Wish More for bass

[alexjplant]

Serious questions:

Are you a bassist that has used any of the amps being discussed?
Aside from the fact that these amps may not seem "special" to you, can you understand why a bassist might want a popular amp and cabinet pairing to be included as stock items in FAS products?

There's a definitely a list of "desirable" rigs that bassists are looking for in an amp modeler. I'm happy to focus on the bass amps that I've used and know very well: GK 800RB, GK 1001RB (Hartke 410 XL), Acoustic 360 (18"), Acoustic 320 ( 406 2x15" cab), SWR RedHead (2x10"+tweet), SWR Workingmans 300 (SWR Workingman 2x12").

IMHO, each of these amp/cab combinations has its own distinct sound, and to my thinking, modeling is all about having the ability to digitally recreate those sounds. Of course, it's highly subjective what would consist of an amp/cab that is worthy of inclusion.

Yes and yes. You seem to be a bit confused because you spend a lot of time calling my experience and empathy into question then mentioning about a bunch of amps that clearly don't fall into the category that I'm talking about.

 

[jimfist]

Yes and yes. You seem to be a bit confused because you spend a lot of time calling my experience and empathy into question then mentioning about a bunch of amps that clearly don't fall into the category that I'm talking about.

Apologies. As a bassist here on this forum, I'm a bit jaded. I was just curious where you stood on this, and happy that you've informed me.

What are your suggestions for bass-specific items that FAS should model?

 

[skolacki]

A GK 800RB amp/preamp model would be great paired with the Hartke Cabinets.
We don't have any 4x10 or 8x10 bass dynacabs, so my wish would be for those ( Ampeg "blue line" and newer "classic" ).

I posted a wish regarding being able to swap out onboard Dynacabs. This was because the FM3 ran out of room. It could apply to bass cabs where instead of having a bunch of guitar cabs and few bass cabs, you could exchange some guitar cabs for more bass cabs.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...h-dynacabs-are-loaded-on-the-hardware.213308/

 

[deathbyguitar]

I posted a wish regarding being able to swap out onboard Dynacabs. This was because the FM3 ran out of room. It could apply to bass cabs where instead of having a bunch of guitar cabs and few bass cabs, you could exchange some guitar cabs for more bass cabs.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...h-dynacabs-are-loaded-on-the-hardware.213308/

I think the idea of being able to swap out anything other than user IRs would probably be a headache to support. Also, I figure since we already have Hartke cabs on board, maybe a Hartke LH1000 or LH500 model would be a nice addition for completion sake? Not a super fancy amp but I love the heck out of my LH1000.

 

[skolacki]

I think the idea of being able to swap out anything other than user IRs would probably be a headache to support. Also, I figure since we already have Hartke cabs on board, maybe a Hartke LH1000 or LH500 model would be a nice addition for completion sake? Not a super fancy amp but I love the heck out of my LH1000.

Way to be positive lol. Only FAS could say if it could be done or not.

 

[pauly]

Then, there are things like the GK800RB, that simply growl

Basically, yes. That's why I don't understand many of the requests.

 

[Hulkko]

I posted a wish regarding being able to swap out onboard Dynacabs. This was because the FM3 ran out of room. It could apply to bass cabs where instead of having a bunch of guitar cabs and few bass cabs, you could exchange some guitar cabs for more bass cabs.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...h-dynacabs-are-loaded-on-the-hardware.213308/

That would be a good feature for a device that can't fit any more Dynacabs. The user could load their favorite Dynacaps to replace the factory settings if they wanted.

 

[Hulkko]

Then, there are things like the GK800RB, that simply growl

e.g. that amplifier is known from the 80s as part of Duff McKagan's sound.

 

[pauly]

e.g. that amplifier is known from the 80s as part of Duff McKagan's sound.

and mine

 

[Hulkko]

If I had to choose just one bass tool to add to the Fractal toolbox, it would be Sansamp BDDI, which I really like. For me, it's much more useful than, say, Bk7.

 

[lscottk]

Unfortunately, some folks don't seem to have the capacity to be gracious, polite and grateful. I was in a band with someone like that. Not fun at all. I lasted a couple of months and then moved on. Life is too short for negativity and entitlement.

Fractal gear is the only gear I've ever owned that kept on "giving" more. For free, no less. I just don't understand people who complain about Fractal. Making a request, sure. But to be rude just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Necr0lancer]

If I had to choose just one bass tool to add to the Fractal toolbox, it would be Sansamp BDDI, which I really like. For me, it's much more useful than, say, Bk7.

I have a sansamp BDDI and it sounds great! But if I could have it included in the FM3 that would be amazing. I'd like to keep everything in the box and not have extra cables and a stomp box hanging out. Personally I just want to keep it FM3 + Misson Expression pedal. Nothing else

 

[leagueofkruger]

For me, there seems to be quite a lot of options (in the fm9) to build and tweak a great bass sound.

Some people should spend more time reading the manual and experimenting than exposing themselves as rude and entitled.

Selfishly of course, I would be blown away if we had something like any of the Tech 21 Sansamp Geddy Lee signature effects right in the box to choose from - the MP40, YYZ, YYZ Shape shifter, DI-2112, or GED-2112...

 

[GreatGreen]

Basically, yes. That's why I don't understand many of the requests.

For some people it's less about achieving a tone and instead more about the vibes and prestige of playing through whatever piece of gear they have in their heads as being the cool thing to play through.

"I don't just want an unfiltered high gain preamp with a relatively scooped sounding poweramp, I want to know I'm very specifically playing through a model of a Mesa Recto because I think Rectos are cool." etc.

However much you respect that view is up to you, but either way I have a feeling that might be part of what's going on here.

 

[JiveTurkey]

For some people it's less about achieving a tone and instead more about the vibes and prestige of playing through whatever piece of gear they have in their heads as being the cool thing to play through.

"I don't just want an unfiltered high gain preamp with a relatively scooped sounding poweramp, I want to know I'm very specifically playing through a model of a Mesa Recto because I think Rectos are cool." etc.

However much you respect that view is up to you, but either way I have a feeling that might be part of what's going on here.

See also "I bought a modeler so I would never have to buy anything else ever again because I expect whatever it ends up being (gear-wise that is an amp/effect/speaker) to be added for free in an update"

 

[Chris Hurley]

Basically, yes. That's why I don't understand many of the requests.

Isn't it pretty much the same thing as requests for new amp or effect models that existing models can already cover with a couple of tweaks (if that)?

It is the "gotta collect 'em all" phenomenon.

I wonder where this all started in terms of guitar processors. Was it the inclusion of named amp models in a processor way back in the 90's or maybe even the settings list that said "Marshall Plexi Style"?

I have long wished that a recipe collection would emerge that could tell people how to get any sound they wanted from the handful of common models but I think people still have a "need" to collect stuff- like they have an actual collection of valuable amps to treasure.

 

[Necr0lancer]

Edit: apologies if my post comes off snarky at all. I truly intend to be as respectful as possible but I'm not as eloquent in my response as I wish to be.

I'm going to have to agree with Chris on this. I was thinking something similar but was too afraid to reply to the big man. How can you argue about not understanding specific bass amp requests when there's limited bass amp options but there's like a multitude of Plexis with minor differences?

For the record, I can get a nice bass sound without an amp and cab. But it would be very cool to have more bass amps and cabs available. Isn't that what makes Fractal devices so amazing, to be able to emulate amazing amps and cabs throughout the decades? I know most people play guitar but there are a lot of bassists as well who uses these products. There have been a lot of requests over the years for SWR, GK, Ampeg SVT Pro, Kustom, and other amps.

The sansamp BDDI (geddy lee or standard version) would be amazing and a bare minimum request.

 

[Chris Hurley]

Edit: apologies if my post comes off snarky at all. I truly intend to be as respectful as possible but I'm not as eloquent in my response as I wish to be.

I'm going to have to agree with Chris on this. I was thinking something similar but was too afraid to reply to the big man. How can you argue about not understanding specific bass amp requests when there's limited bass amp options but there's like a multitude of Plexis with minor differences?

For the record, I can get a nice bass sound without an amp and cab. But it would be very cool to have more bass amps and cabs available. Isn't that what makes Fractal devices so amazing, to be able to emulate amazing amps and cabs throughout the decades? I know most people play guitar but there are a lot of bassists as well who uses these products. There have been a lot of requests over the years for SWR, GK, Ampeg SVT Pro, Kustom, and other amps.

The sansamp BDDI (geddy lee or standard version) would be amazing and a bare minimum request.

I guess "for everything else... there's tonex pedal" or something like that. Put it in the Fractal loop... Control it via MIDI. velcro it to the board or rack. It's pretty cheap, all things considered.

I have never actually followed through with doing that but then I mainly use the Friedman and Atomica stuff that is long since included.

 

[unix-guy]

Adding this relevant comment I made in a similar thread a while back:

How many of the amps being requested are tube amps?

I ask because I suspect most are solid state... And Fractal has one and only one solid state amp model - the JC-120 - despite a lot of requests for others.

You can read the related comments after that post here:

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/help-for-bass-players.212938/post-2669767

I think the proposal there from @jimfist about using Drive block types for the fully solid state amps might be a good way to approach it, but no idea if that will actually work with the block design.

 

[alexjplant]

How can you argue about not understanding specific bass amp requests when there's limited bass amp options but there's like a multitude of Plexis with minor differences?

Somebody asked for a Phil Jones amp in the thread.

https://pjbworld.com/cms/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/BP-800-OWNERS-MANUAL.pdf

It's a 5-band fixed Q equalizer with a linear preamp (note the overload indicator) going into a class D power amp. What would modeling this bring to the table? Do we need to simulate the damping characteristics of the ICEpower module? Do we need a clip light for the virtual pre?

What about the Eden offering?

https://www.gear4music.com/Guitar-and-Bass/Eden-NovaTone-500-Bass-Amplifier-Head/5JUR

So it's a four-band semi-parametric with a one-knob compressor and "enhance" knob which is just some sort of baked-in scoop. Again, I ask you - what is this doing that can't be done with the tools already in the Fractal? Aguilar, Hartke, Peavey, TC, Trace Elliott, and Markbass all do something similar but with the possible addition of an overdrive circuit and/or limiter. They're very modular amps built around modern principles. They don't have weird circuit interactions like an old amp a la the Portaflex. Give me five minutes and I'll build you a preset that can do what these amps do.

I also don't think that we need 87 Plexis in the Fractal but that's neither here nor there. At least the case there is one of lots of component differences that can't be overcome via user-exposed parameters.