Marshall models always sound too dark to me?

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jsnleo

New Member
I used to have an Axe-Fx III for a few years and now have an FM9 Mark II Turbo, and I always feel all Marshall models are too dark. Before I started using FAS, I'd been really into Plexi style amps and owned a few, Metropoulos Metro-Plex, Bogner Helios, Friedman BE-100, Suhr SL68 and Suhr PT100. One of my friends got a Germino Lead 55. So I've played nearly every one out there. They all sounded "overly bright" and "thin" if compared to FAS models. When I tried those models for the first time, I felt like I was playing a bass amp, or a Bassman, or a Super Bass? Well I've not played them. Anyways, those models just sounded too thick, muddy, not bright enough and a little bit too gainy. Even the Friedman sounded more like a Plexi to me. I got my FM9 a couple of months ago and I tried them again and I still felt the same.

In case someone asks, I was using my amps and a Suhr RL, and OwnHammer IRs loaded in Redwirez mixIR, then switched to Suhr RLIR but still using the same OH IRs. And I tried using the same IRs with the Axe, so it was a fair comparison.

Now with the new firmware, I tried 'em again and they still felt wrong. Any idea how to make 'em bright and why do FAS Marshalls sound this way? Thanks guys.
 
jsnleo said:
I used to have an Axe-Fx III for a few years and now have an FM9 Mark II Turbo, and I always feel all Marshall models are too dark. Before I started using FAS, I'd been really into Plexi style amps and owned a few, Metropoulos Metro-Plex, Bogner Helios, Friedman BE-100, Suhr SL68 and Suhr PT100. One of my friends got a Germino Lead 55. So I've played nearly every one out there. They all sounded "overly bright" and "thin" if compared to FAS models. When I tried those models for the first time, I felt like I was playing a bass amp, or a Bassman, or a Super Bass? Well I've not played them. Anyways, those models just sounded too thick, muddy, not bright enough and a little bit too gainy. Even the Friedman sounded more like a Plexi to me. I got my FM9 a couple of months ago and I tried them again and I still felt the same.

In case someone asks, I was using my amps and a Suhr RL, and OwnHammer IRs loaded in Redwirez mixIR, then switched to Suhr RLIR but still using the same OH IRs. And I tried using the same IRs with the Axe, so it was a fair comparison.

Now with the new firmware, I tried 'em again and they still felt wrong. Any idea how to make 'em bright and why do FAS Marshalls sound this way? Thanks guys.
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I might try turning up the treble , pres or turning on the bright switch
 
Weird, with my guitars all the Plexis are plenty bright; I generally turn the Treble knob all the down to get them to work with my gear! I'd check out Burgs' (Brett Kingman's) presets on the Axe-Change, and compare your guitar through those presets to the sounds he gets. For all his presets, there's usually a corresponding YouTube video. Of course, the preset you load from him might be from a different firmware version, which would definitely change things.

If you can, please post a preset, a DI track from your guitar, and a track of that DI through the preset. With that, I'll bet someone on the forum could find a good solution for you.
 
The Marshalls sound pretty bright to me with my guitar. I generally have to control the presence or treble to get it to sit right. The 2203 model is the best one I’ve ever played.
 
Thank you guys. I know it's not fair but because I'd used those Plexi style amps for so long, when I was first using FAS, of course I adjusted the settings like I did on the real amps, and they were so different.

When I used the stock IR, yes they were bright. I also tried the DynaCab and yes they sounded bright too. But like I said if I used my IR, the ones I had been using forever with my real Plexi style amps, those FAS models sounded "wrong". I can just solve this by using stock IRs or DynaCabs, but how does Marshall amp models sound right only when they are used with stock IRs? The Friedman model sounds like a Friedman with a stock IR or a 3rd party IR, so do many other amps. Marshalls don't.
 
This is funny because they mostly sound too bright to me. Harsh piercing highs I have a hard time dialing out.
 
If I am understanding… you are comparing a real amp into a resistive load and an IR with the Fractal and the same IR?

To make it apples to apples, you would need to change the amp block Speaker Impedance Curve to a reactive load and also turn the speaker modeling (drive, compression, thump, compliance) to zero.
 
Marshalls are too bright for me. I always turn off the bright switch. Kind of changes the voicing of the amp though. I never thought they were dark. I don’t use them much to be honest.
 
toneseeker911 said:
The Marshalls sound pretty bright to me with my guitar. I generally have to control the presence or treble to get it to sit right. The 2203 model is the best one I’ve ever played.
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I gave the 2203 another try tonight. Left the bright switch on and it’s not too bad. 1000pf vs a Plexi 5000pf which is too much. Changed the curve cause the default is pretty bright. Used one of my regular IR’s and it’s sounding good.
 
jsnleo said:
When I used the stock IR, yes they were bright. I also tried the DynaCab and yes they sounded bright too. But like I said if I used my IR, the ones I had been using forever with my real Plexi style amps, those FAS models sounded "wrong". I can just solve this by using stock IRs or DynaCabs,
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You have answered your own question. You can make the Marshalls sound too dark, too bright, or perfect depending on which IR you use. Find a different IR that gives you the sound you want.
 
trancegodz said:
You have answered your own question. You can make the Marshalls sound too dark, too bright, or perfect depending on which IR you use. Find a different IR that gives you the sound you want.
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This is great piece of advice. I have no idea how the commercial IR producers are shooting their impulses, but I found out shooting the impulses with a reflective floor instead of some absorbing material (rugs etc.) does make a difference. Having some reflective material under the microphone does give the IR a push of air that I really like with Marshall cabinet impulses. So definitely give different IR’s, cabinets and IR producers a try. I suppose you can also replicate this with a Reverb block set to a room reverb and cranking up the Early Reflection volume and maybe adding some high frequencies with the Reverb EQ.
 
jlynnb1 said:
something weird somewhere, because the Marshalls are anything but dark...
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Right in fact this is the first time on a modeller they have been the right sort of bright and metallic sounding. Especially the JCM800.

Which amp are you using? Is it a vintage Marshall? Do you know how to dial them in i.e. real ones?
 
Isn't the Friedman BE-100 a fairly dark sounding amp in general? Also, try IRs based on different speakers/mics. Another factor to keep in mind is power amp saturation. The harder you push the power amp, the more brightness you'll lose. My main amp is an ENGL E860 Rackhead that I love to push quite a bit into power amp distortion. The tone is nicely balanced. However, as soon as I roll the Master Volume down without adjusting EQ/Presence, it starts to sound harsh/brittle because all the high end I tried to compensate for is coming back.
 
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