Live rig advice

H

harsh

Inspired
Hello guys. I've been using my Ultra with a VHT 2902 and Mesa Cab. Because the VHT is so heavy, I mount everything (including power conditioner) into a 6u rolling rack.

When playing live, I mic the cab, or in tiny venues with shitty PA's, have the guitars coming out through only through cabs. Getting my II this week and I want to change my setup. Would it be possible to have one output routed to the power amp, and one direct out going to the desk via XLR on every patch? That way, I would be able to use the cab in practice (or bad venues) and the direct route in good venues. Has anyone done this?

1. How do you set up your patches - how do you get the cab block going only to XLR, and have no cab sims on the unbalanced outs?
2. Do you notice any difference in how the guitar sounds FOH when mic'd, as opposed to going direct to desk?
3. the VHT is an incredible power amp but the sheer weight of it is making me re-think my decision. Is there a good 1 space s/s power amp that people have been happy with AFTER moving from valves to a s/s power amp? I'd like to move everything into a light rig in a 4u shallow rack.

Apologies if these sound like noob-ish questions, but I really dont have access to a good PA where I can set up patches going direct, so any changes I make to the routing will really only be put to the test when playing live.
 
That's entirely possible.

Put the FXL block after [EDIT: oops, this should be: BEFORE] the Cab block (but not in the last column). Or split the signal into two rows.
This makes sure your 'direct' signal incl. Cab simulation goes to Out1 (PA), and the signal without Cab simulation goes to Out2 (power amp).

There's a difference for sure. To keep the signals close, choose a cab that's similar in tone to the real guitar cab.

Many users are happy with the Matrix GT800FX: ss, light and powerful. Of course there are more players on the market.
 
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I am in the midst of dialing in this setup for the same reasons, I noticed you said placing FX block AFTER cab block.

I've been struggling a bit with tones so far for live use, and following the template (patch 381?) it has FX placed pre cab post amp...is that correct Yek?
 
Thanks Yek. Since my main rig is a power amp+cab, I've got my primary signal chain running without a cab block all the way to the output. My typical metal rythm patch looks something like this:

Chain 1: Compressor - Drive - Amp - Phaser - Flanger - Delay - Reverb - Output (everything except Drive+Amp are turned off but can be turned on if needed)

Chain 2: From the Reverb block, I've added a branch out into a Cab - FXL (not shunted to output).

I've tweaked the cab on chain 2 using headphones (shunted chain 2 and bypassed FXL, un-shunted chain 1) till it sounded good, and then changed the signal chain back to how it was, so I could go back to using my power amp and cab.

Balance on both chains is at 12:00 (not sure if i should change this). Am I correct in thinking chain 1 will go into Output 1 (Power amp + cab), and chain 2 will go to Output 2 (will be connected straight to FOH via XLR)? Do I need to make any changes?
 
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I stated it wrong. FXL should go before Cab, as Bakerman writes.

Normally you would use Out1 to feed the FOH because you can use balanced connections.
By placing the FXL before the Cab you send a signal without cab simul. to Out2.

So you can adjust your routing by not splitting the signal (keep it on one row), connect Reverb to FXL, FXL to Cab, and then to the end of the grid.
 
Brilliant, thanks Yek...that routing works nicely. The only issue is that the factory presets now can't be heard (they are all routed to output 1, while i'm using output 2 for my power amp). How do you go around this problem? I can only think of 2 possible solutions - insert FXL loop in all patches, or keep changing the output back to output 1 when using any of the factory presets. Is there a simpler way?

Also, I took the rig to the studio yesterday and routed the balanced outs to the PA, and Output 2 to my VHT 2902 and Orange 4x12. While the cab tones sounded huge, the patches sounded thin and digital on the PA. I'm thinking the amp sims need to be tweaked (more sag, depth, etc) but this will make my cab tones sound bad. Do people set up different amp sims for different routes (direct to desk vs amp+cab) or is there a way to use the same settings in both scenarios?

Thanks for your help so far, much appreciated.
 
If you enable "Copy Out 1 to 2" in the I/O menu and turn cab sims off globally you could play factory presets through Out 2. Just remember you wouldn't have cab sims at Out 1 during that time.
 
Bakerman said:
If you enable "Copy Out 1 to 2" in the I/O menu and turn cab sims off globally you could play factory presets through Out 2. Just remember you wouldn't have cab sims at Out 1 during that time.
Click to expand...

Good idea. Thanks for the help, guys.
 
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