Line6 Helix Stadium

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jdasader said:
"feel" is a real thing, and I play better when I connect with my rig
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Feel is definitely not a real thing, in the sense that most signal chains will "feel" more or less the same. I can do the same palm mutes, harmonics, fast passages, hard vs softer rhythm guitars whether I play via small SS amp, tube amps or a modeller, given the same means of monitoring. I m pretty sure in a blind test you ll be also able to play through all these means just fine. It might not sound exactly the same but it ll be super close and you ll be able to do your thing with no issues
 
mehegama said:
Feel is definitely not a real thing, in the sense that most signal chains will "feel" more or less the same. I can do the same palm mutes, harmonics, fast passages, hard vs softer rhythm guitars whether I play via small SS amp, tube amps or a modeller, given the same means of monitoring. I m pretty sure in a blind test you ll be also able to play through all these means just fine. It might not sound exactly the same but it ll be super close and you ll be able to do your thing with no issues
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I respectfully disagree… it’s not easy to articulate but there’s a tactile responsiveness and dynamic feedback from a good amp (modeled or real) especially in how it reacts to touch, pick attack, and playing dynamics, that fundamentally enhances the playing experience. It’s something you “feel” through your fingers, making phrasing and expression more natural and easier
 
Rublalup said:
I respectfully disagree… it’s not easy to articulate but there’s a tactile responsiveness and dynamic feedback from a good amp (modeled or real) especially in how it reacts to touch, pick attack, and playing dynamics, that fundamentally enhances the playing experience. It’s something you “feel” through your fingers, making phrasing and expression more natural and easier
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I ve never had that issue. And what you describe, even if it affects your playing, it cannot be meaningful enough to make a difference. Other stuff like the pickups or the guitar itself will affect things much more dramatically than the choice of modeller.
 
jdasader said:
That said, "feel" is a real thing, and I play better when I connect with my rig.
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💯 - yup - 100% a real thing - I am by no means a great player, but I know when one thing feels different than another, and I absolutely have some patches / gear that feel "right", and some that don't. With the ones that feel right, there is a significant difference in my fluidity, accuracy ... The #1 reason I've sold off gear over the years, whether guitars, amps, pedals, Mfx ...: Couldn't get a good feel out of it. Had I not been persistent, and found gear that feels right, I'dv quit guitar a long time ago as one of my main hobbies - its that much of a factor for me.

100% meaningful and real - no doubt whatsoever. Can I put up with shitty feeling gear? - guess I could, but why would I want to if something else feels better and sounds just as good.

That said, sometimes getting good feel out of a piece of gear (or preventing a piece of gear from disrupting the feel of a signal chain) requires some persistent experimentation with config, settings, and routings. Very often, it's not great, stock, just out of the box.
 
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mehegama said:
Feel is definitely not a real thing, in the sense that most signal chains will "feel" more or less the same. I can do the same palm mutes, harmonics, fast passages, hard vs softer rhythm guitars whether I play via small SS amp, tube amps or a modeller, given the same means of monitoring. I m pretty sure in a blind test you ll be also able to play through all these means just fine. It might not sound exactly the same but it ll be super close and you ll be able to do your thing with no issues
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It's as real as anything else. I noticed right away how much more connected I was to the fractal sound compared to helix floor. Helix floor is great but you notice a big difference in how you interact with fractal compared to helix or my boss vg-800 etc. You definitely hear it of course but you can feel the dynamics or something differently, just as different as someone changing out a pickup in a guitar, or pots or even strings and even tubes in a tube amp etc.
 
I've never really figured out what makes for good feel for me. I used to think it was all about latency, until I came across the odd signal chain instance with terrible latency, but which felt really good - something else is at play - wish I knew exactly what.
 
mehegama said:
Feel is definitely not a real thing, in the sense that most signal chains will "feel" more or less the same. I can do the same palm mutes, harmonics, fast passages, hard vs softer rhythm guitars whether I play via small SS amp, tube amps or a modeller, given the same means of monitoring. I m pretty sure in a blind test you ll be also able to play through all these means just fine. It might not sound exactly the same but it ll be super close and you ll be able to do your thing with no issues
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Wrong.

I always question people who say this, because I wonder if they even play. The dynamic interaction you have with your amp is huge and can effect totally how you play. If something feels flat to play with no interaction, I get bored and turn it off.
 
sprint said:
I've never really figured out what makes for good feel for me. I used to think it was all about latency, until I came across the odd signal chain instance with terrible latency, but which felt really good - something else is at play - wish I knew exactly what.
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For me personally, it is having the appropriate amount of compression in the signal. I don't necessarily need lots of dirt, just even out those peaks so it feels similar to the unplugged guitar.
 
sprint said:
I've never really figured out what makes for good feel for me. I used to think it was all about latency, until I came across the odd signal chain instance with terrible latency, but which felt really good - something else is at play - wish I knew exactly what.
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Yeah, it is hard to explain, but you can easily tell when it is not there. To me it is the rise/fall of the sound to the pick attack. The attack envelope and the responsiveness to that. It is just not latency. It is more like how much the sound blurs together vs. an immediate attack envelope. The other side of that is the bloom of the chug, and how dynamic that rises and falls with you as you play.

I have been really into ToneX lately, and that is one of the big reasons why. It has a very immediate feel to it that is very percussive compared to Fractal. However, I know the latency between the units isn't that different.
 
To me the feel thing is like the difference between a solid state and a tube amp, which is obvious.

Cold, hard and no dynamics on most solid states but when you get the right tube amp or right modeler and you get this sag or what I like to call the "squishy noodly feel" haha aka compression I guess, then you know you got the feels!
 
BROCKSTAR said:
To me the feel thing is like the difference between a solid state and a tube amp, which is obvious.

Cold, hard and no dynamics on most solid states but when you get the right tube amp or right modeler and you get this sag or what I like to call the "squishy noodly feel" haha aka compression I guess, then you know you got the feels!
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I have played a couple of tube amps that had horrible feel to me. One was an old school Carvin. It was so off-puttingly stiff I didn't spend more than a couple of minutes with it. It was horribly immediate, like plugging directly into a console. Can't really put my finger on it. I can't live with the feel from Orange amps either.
 
Dr.Lee said:
I have played a couple of tube amps that had horrible feel to me. One was an old school Carvin. It was so off-puttingly stiff I didn't spend more than a couple of minutes with it. It was horribly immediate, like plugging directly into a console. Can't really put my finger on it. I can't live with the feel from Orange amps either.
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I am by far from a tube expert or tube amp expert but perhaps it wasn't biased correctly!
 
Silverface 135 watt ultra linear Twin Reverb is one of the stiffest and most "solid state" feeling tube amps I've ever played. Just painfully loud and kind of bland compared to something like a blackface Super or Deluxe Reverb. Those have a nice bounce to them when cranked but are not really the best choice for super tight metal rhythms. It's always a trade off. No single amp does everything well.
 
mr_fender said:
Silverface 135 watt ultra linear Twin Reverb is one of the stiffest and most "solid state" feeling tube amps I've ever played. Just painfully loud and kind of bland compared to something like a blackface Super or Deluxe Reverb. Those have a nice bounce to them when cranked but are not really the best choice for super tight metal rhythms. It's always a trade off. No single amp does everything well.
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Blackface > Silverface
 
For some models it's a subtle difference. Kind of depends on your needs too. Blackface models can sometimes have a bit more character, while silverface models can be good pedal platforms.

Silverface amps used to be a lot cheaper to buy used and fairly simple to convert to blackface specs if desired, but more people caught on and they're pricy now too like everything else.
 
mr_fender said:
Silverface 135 watt ultra linear Twin Reverb is one of the stiffest and most "solid state" feeling tube amps I've ever played. Just painfully loud and kind of bland compared to something like a blackface Super or Deluxe Reverb. Those have a nice bounce to them when cranked but are not really the best choice for super tight metal rhythms. It's always a trade off. No single amp does everything well.
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Does this carry over to their Fractal models (assuming there is a Silverface model)?
 
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