guitar-heavy.

It all depends. But I enjoy hearing exactly what the audience hears (I can turn off my stage volume if there is any, to hear the FOH only) and making the right adjustments so it sounds good there.

speaking just for myself here…
I don't worry what the guitar sounds like out front.. I don't hear it and have no control over it.. it's someone else's job..
but I do care about what I sound like on stage, cos that's what I have to work with..
if the sound on stage sucks, you'll be wrestling with it all night.. and that's too big a distraction...
so long as I feel great about the stage sound, I know I'm best placed to perform as best I can..
and that is the only thing that matters to me..

 

[chris]

speaking just for myself here…
I don't worry what the guitar sounds like out front.. I don't hear it and have no control over it.. it's someone else's job..

but the band or you can get fired from that gig or gain a bad reputation based on what you sound like through those speakers. speaking for myself, that's just as, if not more, important than how i sound on stage.

lots of variables, different situations, reasons etc. etc. etc. etc.

but i think the common audience member thinks that however it sounds, the band and sound guy and all gear involved were made to sound that way on purpose after hours of preparation and work. it's not their responsibility to know anything else.

 

[clarky]

but the band or you can get fired from that gig or gain a bad reputation based on what you sound like through those speakers. speaking for myself, that's just as, if not more, important than how i sound on stage.

lots of variables, different situations, reasons etc. etc. etc. etc.

I've never known that to be true..
the band is the band.. the PA is the PA..
different jobs and different people [unless you take your own PA of course]..

I never have any idea what I sound like through the PA.. I never have any control over it..
and most of the time I can't speak the same language as the guy on the desk..
I just have to trust him to do a good job

 

[chris]

I've never known that to be true..
the band is the band.. the PA is the PA..
different jobs and different people [unless you take your own PA of course]..

you know that because you're the musician. you know all the roles and responsibilities. i bet most audience members in club environments don't even know there is a sound guy, or what a sound guy is!

i added a bit after you replied:

but i think the common audience member thinks that however it sounds, the band and sound guy and all gear involved were made to sound that way on purpose after hours of preparation and work. it's not their responsibility to know anything else.

not arguing anything here. just saying in my experience, the audience doesn't recognize any difference. in the same way that someone watching a movie doesn't realize what the director, producer, grip, costume designer, etc did to make that movie happen, most audience members might think that the 5 people they see on stage are the ones responsible for all that they see and hear.

i guess i'm speaking more of the common weekend club/bar gig. at a large show where tickets are sold, that's possibly a different story.

but i don't know how many times i've been asked things like "why did you make the lights so bright" or "why was the music so loud in the back speaker" or other things like that when i was simply the musician on stage at a club gig. they think we are in charge of everything.

again, your situation may be completely different. so for me, what i sound like out of those main speakers is very important.

 

[Sleestak]

I always use reference monitors when dialing in my patches, and my stage backline is a pair of FRFR cabs. I usually have at least one full technical rehearsal before major gigs or tours, so I can double-check everything in band context, but most of the time only minor adjustments are necessary.

We often play club gigs where the sound engineer is at provided by the venue. I provide them with direct stereo feeds, and suggest they think of my guitar rig as a keyboard DI: other than volume adjustments to balance with the rest of the mix, there probably won't be a lot of need to add effects or make radical EQ changes. I always add that if they feel it's necessary to EQ my signal. or to add any effects, that they should do so, but that I'd like them to tell me after the gig what they did, as that is useful feedback from the person who's hearing the entire band. At any rate, the FOH operator is going to do what they think is appropriate, and there isn't much you can do about it, so you might as well make the best of the opportunity.

I've had sound men make completely useless recommendations ("...guitarists should never use reverb, or I can't get a clean mix out front..."), which I can cheerfully ignore. But I've also had some guys provide very insightful and useful comments, including a guy who took an iPhone picture of my channel strip at FOH, and emailed it to me during soundcheck. I looked at the mid-sweep and decided to tweak my patch a bit. He flattened the EQ on my channel, and gave me the thumbs-up. I asked him after soundcheck what he was hearing, and whether it seemed like the room or my guitar patch. He said the mids were too cluttered in our overall mix, and it made the guitar and keys both sound a little muddy. There is no way I could know that unless someone hearing the band out front had a good pair of engineering ears. I've kept that adjustment in my patches on a permanent basis.

 

[Anthony76]

What did you use for stage monitors?

I like how everyone always assumes there's a sound guy at every gig too

I was running straight from axe outs to two jbl eons 12" that the venue had spare and sounded good enough, vocals ran through either mackie srm450s and ev zlx12ps. No sound guy, as I said it was a small pa run from stage. Vocals, keys sound ok but axe was massively different between foh and monitors.

 

[chris]

I was running straight from axe outs to two jbl eons 12" that the venue had spare and sounded good enough, vocals ran through either mackie srm450s and ev zlx12ps. No sound guy, as I said it was a small pa run from stage. Vocals, keys sound ok but axe was massively different between foh and monitors.

those box-type powered mixers, EMX512 for sure, have no Gain control. only a level which has some pre-set gain. you can adjust a bit with the Mic/Line button, but even with that, if i use an XLR cable from the axe to the mixer, i can barely turn up the output knob on the front panel before it's too loud, with the mixer level knob only at 1 (out of 10). the only remedy is to turn the Gain slider down in the Global EQ page on the axe.

were you possibly clipping the mixer's input, leading to a bad sound?

 

[jorona11]

To remedy the harsh top-end, I'd throw on a Para-EQ at the end of your patch(or in the cab block) and set a Low Pass filter around 6-7khz. Especially if the patch was dialed in on something like studio monitors. Once the upper and lower frequencies are flying at a certain dB level, they are less than flattering.

 

[clarky]

you know that because you're the musician. you know all the roles and responsibilities. i bet most audience members in club environments don't even know there is a sound guy, or what a sound guy is!

i added a bit after you replied:



not arguing anything here. just saying in my experience, the audience doesn't recognize any difference. in the same way that someone watching a movie doesn't realize what the director, producer, grip, costume designer, etc did to make that movie happen, most audience members might think that the 5 people they see on stage are the ones responsible for all that they see and hear.

i guess i'm speaking more of the common weekend club/bar gig. at a large show where tickets are sold, that's possibly a different story.

but i don't know how many times i've been asked things like "why did you make the lights so bright" or "why was the music so loud in the back speaker" or other things like that when i was simply the musician on stage at a club gig. they think we are in charge of everything.

again, your situation may be completely different. so for me, what i sound like out of those main speakers is very important.

I think we're mostly on the same page here…
I guess the only difference is the context of the gig..
I've never played a place where the band has needed a PA of it's own

 

[Tailstop]

This happened to me last week too.. Sounded like absolute sh*t.. After tweaking on my end I asked the sound man the only question I could without insulting him : did you switch from Mic to Line? He said yes...three times. I went to the board and sure enough, Mic was switched on... Come on dude!!! I asked three times...

Could've been your issue.. Good luck in the future.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Thomas Larsson]

Hey guys my xl sounded nasty today, it is dialed in for guitar cabs on stage, and also sending with sims to FOH and sounds good. Through todays Pa it sounded harsh, trebly and scratchy. PA was an average vocal pA, but stage size meant no cabs, powered yamaha mixer sending to two ymaha 15" tops. Could not pull a usable tone at all, which has never happened before, and feedback city on high gain patches. This isnt a rip on the xl, more if anyone else has had this happen and if there are any thoughts.

Cheers
Anthony

Different PA's different sound.
That's the job for the global eq output 1.
Or the way I do it. Global cab and use the new filters in the cab meny.