If only I can get QSC K12 to sound like my headphones ~~~

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enigma

Inspired
The overall tonal quality I get out of my headphones (bayerdynamic DT770 Pro) is far superior to what I hear out of QSC K12. Everything sounds "far" with QSC K12 - it's as if the PRESENCE is on zero. Aside from the fact that headphones obviously block ambient sound, what else could cause this sonic disparity apart from the room acoustics? In other words, how do I make the sound to push forward (should I try the 4 wire method with a tube amp?)
 
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There will be a huge variance in frequency response between the 2 systems, and the headphones are only a little over an inch away from your ear drum.
 
antcarrier said:
There will be a huge variance in frequency response between the 2 systems, and the headphones are only a little over an inch away from your ear drum.
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I was thinking about this, but I don't get the similar disparity with my tube amps. And, I'm only 3 feet away from the QSC. How do I tweak to get the tone to sound like it's pushing air?
 
how loud are you? it takes a bit to push amps, and that amp is rated for 1000 watts, ready to get very loud.

also is the tweeter facing your ear directly?
 
I'm not sure what you mean by 'pushing air'. Do the headphones succeed in doing this, where the K12 does not? Headphones aren't usually associated with an ability to push air, so we may be thinking about different things.
Also, with the tube amps, do you mean that you mic them up and play them through the QSC and you don't have this problem?
 
Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
how loud are you? it takes a bit to push amps, and that amp is rated for 1000 watts, ready to get very loud.

also is the tweeter facing your ear directly?
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I have the volume on the QSC around noon. It's 1,000 watts, but somehow it doesn't have the low end like my V30 loaded cabs.
 
antcarrier said:
I'm not sure what you mean by 'pushing air'. Do the headphones succeed in doing this, where the K12 does not? Headphones aren't usually associated with an ability to push air, so we may be thinking about different things.
Also, with the tube amps, do you mean that you mic them up and play them through the QSC and you don't have this problem?
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The tone I'm getting out of my headphones sound as if the tone is pushing air through a 2x12 at least. K12 sounds relatively thin and far as compared to the headphones. I play my Sovteck 50 w through a 2x12 recto cab.
 
the k series has massive amounts of bass. do you have the "Ext Sub" turned on? this cuts the low frequencies off completely.

how high is your axe fx volume knob?
 
Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
the k series has massive amounts of bass. do you have the "Ext Sub" turned on? this cuts the low frequencies off completely.

how high is your axe fx volume knob?
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Axe volume is at noon and Ext Sub is "on." It's less of tone, and more of a presence issue for me. Plus, apart from the "Brown" sound many presets sound like there a blanket over the speakers.
 
Ext sub means "external sub" and it engages a high pass filter so the k12 doesn't get in the way sonically of any sub-woofers. that's why you don't have any bass in the speaker. you said "but somehow it doesn't have the low end like my V30 loaded cabs" and that's why.

as for presence, do you have the High switch set to vocal boost or normal?

again, the K series was designed to have massive bass and very clear highs. i'm very surprised that both of these areas are issues.
 
Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
Ext sub means "external sub" and it engages a high pass filter so the k12 doesn't get in the way sonically of any sub-woofers. that's why you don't have any bass in the speaker. you said "but somehow it doesn't have the low end like my V30 loaded cabs" and that's why.

as for presence, do you have the High switch set to vocal boost or normal?

again, the K series was designed to have massive bass and very clear highs. i'm very surprised that both of these areas are issues.
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Don't get me wrong, I do get good bass response as is. It's more of a PRESENCE issue for me which I'm hoping would be solved if I start (to learn) to tweak the Axe to get it as close to what I'm hearing in the headphones.

The high switch is in the "normal" mode.
 
ok understood.

remember that the k12 only has a 75 degree dispersion as well, so if you don't have the tweeter directly at your ears, you might not hear it.

again, in my experience, all of the k series had clear, almost piercing highs, so hopefully something isn't wrong with your speaker.

how does music, ipods or any other thing sound through your speaker?

did you adjust many things while listening on headphones, then use the k12? have you tried any stock presets without any adjustments through the k12? is your global EQ flat?
 
Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
ok understood.

remember that the k12 only has a 75 degree dispersion as well, so if you don't have the tweeter directly at your ears, you might not hear it.

again, in my experience, all of the k series had clear, almost piercing highs, so hopefully something isn't wrong with your speaker.

how does music, ipods or any other thing sound through your speaker?

did you adjust many things while listening on headphones, then use the k12? have you tried any stock presets without any adjustments through the k12? is your global EQ flat?
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I think the problem is solved by turning the Ex Sub to "normal" and switching to "voice" from "normal." I've been playing in the Preset land all this time. Thanks!
 
be careful using the vocal boost. it may be a temporary solution, but when you create your presets with that engaged, there will be a boost in the 1khz range that will not be there if you also send your signal to the PA. so you may sound good on your k12, but you will not cut through at all in the PA system.

here's what the manual says about the Vocal Boost:

In voice-only reproduction, the switch can be set to the “VOCAL BOOST” setting. This will engage EQ that gives a stronger presence for vocal intelligibility and presence. It is generally not recommended to use this setting when playing full-range music through the system.
 
if it works for you, that's cool but just know that sending the signal out to other units will be missing that boost, and possibly sound bad.
 
Chris@KatsuKuriMedia said:
if it works for you, that's cool but just know that sending the signal out to other units will be missing that boost, and possibly sound bad.
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I see. You mean when I send it to FOH, for example? Most likely, I'll work in the FRFR environment as soon as I get up to speed with Axe-Fx settings. Thanks for your help!
 
enigma said:
The overall tonal quality I get out of my headphones (bayerdynamic DT770 Pro) is far superior to what I hear out of QSC K12. Everything sounds "far" with QSC K12 - it's as if the PRESENCE is on zero. Aside from the fact that headphones obviously block ambient sound, what else could cause this sonic disparity apart from the room acoustics? In other words, how do I make the sound to push forward (should I try the 4 wire method with a tube amp?)
Click to expand...

The problem could just be that you're way too used to the DT770's. Those headphones are far from a flat frequency response. They have a big dip in the 2kHz to 6kHz range, which makes them sound much more "present" than anything else with a flatter response. I'm not familiar with the QSC's, but I'm guessing they have a flatter response than the DT770's. .

You could try compensating with the global eq. Check out the frequency graph for the DT770's on headphone.com. Try matching it on the global eq.

You probably just need time for your ears to adjust. In my experience, once you get used to a flatter sounding speaker you realize how much better it really is. It's just a really big shock at first.
 
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