Global Templates - creating / handling of Presets easier !?

[Liquid22]

Hi everybody,

reading the forum I get the impression people would like to have the ability to copy a scene from one preset into a scene of another preset (not only me). That of cause would instantly clash as soon as different blocks are used and placed in those presets.

I think Global Templates could solve the problem:

Goal:

1. Help us users to make sure that the grid layout of a preset is exact the same. So scenes can be copied between different presets.

2. Help Axe Edit to compare the grid of a preset to another.

In fact, it’s a complicated matter, so I’m not sure, if I missed something. So you’re more than welcome to think the idea through together. Two heads are better than one.

Imagine you could create a template (just like you can already) but in addition you can tell Axe Edit: “Put this template in i.e. slot 1 of Global Templates”. With that Axe Edit knows how the Global Template in Slot 1 exactly is build (where on the grid is what block positioned).

Let’s say you create another preset using “Global Template Slot 1”. That a preset is build and connected to that GT Slot 1 is somewhere shown in Axe Edit window. And as long as you don’t change blocks or their position on the grid you’re in that Global Template slot. If you make changes Axe Edit warns you from unintended leaving the Template slot.

Suppose you changed nothing in the grid layout: Now you and Axe Edit know that you can copy a specific scene from all presets that are in “Global Template Slot 1”. For that you just need a additional entry in the drop down menu of “Scenes” saying i.e. “Copy scene to Global-Template-Clipboard”

Let’s assume you change now to another Preset built on Global-Temlplate Slot 1. You only select in the Scene drop down menu “paste Global-Template-Clipboard on Scene 1…8”.

Axe Edit has to check only if the Global Template Slot matches. That’s it. Scenes can now be copied.

Now one might say: “So far so good, but there’s still the problem of channels that might clash"
Like: Copied scene uses i.e. Amp channel B but you want to past it on channel C becaus B is already used. (Please, think that through by yourself. I don’t want to explain that right here.)

To avoid channel clashing we would i.e. need a pop-up window asking to which channel you want to paste.
Or in general and in case some hasn’t checked before copying which channel to overwrite, there could be a Temp-Channel, where you can “park” a channel information temporarily until switching the preset. After pasting the scene you go to a block's Channel drop down menu where you can pick: “Copy Temp-Channel to Channel A…D”.

Summary:
Sure in our mind we might dream of a simpler solution. But als long as the Axe operates online with Axe Edit things will not be like we’re used to with other computer apps. For that I think the Global Template Idea could help to combine and generate presets on our units.

And of course, you have to say: putting a preset “into” such a Global Template Slot will limit your possibilities and flexibility, but in most cases, people anyway stick to their own few familiar grid layouts. But such a layout can be saved as Global Template. And at the end you always can make exceptions with separated presets. Then you simple can’t copy scenes. Just like now.

 

[chris]

Honest question: is it that difficult to recreate a Scene? It’s just on/off and channel selection right?

Once all the blocks are the same among presets, isn’t that already easier to manage a Scene? Just turn things on/off as desired.

Or are you wanting the “Scene copy” to also copy the parameters within blocks?

The proposed idea - though appreciated - seems very complex. I thought the “copy Scene from preset to preset” was mostly desired to merge Presets? That to me sounds like copying block data/parameters.

Scenes only determine block on/off and channel (and a few other minor things). I’m still not sure how a block template would help. Are you actually trying to copy/paste channel data and not Scenes?

 

[Liquid22]

Honest question: is it that difficult to recreate a Scene? It’s just on/off and channel selection right?

Once all the blocks are the same among presets, isn’t that already easier to manage a Scene? Just turn things on/off as desired.

Or are you wanting the “Scene copy” to also copy the parameters within blocks?

The proposed idea - though appreciated - seems very complex. I thought the “copy Scene from preset to preset” was mostly desired to merge Presets? That to me sounds like copying block data/parameters.

Scenes only determine block on/off and channel (and a few other minor things). I’m still not sure how a block template would help. Are you actually trying to copy/paste channel data and not Scenes?

Yes mostly it's about coping the exact parameters, but not only from one block. It's about the combination of blocks together and all their parameters. The channel thing in this effort is more a challenge you have to cope with along the way. Only for on/off-statuses of blocks the whole thing won't be worth it. But imagine you really spent a lot of time for tweaking all blocks for the perfect sound of one scene and then you could copy it to another preset.

I never would have come up with this in Axe II times. I think since Axe III scenes became more something like a preset in a preset. [remember Cliff augmented in that direction while asked why the Axe III “only” has 512 Presets.] Because of that it would be so helpful to copy/paste a individual scene between presets.

 

[chris]

Yes mostly it's about coping the exact parameters, but not only from one block. It's about the combination of blocks together and all their parameters. The channel thing in this effort is more a challenge you have to cope with along the way. Only for on/off-statuses of blocks the whole thing won't be worth it. But imagine you really spent a lot of time for tweaking all blocks for the perfect sound of one scene and then you could copy it to another preset.

I never would have come up with this in Axe II times. I think since Axe III scenes became more something like a preset in a preset. [remember Cliff augmented in that direction while asked why the Axe III “only” has 512 Presets.] Because of that it would be so helpful to copy/paste a individual scene between presets.

In a sense, this whole idea redifines the word “Scene” then.

As is, Scene does just mean on/off and Channel #.

Your idea (and others’) redefines Scene to mean all block data regardless of Channel #. You want to copy all current block settings and paste it to any available channels in another set of blocks.

So that’s something to consider in this discussion. It’s very different that the current implementation. But I think that helps understand the wish better.

You want block data copied, not “Scenes” as currently defined.

 

[Liquid22]

In a sense, this whole idea redifines the word “Scene” then.

As is, Scene does just mean on/off and Channel #.

Your idea (and others’) redefines Scene to mean all block data regardless of Channel #. You want to copy all current block settings and paste it to any available channels in another set of blocks.

So that’s something to consider in this discussion. It’s very different that the current implementation. But I think that helps understand the wish better.

You want block data copied, not “Scenes” as currently defined.

That my friend might be.
If the hardware changes, maybe some older meanings should change too. I don't what to say it should in this case, but just in general.

Honestly, haven’t things changed a lot since “scene” were introduced the first time? In those days, who thought in future a single preset could include so many different settings like today?

Let’s face it. You can easily make a preset in Axe III to a set of multiple highly different Sounds (you could before but now it’s so easy and inviting). I suppose that was Cliffs intension.

I don't have to stick to older meanings or names, when the described thing has already made a progress.

Call it scenes, channels, presets, Song-Sets or Pr-Preset-set or something else. Names are not the point for me or what they stood for. But finding a way to make handling your 512 sounds easier and more flexible, that it is.

For me Global Template would do that. Not in the simplest way but it will do under given circumstances. I felt it will help us to talk about ANY Idea for coping with multiple blocks at once in a more convenient way (at least those blocks which you like to keep, copy and use often together in combination)

So any better or complemental idea is welcome to me.